M6 [Official] BMW M6 Gran Coupe

[LaArtist]

^2nd that..this and the Z8 and the Original 6er..and the E38 7er..oh and the 507..

Guess there has been more than a few

Edit: E46 M3, E39 M5 and the 3.0 CSI

I think i covered them all now..

 

[Tumbo]

^2nd that..this and the Z8 and the Original 6er..and the E38 7er..oh and the 507..

Guess there has been more than a few

Edit: E46 M3, E39 M5 and the 3.0 CSI

I think i covered them all now..

To me:

1. this (M6 GC)
2. E46 M3
3. 850
4. 635 CSI
5. E39 M5

 

[Zafiro]

Here you go Marcus

Pricing starts at $113,000 ($3800 more than the M6 coupe and $2500 less than the M6 convertible).

 

[Merc1]

Here you go Marcus

Pricing starts at $113,000 ($3800 more than the M6 coupe and $2500 less than the M6 convertible).

That's right where I thought it would be, in between the coupe and the convertible.

M

 

[K-A]

On the Bimmer forums guys are saying that lots are filled with unspoken for M6 and M5's right now.

I think ///M really screwed the pooch for themselves in terms of generating enough demand for their asking price, by going with more "generic motor" routes, i.e V8's and Turbo's. Also, the chassis' under these cars are so fabulously luxuriously oriented that people who want some raw red blooded sportiness can't find it through all the coddling.

Mix that with the M Sport F10/F12-F13's looking so damn good with the M Sport Packages, not to mention "M Performance Parts" being so readily available, and being Turbocharged to where you can squeeze out gobs of power with cheap-ish tunes, and how the M6 & M5's are so exaggeratedly expensive at least when optioned out, you have less reason to go "true M" nowadays.

That said, this is still the ideal BMW, IMO. Though, the M6 Coupe is just ridiculously sexy, even more-so I think.

 

[LaArtist]

^People who think a M sport package or ECU / turbo boosted ordinary bmw is on par with a Real M car are my favorite kind of people

 

[K-A]

^People who think a M sport package or ECU / turbo boosted ordinary bmw is on par with a Real M car are my favorite kind of people

I don't think anyone in their right mind would say "on par with". But saying you got a 550i M Sport, or even 535i M Sport, got an aggressive Dinan Tune (backed under Warranty), already have about 8 "M" badges all over your car, have an aesthetic look that is extremely familiar to the true-M, and maybe get some "M Performance Parts" for good measure (exhaust, maybe another M badge if you're feeling frisky, etc.), you might have incentive to throw some extra cash in the bank and pass on the M5/M6.

Me, personally, if it's even within $15K range from the M5, I'd go M5. I think if anyone actually options out a new M, they'd find that considering you don't need to tick many if any options at all, they're not THAAAT expensive. If anything, they show just how expensive a optioned out regular 550i/650i is.

The E60 M5 had a lot of quirks, and a quirky motor that is risky in the long term, but I think ironically enough that's what made it so special during it's time. It had a motor directly related to F1 cars. Love it or hate it, the powertrain was full blown exotic.

 

[Giannis]

I don't think anyone in their right mind would say "on par with". But saying you got a 550i M Sport, or even 535i M Sport, got an aggressive Dinan Tune (backed under Warranty), already have about 8 "M" badges all over your car, have an aesthetic look that is extremely familiar to the true-M, and maybe get some "M Performance Parts" for good measure (exhaust, maybe another M badge if you're feeling frisky, etc.), you might have incentive to throw some extra cash in the bank and pass on the M5/M6.

I can understand, not going bananas for a bespoke M engine, when you can get nearly as much horsepower with a mild tuning.

Yet, a proper M car (let's not lower our level by bringing the X-Ms into the discussion) is not only about the engine itself. It's a much more wide experience. For instance, the F10M has the engine sitting lower, for a lower CoG. Also the rear subframe is bolt on the frame without bushings. Details like this, make a significant difference!

Not being able to appreciate the difference in steering accuracy between normal front suspension bushings and M bushings, is a totally different issue...

 

[LaArtist]

I can understand, not going bananas for a bespoke M engine, when you can get nearly as much horsepower with a mild tuning.

Yet, a proper M car (let's not lower our level by bringing the X-Ms into the discussion) is not only about the engine itself. It's a much more wide experience. For instance, the F10M has the engine sitting lower, for a lower CoG. Also the rear subframe is bolt on the frame without bushings. Details like this, make a significant difference!

Not being able to appreciate the difference in steering accuracy between normal front suspension bushings and M bushings, is a totally different issue...

This!

 

[K-A]

I can understand, not going bananas for a bespoke M engine, when you can get nearly as much horsepower with a mild tuning.

Yet, a proper M car (let's not lower our level by bringing the X-Ms into the discussion) is not only about the engine itself. It's a much more wide experience. For instance, the F10M has the engine sitting lower, for a lower CoG. Also the rear subframe is bolt on the frame without bushings. Details like this, make a significant difference!

Not being able to appreciate the difference in steering accuracy between normal front suspension bushings and M bushings, is a totally different issue...

No argument there.

I'm just saying this, because on the F10's boards right now there's a discussion where a guy who has a 535i just posted a review of an F10. It was brought up how one dealer has 17 M5's collecting dust, others were commenting on an overflow of unsold M5 stock at their Dealers as well. What's interesting about that is that it's happening while F10's themselves fly off the lots.

It made me think of "why?", and those are the reasons I think. Yes, there's some awesome engineering put into the M5 that we can't see nor is very marketable (nor can the average driver ever really appreciate in normal courses of realistic driving) and I think that's another reason why people are considering the boosted F10 alternatives perhaps viable enough to save some extra cash. A "V10", or 8K revving I6 is very marketable and self-satisfying, while a "very very high HP Turbo V8" can be said about a 550i nowadays as well.

Those who want the best engineered F10 in the world have one place to look: The M5. I'm so shocked at how unreal my 535i feels as a total car, I can imagine the M5 with that extra care and attention and fire thrown into it might my choice for "if you can only drive one car for the rest of your life, what would it be?".

Actually, that's a good title for a thread....

 

[Giannis]

No argument there.

I'm just saying this, because on the F10's boards right now there's a discussion where a guy who has a 535i just posted a review of an F10. It was brought up how one dealer has 17 M5's collecting dust, others were commenting on an overflow of unsold M5 stock at their Dealers as well. What's interesting about that is that it's happening while F10's themselves fly off the lots.

It made me think of "why?", and those are the reasons I think. Yes, there's some awesome engineering put into the M5 that we can't see nor is very marketable (nor can the average driver ever really appreciate in normal courses of realistic driving) and I think that's another reason why people are considering the boosted F10 alternatives perhaps viable enough to save some extra cash. A "V10", or 8K revving I6 is very marketable and self-satisfying, while a "very very high HP Turbo V8" can be said about a 550i nowadays as well.

On the other hand, when the E60 M5 was around, or the E9x M3, or even the E46 M3, people had many reasons to buy an M car, the most important being the great engine. You could buy a regular E46, for example, and replace the stock bushings, springs and shock absorbers for those that came with the M3, and have a great driver's car. But it still wouldn't rev over 8000rpm.

Now with this new generation of M engines, the magic of the high reving is lost. You can still get shitloads of power with a tuned non-M engine and you can still adopt some of details that are executed differently in the F10M. Yet, you still can't change some things, as I am under the impression that it's not that easy to place the engine lower in a non M F10, as you need to change other things (like the gearbox) as well. But you still can do many things.

I guess those that don't spend the extra 10 or 15 thousand $ for a M5, don't think it's special enough. It's a fair point.

 

[Sunny]

I can understand, not going bananas for a bespoke M engine, when you can get nearly as much horsepower with a mild tuning.

Yet, a proper M car (let's not lower our level by bringing the X-Ms into the discussion) is not only about the engine itself. It's a much more wide experience. For instance, the F10M has the engine sitting lower, for a lower CoG. Also the rear subframe is bolt on the frame without bushings. Details like this, make a significant difference!

Not being able to appreciate the difference in steering accuracy between normal front suspension bushings and M bushings, is a totally different issue...

Not to mention M5 actually has hydraulic steering vs the electric one in the normal one. Or the clever LSD. And no tuned N63 is ever going to have the characteristic of S63Tu with it's cross bank exhaust manifold and double VANOS. The differences are many, in fact if you break it down, I wouldn't be surprised if a E39 540i is more similar to E39 M5 than F10 550i is to F10 M5. Yea E60 M5 was a more different beast but that was an exception that the rule in the history of M5s.

 

[Zafiro]

DSG gearbox, only for M versions..

 

[Betty Swollocks]

I suspect the majority of people who have bought M3's and M5's and M6's in the past don't go into detail about the cars as people on forums do. We are quite unique and certainly not a reflective cross-section of the car buying public. Whether the M5 drives significantly different to the 550i is neither here nor there. All the average customer will see is that it now has the "same" engine as the 550i (V8 twin-turbo) rather than a bespoke, NA, V10.

I've read numerous times on other forums that previous buyers of the M3 will not be interested in an M3 with a twin-turbo I6.

Whether or not it's true that BMW M products are individual cars in the way they drive, the way they look (a slightly different M Sport package), and the way they appear on paper (filling a gap in the product line), the vast majority of the buying public don't see it that way.

The number of amazing deals on M5's and M6's to be had in the UK also suggests this.

 

[Zafiro]

The number of amazing deals on M5's and M6's to be had in the UK also suggests this.

To me it sounds like BMW have difficulties to sell performance cars and I dont think its the car fault. The economics worldwide pretty much sucks these days and you can probably get a good deal whatever performance car you want to buy (of course some exclusive brands might be excluded from this).
You also told me there are good deals for M135i as well. What is your explantion for this?

On a sidenote, I spoke to a MB dealer last month about the new A-class and he almost immediately after we started to talk, he wanted to give me a nice discount on a A250 Sport. Althought A250 is a cheap car from the start, MB have troubles selling them here in Sweden.

 

[Levi68]

I can understand, not going bananas for a bespoke M engine, when you can get nearly as much horsepower with a mild tuning.

Yet, a proper M car (let's not lower our level by bringing the X-Ms into the discussion) is not only about the engine itself. It's a much more wide experience. For instance, the F10M has the engine sitting lower, for a lower CoG. Also the rear subframe is bolt on the frame without bushings. Details like this, make a significant difference!

Not being able to appreciate the difference in steering accuracy between normal front suspension bushings and M bushings, is a totally different issue...

I'm not aware of that.


Of course an M defferienciates from an non M, but maybe not that much as before, like say BMW 330i E46 and BMW M3 E46. There was no discussion, the M3 the best E46. With the 335i E9X and M3 E9X, there were/are discussion about which is better, mostly because of different personal engine preferences. Concerning the 335i F30 and M3 F80, I think, or highly hope, the differences will be drastic, especially if the M3 will really weight that less than an F30. F80 will just be superior to the F30 in every single way, without losing in comfort. And unlike 550i vs. M6, I really think the extra price will be worth it to the last penny, thus I'm expecting a base price increase over the current M3.

 

[Betty Swollocks]

You also told me there are good deals for M135i as well. What is your explantion for this?

Because it looks like a bulldog licking the piss off a nettle?

 

[chonkoa]

You also told me there are good deals for M135i as well. What is your explantion for this?
.

I think it may be the same reason with the M5/M6. The engine is not unique(bespoke), I believe it shares the same engine with the 135i.
Just my opinion based on discussions with other petrol heads.

 

[Sunny]

To me it sounds like BMW have difficulties to sell performance cars

It is not just BMW, it is everyone (at least where I am). I just got month end email from the local Porsche dealer - $60,000 off a Panamera Turbo (unregistered car with ~1000 miles) - yes 60,000 off and no I did not get zeros wrong. 2 x Panamera GTS with $15000 off. Couple of 991 Cabs with $20000 off and $6000 off new Boxster S.

Here is the full list, it is the Porsche of Fremont in CA, if anyone is interested -

2011 Porsche Panamera Turbo
#4533
$60,000 OFF MSRP!

2012 Carrera S Cab
#4493
$20,000 OFF MSRP!

2012 Carrera Coupe
#4530
$20,000 OFF MSRP!

2012 Carrera Cab
#4508
$20,000 OFF MSRP!

2012 Panamera GTS
#4542
$15,000 OFF MSRP!

2012 Panamera GTS
#4528
$15,000 OFF MSRP!

2012 Panamera
#4531
$13,000 OFF MSRP!

2013 Boxster S
#4474
$6,000 OFF MSRP!

2013 Boxster
#4475
$5,000 OFF MSRP!

 

[Human]

And the depreciation on an M-car, ask me!

Lesson-in-time: If you can't write a cheque for an M-car, leave it be! You don't finance/lease it, you just don't. Luckily I think that I may be lucky to get an executive (BMW SA) staff demo 640i trade-in on my X6m in April 2013, but as they say:" Don't count your chickens before they have hatched" Repayment is fine but when trade time comes your short.