Hot! MB, BMW, VW, Audi & Porsche cartel exposed - report

[EnI]

When your lawyer advises you to stay silent that's an indication of you possibly incriminating yourself if saying anything. Busted!

Mind BMW have only denied (orchestrated) diesel exhaust manipulation but saying no word on cartel in general.

Btw, die Welt reported it all had started in Porsche's R&D facility in Weissach in 1995 when Top 5 opened the "Exhaust system research center", denying Opel & Ford their participation in the project.

Even more: the project got state subsidies from Baden Württemberg state, and the German antitrust authorities (after Opel had filed a complaint) gave green light to the project - for a period of 3 years, with a possibility of renewing the permission every 3 years.

 

[Deleted member 1071]

A highly complex political issue in which regulation-bending (and violating) corporations find themselves at loggerheads with self-proclaimed moral apostles ("Gutmenschen" is an oh-so-fitting German-term for a phenomenon so typical in modern Germany) in a tug-of-war involving the excruciatingly politically correct and an often highly devious corporate elite. Including many participants in between. Employees and consumers ultimately bear the brunt.

 

[martinbo]

When your lawyer advises you to stay silent that's an indication of you possibly incriminating yourself if saying anything. Busted!

It doesn't necessarily have to mean that. If there's one I've learned in my own business over the last decade: say only what you need to say when it needs to be said and nothing more.

Mind BMW have only denied (orchestrated) diesel exhaust manipulation but saying no word on cartel in general.

One man's cartel is another's mutual cooperative.

 

[Mick Briesgau]

A highly complex political issue in which regulation-bending (and violating) corporations find themselves at loggerheads with self-proclaimed moral apostles ("Gutmenschen" is an oh-so-fitting German-term for a phenomenon so typical in modern Germany) in a tug-of-war involving the excruciatingly politically correct and an often highly devious corporate elite. Including many participants in between. Employees and consumers ultimately bear the brunt.

True Jimmy. Personally I find these "Gutmenschen" zum Kotzen.

 

[Busty]

^"Gutmenschen" can be "zum Kotzen" ... agreed. The opposite side (corporate establishment and their lobbies etc.), however, often is as well. This cartel rigmarole is not only a legal and political issue, imo, but also has ethical aspects that must be allowed to be pointed to without running the risk of being called a "Gutmensch".

 

[Matski]

He actually addresses why he doesn't answer it directly in this statement:

I think it's a pragmatic - though, to some, evasive - response.

I'm very sure he knows enough to alleviate a lot of speculation. I'm suspicious he doesn't.

 

[EnI]

BMW Halts Project Talks After Daimler Blew Whistle: Sueddeutsche


By REUTERS
JULY 25, 2017, 3:03 P.M. E.D.T.


BERLIN — BMW has suspended talks with Daimler on future cooperation projects after its rival disclosed alleged collusion among German carmakers to cartel authorities, Sueddeutsche Zeitung reported on Tuesday, citing industry sources.

BMW's top management plans to critically question future cooperation with Daimler on joint purchasing of auto parts and efforts to develop charging stations for electric cars, the daily newspaper said.

The project to develop charging sites for zero emission cars, also involving Volkswagen and Ford's European division, is now facing delays but will be continued, Sueddeutsche Zeitung said.


Daimler's move to blow the whistle on a possible auto-industry cartel between the Stuttgart-based carmaker, VW, BMW, Audi and Porsche, alleging collusion on pricing and technologies, "has totally damaged" BMW's trust in Daimler, the newspaper cited an industry source as saying.

BMW declined comment while Daimler didn't immediately respond to requests for comment.

Though both carmakers have for years competed with VW's Audi division for the luxury sales crown, there has been media speculation that Daimler and BMW may combine their car-sharing services to better compete with U.S. rival Uber [UBER.UL]

European Union and German antitrust regulators are investigating whether BMW, VW, Porsche, Audi and Mercedes-Benz owner Daimler held meetings to discuss suppliers, prices and standards to the disadvantage of foreign carmakers.

The supervisory boards of Daimler and VW will meet on Wednesday to discuss the allegations about anti-competitive behavior among the German carmakers, sources have said.

VW supervisory board member Olaf Lies, representing the No. 2 stakeholder Lower Saxony, criticized top management for failing to inform the controlling panel about the decision to provide early evidence to antitrust authorities, regional broadcaster ffn radio reported on Tuesday.

"At the moment I cannot understand this," Lies was quoted by ffn radio as saying in an interview. "We are having this checked in a legal way whether it (prior notification) would have been necessary."

(Reporting by Andreas Cremer, Edward Taylor and Ilona Wissenbach; Editing by Adrian Croft)



...

Oh, dear ...

So, Dr. Z "knows nothing about the wrong doing" but it was obviously Daimler who blew the whistle on cooperation between 5 German carmakers.

Martin, any word from you now?

 

[Gianclaudio]

the moustache starts talking about sales

Yes, it was a complete off topic, but he's showing the strength of the company, in order to avoid the stock shares falling quickly.

 

[mini_cooper4]

"At the moment I cannot understand this," Lies was quoted by ffn radio

Damn! So fitting!

 

[Matski]

So basically, Daimler are guilty as f*** of something and were about to get non-consensually-bum-sexed by the regulators - so instead they cut a deal to "voluntarily" (shyeeeeahhh right) recall 3 million cars, and offered up the other German manufacturers to the slaughter, as a sacrifice, and as a deal sweetener† ... that's just not cricket.

† Opinion, may not be factually evident, might turn out to be totally different after the next press release... opinions herein are solely those of the cheap Polish lager I'm drinking and are potentially unfounded.

 

[Cashmere]

The timing of this news couldn't be sweeter - just a week before the Model 3 revolutionizes the car industry.

 

[Matski]

The timing of this news couldn't be sweeter - just a week before the Model 3 revolutionizes the car industry.

The Model 3.. to steal a quote from Bruce Willis... "It's not a choice, it's a lack of options", but I agree, the timing is good for Tesla.

 

[Cashmere]

"It's not a choice, it's a lack of options"

I couldn't have come up with a sweeter quote to describe our planet.

If only the German Cartel had listened to Bruce Willis.

 

[Matski]

I couldn't have come up with a sweeter quote to describe our planet.

If only the German Cartel had listened to Bruce Willis.

If Die Hard 6 features Bruce Willis retaking control of The Vierzylinder Plaza from Stuttgart based terrorists, I would most definitely go to the cinema to see it...

 

[Dauer]

If Die Hard 6 features Bruce Willis retaking control of The Vierzylinder Plaza from Stuttgart based terrorists, I would most definitely go to the cinema to see it...

I would too if they persuades Alan Rickman to star in the film

 

[Deleted member 1071]

I can only suspect that Matthias Müller and Rupert Stadler (among others) are currently finding themselves in highly caustic waters. Could Oliver Blume be an heir apparent ??
And could the ever-enigmatic Dr. Ing. Piech be somehow involved in all of this commotion ??

 

[Giannis]

I would too if they persuades Alan Rickman to star in the film

By "persuade", you mean "bring back from the dead", right?

 

[Dauer]

By "persuade", you mean "bring back from the dead", right?

Yes and Michael Kamen too

 

[Matski]

So apparently Porsche are pulling out of Le Mans/WEC LMP1. Apparently they're not happy with the regs, but I can't help but think it's an offshoot of Dieselgate, just as it was when Audi left.

 

[EnI]

So apparently Porsche are pulling out of Le Mans/WEC LMP1. Apparently they're not happy with the regs, but I can't help but think it's an offshoot of Dieselgate, just as it was when Audi left.

And MB is leaving DTM ... for Formula e. BMW Motorsport is deeply disappointed, and may leave as well. So could Audi. This may be the end of DTM.