Vs Design battle: Mercedes CL VS 6-Series Coupe. Which reigns supreme?
- Thread starter K-A
- Start date
I can't vote. They are too different. The CL has no rival, except maybe a Rolls Royce Coupé. The CL is not a GT, it is a Coupé, a Sedan with two doors and no B pillars. The 6 Series is the probably one of the most beautiful BMW's, but the 5 Series is no worse. GranCoupé is likely the best compromise, but for very high price. This thred is way wrong, becasue most talk about the car, and not desing. Both have their qualities. Looks like this thread turned into 6 Series vs. CL.
I like Gangster-Benz.
I like Gangster-Benz.
Actually, I think the 6er shares a design language with its 5-Series twin far more closely than the CL with the S. The CL and S have completely different grills, hood to fender arrangement, the CL has very curvy and voluptuous side sheetmetal with a hard crease going through it, while the S has a smooth crease. The taillights are totally different, etc. The CL has a big unique windowhouse, etc. The 6er basically takes the exact 5-Series design idiom and styling traits, and sleekens it out a lot with 2 doors.
I agree that the CLS is amazing to look at, but you wrong for saying that about the CL.
I think he was actually saying that the CLS he thinks is the new #1 of M-B's "worst designs".
H
Hofmeister
I think we'll have to agree to disagreeActually, I think the 6er shares a design language with its 5-Series twin far more closely than the CL with the S. The CL and S have completely different grills, hood to fender arrangement, the CL has very curvy and voluptuous side sheetmetal with a hard crease going through it, while the S has a smooth crease. The taillights are totally different, etc. The CL has a big unique windowhouse, etc. The 6er basically takes the exact 5-Series design idiom and styling traits, and sleekens it out a lot with 2 doors.
I think he was actually saying that the CLS he thinks is the new #1 of M-B's "worst designs".
And you still havent gotten around to around to explaining why you think the 6er is overpriced.....
I think we'll have to agree to disagree
This topic has been beaten to death so much.
I'll say this: Price is a product of the technicality of a car, and the "magic factor", i.e intangible factor, i.e MARKETING.
The CL, for example, is a renown Coupe, marketed and specified as the pinnacle of M-B brand. The 6 line just isn't "there" enough to command a price tag that gets to $100K with necessary options. Technically, there's really nothing about it superior to a 5-Series, and marketing wise, the "6 Series" name isn't that prestigious, at least not yet.... perhaps BMW's artificially inflated the price tag so much is them planting the seeds to bring it up to "that level".
Then you have the used car market. Gazing at used 2012 6-Series', I've NEVER seen such massive depreciation. This is on cars that are still within their same model year, in their debut model year, not even replaced yet by a new model year. I have a link to a 650i Vert with 12K miles that must have been about $100K when new, ASKING just $69K for it. Many 650i Vert's going in the $70's with very little mileage. We're talking depreciation of $20-$30K right off the bat.... or in other words, a 50% downpayment on a 5-Series. I think the market realizes that the 6 isn't "there yet" to hold the big price tag.
It's nothing against the car, but IMO they got overzealous with the price. It's be like them putting a $80K price on a 5-Series or E-Class, yes, great cars and they sure look and probably operate better than quite a many $80+K cars, but they're just not at that marketed position.
MAJESTIC
Quattro Commander
Me neither. It's behind the CL, where it belongs. But I must say the 6er is the best BMW design in a long time, which is not really saying alot.
The perfect CL to me would be the pre-facelift style with the LED's in the bumper replacing the outdated fog lights. IMO the only problem with the facelift CL is the front lost some distinction and elegance by way of just trying to look too "in your face", thus rendering it too close to other Benzes.
It ain't bad at all, but I think the pre-facelfit front is a bit prettier, which is what I think the CL is all about. I don't like these extensive makeovers M-B gives their cars lately. Interior upgrades aside, IMO they ruined or hurt the "sanctity" of the designs of those who they too dramatically changed, i.e CL's front, GLK's front (doesn't match the sides and back anymore at all, incoherent), and to a lesser extent, the new C's front.
It ain't bad at all, but I think the pre-facelfit front is a bit prettier, which is what I think the CL is all about. I don't like these extensive makeovers M-B gives their cars lately. Interior upgrades aside, IMO they ruined or hurt the "sanctity" of the designs of those who they too dramatically changed, i.e CL's front, GLK's front (doesn't match the sides and back anymore at all, incoherent), and to a lesser extent, the new C's front.
mod9
Bavarian Cruiser
The CL murders the 6 series! The 6 series doesn't even deserve to sit next to a CL in a poll. When they build an 8 series, then we can talk.
Just what I was thinking! The 6er is better in design compared to the CL, everything else the CL is better.
Well, as i said, they dont compete with each other, and even if 6er is just an overpriced 5 series and cl is head and shoulders above it as a car (or how somebody would describe a finest car on earth, which is streching it quite a bit imo), we compare designs and designs only.
really?^^
H
Hofmeister
So if in your opinion the 6er isnt much better than the 5er, in what way is the CL superior to the S? Apart from being less spacious, more expensive, and no better to drive? And please dont go on about how its more special than the 6. Its a coupe S, whereas its competitors are purpose-built super-GT's with more prestiguous names e.g. AM DB9, Bentley Continental GT, Ferrari FF. However in the 6er's class its common for them to be based on saloon counterparts like the Jag XK based on XF, Maserati GranTurismo, which I'm sure is heavily based on the Quatroporte. I'm not giving out about the CL, I'm sure if you wanted a super-luxurious coupe, then you couldnt do better, but to say its more "special" than the 6 is IMO very untrue. And all "necessary options" on the 6er are standard fitment. Sat-nav, leather seats, heated seats, dual-zone climate control. The only mentionable options on the 6er are aesthetic. And the CL, like ALL big coupes depreciates very heavily
http://used.mercedes-benz.co.uk/use...00-blueefficiency-manchester-for-sale-ks60bbu
^A new CL550 costs 95K and the car in question had some options fitted so thats roughly 50% depreciation in one year!
The thing is, the CL being based on the S, and a more exclusive design, makes it right there more "special" than the 6 which is based on the 5.
To me, it looks like this: S = CL, 5 = 6, i.e S VS 5, CL VS 6.
And of course all these 2 door cars based on cheaper 4-Doors are way overpriced. If logic was at play here, they should be cheaper. The E-Class for that matter then should be more expensive than the CLS, as it's a better functionality tool, more roomy, more aerodynamic design. Marketing is of course a big factor with these things.
Back to the designs, I came across this video of a CL. Really shows you how breathtaking this car is. I don't know why it took me so long to realize how truly special it is. I mean, I know why, I figured it's too expensive and I can experience something in the M-B family just as passionately that's about as nice for cheaper. The CL is really something special, though. I haven't fallen this hard for an M-B since I did a 180 degree spin on the W212.... and look where that got me (2 of them so far).
To me, it looks like this: S = CL, 5 = 6, i.e S VS 5, CL VS 6.
And of course all these 2 door cars based on cheaper 4-Doors are way overpriced. If logic was at play here, they should be cheaper. The E-Class for that matter then should be more expensive than the CLS, as it's a better functionality tool, more roomy, more aerodynamic design. Marketing is of course a big factor with these things.
Back to the designs, I came across this video of a CL. Really shows you how breathtaking this car is. I don't know why it took me so long to realize how truly special it is. I mean, I know why, I figured it's too expensive and I can experience something in the M-B family just as passionately that's about as nice for cheaper. The CL is really something special, though. I haven't fallen this hard for an M-B since I did a 180 degree spin on the W212.... and look where that got me (2 of them so far).
Gianclaudio
Aerodynamic Artisan
The people arguing the cars do not compete directly in size, price, etc missed the "design battle" words, of the title.
H
Hofmeister
The thing is, the CL being based on the S, and a more exclusive design, makes it right there more "special" than the 6 which is based on the 5.
To me, it looks like this: S = CL, 5 = 6, i.e S VS 5, CL VS 6.
And of course all these 2 door cars based on cheaper 4-Doors are way overpriced. If logic was at play here, they should be cheaper. The E-Class for that matter then should be more expensive than the CLS, as it's a better functionality tool, more roomy, more aerodynamic design. Marketing is of course a big factor with these things.
Back to the designs, I came across this video of a CL. Really shows you how breathtaking this car is. I don't know why it took me so long to realize how truly special it is. I mean, I know why, I figured it's too expensive and I can experience something in the M-B family just as passionately that's about as nice for cheaper. The CL is really something special, though. I haven't fallen this hard for an M-B since I did a 180 degree spin on the W212.... and look where that got me (2 of them so far).
I do not wish to go off the main point of aesthetics any more but I have to say that a car with a bigger price tag does not automatically make it more "special". I mean, which in your opinion is more special: An Audi A5, a good-looking, beautifully built coupe, with a fine range of engines and a slightly boring drive, or a Toyota GT86, a small, cheap, good-looking car, that offers a transcendent driving experience and has no direct competitors, built by the people that make the Corolla.
Exactly. Fact is, the 6 and CL technically are very competitive. Close enough in price, and actually very close in size too. 2-Door large barges with 4 seats yet minimal back seat use.
I completely agree that higher price doesn't make something special. However, higher price tag as artificial as it may be, creates an artificial sense of exclusivity, due solely to said higher price tag, which is exactly why the CLS and 6 Coupe are artificially more expensive than the E and 5-Series, or the CL more than the S, for that matter. The CL is more "special" than the 6 in the same way the RR Ghost is more "special" than an S-Class. Sure, they're competitive, but one is marketed much higher, and enjoys a more "special" cachet. IMO, BMW putting the price of the 6 so high is like if M-B rose the price of the S to get closer to the RR Ghost. Sure, technically, one can like a 6 more than a CL, or an S more than a Ghost, easily, but that doesn't change the market perception and "nomenclature cachet" factor of which dictate price in a big way.
Also, I think the A5 is far more special than the GT86. In this case, it's a design/feel thing and also one of cost, i.e people would not pay A5 money for a GT86.
Well, this is where it gets tricky. M-B are also artificially inflating both the cost and "cachet factor" of the "E Coupe" by marketing it as an "E" and using E styling gimmicks, when it actually is a C. IMO when you put an E Coupe next to a 6 Series, it's like when you put a 6 Series next to a CL, in terms of "specialness" and "grandeur". Also, the E Coupe is too compact/small/"cute" to be a serious player in the Prestigious-Luxo-Coupe segment of which the CL AND 6 are a part of (speaking generally). However, the E Coupe is also priced significantly less than a 6 Series, yet much higher than the C of which it's based off of.
If M-B made an E Coupe based on the E chassis, with the same dimensions as the 6-Series Coupe, with an E-worthy interior, more serious/"grand" "E" styling (instead of "cute" remnants of the C compactness) I would have pulled out my wallet, dropped my pants, and gone to town on it.
H
Hofmeister
Sorry K-A but I'm really not understanding your argument whatsoever. First of all you say the 6er is overpriced because it lacks cachet. You think it should compete with the E-Class Coupe. But thats the very reason it should not. Its called the "E-Class Coupe" and the 6er is not called the "5 Series Coupe". Compared to the 6er, the E lacks cachet! The majority of people buying the 6ER wont even know it shares much with the F10. Then you go on to say "Fact is, the 6 and CL technically are very competitive. Close enough in price" So you think the 6er and CL compete. Fine. But, (I'm not sure how these things work out in the USA) in Britain a 650i costs 67K and a CL500 costs 95K. So going by your opinion that they're competitors the 6er is an absolute bargain! It comes down to which would you rather have: 28K more (!!) in your the back pocket of your Tommy Hilfiger jeans, and knowing you own a car with slightly less cachet, or a CL. Not a tough decision IMO.
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