M3/M4 BMW M3 Spy pics 400hp V8!

[Porsche Guy]

I think that the Z06 seem to be a great car for the ones who can't afford a 911 Turbo, M6 or what ever. It seem to offer power and performance at a "affordable" price. It will be a success in America but I doubt that the Europeans will like it. American sport cars tend to not do so well here in Europe. It is a good car but I wouldn't go as far as calling it a Porsche killer, the car doesn't handle as good as a 911.

What makes you think people will buy a 911 Turbos or M6 instead of a Z06? A 911 Turbo is AWD and turbo charged. An M6 isn't nearly as fast as a Z06. It's more of luxury sports GT, a really fast one at that. Basically, I think the Z06 fits into the whole performance car group rather well, and it's amazing price only makes every other car seem overpriced.

Matt is bomb, I really want to know what are you basing the following statement on? "the reason the corvette Zo6 is faster is solely because of weight, not better engineering." It just sounds like brand bias to me, nothing else.

Porsche guy, do you think Z06 is a better car than Porsche?

That is kind of a broad question. To give it some direction I'm going to assume you're talking about the 911. I know this is kind of weird but I view them as the same car on different ends of the spectrum. The 911 is a wonderful sports car but it's also extremely refined and elegant. The Z06 on the other hand is not nearly as refined but it trades refinement for raw performance. It will destroy a 911 in just about any performance test. It all depends what you're looking for. How do you want to get around town or the track? Also you need to take price into account. The fully loaded Z06 is sooo much cheaper than a just the base 911 and who buys a bare 911? I've driven a 911, my dad has a 996 C4S which is actually about to be replaced by an M5 (hell yeah!), and it's an amazing car. If I didn't have to pay for the car I would take a 911 because I'm not the track type. If I was into the track though, I would definitely take the Z06.

 

[Zafiro]

Well Just_Me, if this thread is off-topic than why are you posting off topic posts in it?

I just said its off-topic, nothing else so dont give me that crazyicon

 

[Centurion]

Unfortunately there are people who would consider buying a Z06 instead of a 911 Turbo. The 911 is a dream car for many people but since it is extremly expensive to own and buy many people are willing to buy a cheaper car i it offers nearly as good performance. The Z06 is a great car which has stired thing up in the segment and for it's price $65k the car offers performance which are only availible in much more expensive cars. It will be interesting to see how the car stands up against a Porsche with similar power. Any how the car is a bargin.

 

[Centurion]

I just said its off-topic, nothing else so dont give me that crazyicon

I posted that icon because I find it wierd when someone post OT-posts and then say that thread is OT. That is like growing garbage on the floor and then saying that the floor messy.

 

[Porsche Guy]

Unfortunately there are people who would consider buying a Z06 instead of a 911 Turbo.

Huh? Unfortunatley? I'm not so sure about that one. And yes, the Z06 and 911 Turbo should have similar power outputs but the Z06 is going to be almost 400lbs lighter assuming the 997 Turbo is as similar to the 996 Turbo model as many have suggested. The 996 Turbo has a curb weight of 3,505 lbs!!!

 

[Deutsch]

Well, that's great that you think it's trash. I'm not sure why. Could it be its extensive use of carbon fiber, magnesium or aluminum? Or perhaps it's its 470lb feet of torque and 505hp? Maybe you don't like the fact that it does 0-60 in 3.7 seconds or its mid 11 second quarter mile? Maybe it's the 7:42 lap time, which is faster than everything aside from a Carrera GT. Is it the fact that nothing within 350k can really match it in terms of performance? Yeah, I guess all that makes it trash. If you can't get past the fact that it's an American car, and not German, then I'm severely disappointed in you. Why can't you acknowledge its amazing performance and extensive use of exotic materials at an amazingly low price. The M5 and Z06 don't compete so is that what you're getting at when you say they don't belong in the same sentece? The M5 is a sports sedan and the Z06 is high performance coupe.

BTW, if you don't like it because it's engine is 7.0 liters and only produces 505hp or roughly 72hp/liter, that's stupid. HP/liter is the dumbest quality to judge an engine on. HP is just a measure of power, change HP to KW and nothing with the exception of maybe an F1 car produces 100kw/liter. Things to look for in an engine. Torque per liter, as HP is merely the following function: HP = Torque * RPM/5,252. So are you can see, if you engine spins high enough, you will definitely attain 100hp/liter. The only problem with this is that you may have to rev your engine really high to get this power, evident in how the M5 revs to 8200rpm. Corvette redlines at 7000rpm, which makes quite a differences. Yes, achieveing 100 hp/liter in a production car isn't the easiest thing, but it's definitely an overrated means by which to measure an engine. The problem with designing a high revving engine is that it's extremely heavy as the components have to withstand the extreme loads of high revs. What you should be more interested in when looking at an ending to determine if it's really good? Weight, as we all know that a lighter car gives better performance in every aspect. Size, as a smaller engine allows you to put it lower and/or farther back/ahead in the chassis for better weight distribution and center of gravity. Efficiency, the amount of fuel the engine consume to produce this power. All of these are way more important than HP/liter. If you don't believe me, ask anyone who designs performance engines. And this does not mean that the V10 in the M5/M6 is bad but too often people are blinded by HP/liter numbers.

Thanks for the long explanation on why you think the Z06 is great. The fact that I don't like it, I'm afraid, will never change.

 

[Alx]

Lets move on too the NEW M3 Spy Pics and such...

There is a Z06 thread in the off-topic section and feel free to start a thread in the Vs. section.

 

[Alx]

Does this look like a M3 spy pic?

 

[Ahmed]

This looks right or what....

What?? I dont get it.

 

[Alx]

i found a pic on some site of the M3 spy photo and posted it, does it look right or not?

Here's the URL- http://www.jalopnik.com/cars/images/bmw_m3_spy.jpg

 

[Ahmed]

i found a pic on some site of the M3 spy photo and posted it, does it look right or not?

Here's the URL- http://www.jalopnik.com/cars/images/bmw_m3_spy.jpg

Ya I saw the pic but I dont get you, you mean the flares?

 

[Zafiro]

Unfortunately there are people who would consider buying a Z06 instead of a 911 Turbo. The 911 is a dream car for many people but since it is extremly expensive to own and buy many people are willing to buy a cheaper car i it offers nearly as good performance. The Z06 is a great car which has stired thing up in the segment and for it's price $65k the car offers performance which are only availible in much more expensive cars. It will be interesting to see how the car stands up against a Porsche with similar power. Any how the car is a bargin.

I've read two different carmags where they test C6 against 911. Both said if money isnt an issue, Porsche is the best car.

 

[Zafiro]

I posted that icon because I find it wierd when someone post OT-posts and then say that thread is OT. That is like growing garbage on the floor and then saying that the floor messy.

It crossed my mind so I stated it was off-topic. I didnt say I was more on-topic than you guys.
Nothing wrong with that and if the mods agree, they will let us know.
Just forget about it and move on.

 

[Matt]

Matt is bomb, I really want to know what are you basing the following statement on? "the reason the corvette Zo6 is faster is solely because of weight, not better engineering." It just sounds like brand bias to me, nothing else.

Well, I think the M5 and M6 are much better engineered for a few reasons. First of all, it isnt as difficult to make a really light car fast than to make a really heavy car fast with less displacement and no forced induction. The ZO6 is built for only one purpose, going fast. Its a huge engine in a small car with archaic suspension and light weight materials. "A plastic wedge" with a G-meter (according to Top Gear). Ask yourself some questions. What ground breaking technology came out of building the ZO6? What can this car do besides "go fast"? Does this car check its own oil?, how about blue tooth?, Sat Nav?, A trunk?, are there any nice materials at all?. Then see what I mean about better engineering.

P.S. I wouldnt be so sure about that E63 seven speed. AMG just cant keep up with the M devision. Why would they make a gear box with 5 ratios for years and years and all of the sudden change it to seven. Well I dont think its coincidence that it came right after BMW's M5 came out. Besides Mercedes Benz's dont handle very well. The E39 M5 was still a better track car than the E55 even though it was much older.

 

[Zafiro]

Why would they make a gear box with 5 ratios for years and years and all of the sudden change it to seven.

MB didnt have a gearbox that was able to handle 700Nm, thats the reason.
If the new E63 dont beat the M5 in straightline, then I consider it as a failure from MB.

 

[Matt]

I posted that icon because I find it wierd when someone post OT-posts and then say that thread is OT. That is like growing garbage on the floor and then saying that the floor messy.

Dude, y r u going on a tangent about this. Mr. I hate people who post off topic off topics. You make me want to slam my head into a wall, like this guy: lol. So chill about it.

 

[Matt]

MB didnt have a gearbox that was able to handle 700Nm, thats the reason.
If the new E63 dont beat the M5 in straightline, then I consider it as a failure from MB.

Yea I know. THat question was more retorical than anything. I was hinting that they copied the M devision like usual.

 

[Centurion]

Dude, y r u going on a tangent about this. Mr. I hate people who post off topic off topics. You make me want to slam my head into a wall, like this guy: lol. So chill about it.

Umm....and your problem is.....? I was just aksing just_me a question about his post and I see nothing wrong with that. And you bursting out on me like this, WTF ??. I'm not even going to say anything more because it is obvious that you are the one that needs to chill.

 

[LaArtist]

Yes!!!
The first fight of GCF.. me so happy i almost wanna cry.. let me grab some popcorns and a drink..j/k--haha

 

[Matt]

Umm....and your problem is.....? I was just aksing just_me a question about his post and I see nothing wrong with that. And you bursting out on me like this, WTF ??. I'm not even going to say anything more because it is obvious that you are the one that needs to chill.

Do you just say things to get a bigger post number lol? No need for vulgarity buddy.