Hot! All kind of sales Audi / BMW / Mercedes

[Rolf]

BMW Group maintains BEV growth path in challenging market situation in 2024

++ BMW Group: Significant +13.5% sales growth in fully-electric vehicles +++ With over 2.45 million units delivered, BMW Group meets adjust-ed sales target for 2024 +++ BMW brand increases sales in selected regions, gains market shares and maintains position as global segment leader +++ Jochen Goller: “BEV growth to continue in 2025” +++

Munich. The BMW Group managed to continue its growth path in 2024, delivering a total of 426.594 fully-electric vehicles to customers and achieving BEV-sales growth of +13.5%. Both BMW and MINI brands posted double-digit BEV growth, with 368,523 (+11.6%) and 56,181 (+24.3%) fully-electric vehicles delivered to customers, respectively. The Rolls-Royce brand also recorded significant growth with 1.890 BEV vehicles delivered (+479.6%). The BMW brand managed to increase deliveries across all vehicle drivetrains in all sales regions outside of China.

“The BMW Group is maintaining its growth trajectory for fully-electric vehicles amid challenging market conditions. This is reflected in both the significant sales growth for fully-electric vehicles and the clear rise in new BEV orders in Europe,” said Jochen Goller, member of the Board of Management of BMW AG responsible for Customer, Brands, Sales. “We are confident we can maintain our BEV sales growth in 2025 with our strong and expanded product line-up,” Goller continued.

While BMW Group deliveries for the first half of 2024 were in line with the previous year, sales performance in the second half of the year was impacted by delivery stops in connection with the Integrated Brake System (IBS), as well as subdued demand in China. The BMW Group therefore adjusted its sales guidance for the full year. With a total of 2,450,804 vehicles delivered to customers in 2024, the BMW Group achieved this new sales target. Electrified vehicles represented 24.2% of total BMW Group sales in 2024, with 593,215 units delivered to customers. Fully-electric vehicles accounted for 17.4% of total sales.

The BMW brand delivered 2,200,177 vehicles to customers in the full year 2024 (-2.3%). With its attractive product portfolio across all technologies, the brand maintained its position as the global leader in its segment. In the Europe region, the BMW brand expanded its market share, registering double-digit sales growth in Italy, France and the UK. The BMW brand also posted sales growth in the US. In Germany, despite a declining market for fully-electric vehicles, BMW saw growth in new BEV registrations.

With a total of 206,582 vehicles delivered to customers in 2024, M GmbH sales grew by +2.1%, reaching a new all-time high. The MINI brand, which updated its entire product range last year, sold 244,915 units worldwide (-17.1%). In the fourth quarter, the brand almost doubled its BEV sales year-on-year, with 29,698 fully-electric vehicles sold. The Rolls-Royce brand delivered 5,712 units to customers
(-5.3%) in the full year. During the same period, BMW Motorrad sold 210.408 motorcycles and scooters (+0.6%) and thus achieved another record year.

BMW Group sales in Q4/YTD December 2024 at a glance

	4th Quarter 2024	Compared with previous year %	YTD December 2024	Compared with previous year %
BMW Group Automotive	696,647	-2.9%	2,450,804	-4.0%
BMW	616,674	-2.4%	2,200,177	-2.3%
- BMW M GmbH	60,015	+2.1%	206,582	+2.1%
MINI	78,231	-7.5%	244,915	-17.1%
BMW Group electrified1	184.095	+2.0%	593,215	+4.8%
BMW Group BEV	132,542	+2.9%	426,594	+13.5%
Rolls-Royce	1,742	+17.9%	5,712	-5.3%
BMW Motorrad	46,972	+6.4	210,408	+0.6%

1BEVs and PHEVs

BMW & MINI sales in the regions/markets

	4th Quarter 2024	Compared with previous year %	YTD December 2024	Compared with previous year %
Europe	267,846	-1.4%	947,235	+0.6%
Germany2	71,777	-5.8%	267,285	-5.3%
Asia	261,620	-8.8%	960,951	-10.2%
China	190,892	-14.0%	714,530	-13.4%
Americas	150,450	+5.8%	480,994	+0.2%
USA	126,257	+6.5%	397,652	+0.5%

2Provisional registration figures

BMW Group maintains BEV growth path in challenging market situation in 2024

++ BMW Group: Significant +13.5% sales growth in fully-electric vehicles +++ With over 2.45 million units delivered, BMW Group meets adjust-ed sales target for 2024 +++ BMW brand increases sales in selected regions, gains market shares and maintains position as global segment leader +++ Jochen...

www.press.bmwgroup.com

Does BMW Group include their motorcycle sales in their BMW brand sales now? I thought BMW Group was only BMW cars, Mini and RR cars.

Am I correct in saying BMW sold 1,989,769 cars in 2024, excluding the Motorcycles?

 

[kiki voinea]

I don't agree fully with his opinions or views of whether to buy a Mercedes or not, but something he says makes you think. I am sure Mercedes-Benz cars are probably better to drive than Zeekr or any Chinese brand which would swing the vote and also the brand heritage.

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Rolf , with all due respect , but let's be real : MB is NOT what it used to be...

The quality is sooo far down , that a better drive is not enough . MB used to be "the best drive". Luxury , high quality , and high reliability.

1. Luxury : What used to be called luxury back in the days? Leather , wood , nice amenities ( electric seats , good power , good gear box , etc ) .

Now , every car has that....Even the low end Renaults have massage seats...

If you count desirability as a luxury (and I agree) , yes , MB has the edge. But what happens when desirability is not there?

2. High quality: Not even close to what it used to be. My experience with MB (mine ,and friends that own) , is just meh at best. I remember when I first drove W203 ( and from my perspective , this generation of cars are the last true MB heritage of high quality cars ) , man , what a piece of true german engineering. It felt strong.

And last year I had an experience with a friend that received an W206 as a replacement car for his broken AMG GT , and it felt more chinese than any chinese car I had seen....Yes , it was low spec , but it does not matter ! Quality was trash !

3. High reliability: Haha...that is a bad joke for current lineup of MBs...

 

[Matski]

Does BMW Group include their motorcycle sales in their BMW brand sales now? I thought BMW Group was only BMW cars, Mini and RR cars.

No, nothing's changed as far as I can see. Motorrad isn't included in Group Automotive or BMW Brand sales and is reported as Motorcycles segment in the key indicators.

 

[Rolf]

Rolf , with all due respect , but let's be real : MB is NOT what it used to be...

The quality is sooo far down , that a better drive is not enough . MB used to be "the best drive". Luxury , high quality , and high reliability.

1. Luxury : What used to be called luxury back in the days? Leather , wood , nice amenities ( electric seats , good power , good gear box , etc ) .

Now , every car has that....Even the low end Renaults have massage seats...

If you count desirability as a luxury (and I agree) , yes , MB has the edge. But what happens when desirability is not there?

2. High quality: Not even close to what it used to be. My experience with MB (mine ,and friends that own) , is just meh at best. I remember when I first drove W203 ( and from my perspective , this generation of cars are the last true MB heritage of high quality cars ) , man , what a piece of true german engineering. It felt strong.

And last year I had an experience with a friend that received an W206 as a replacement car for his broken AMG GT , and it felt more chinese than any chinese car I had seen....Yes , it was low spec , but it does not matter ! Quality was trash !

3. High reliability: Haha...that is a bad joke for current lineup of MBs...

Yes I fully agree with you, Mercedes is nowhere near as good in many areas like they used to be. Quality and Reliability has taken a massive step back. The interior is not as luxurious as older models, they don't have metal or chrome strips or door handles and the wood is hollow and not thick and dense like older models.

 

[AndreB]

If you count desirability as a luxury (and I agree) , yes , MB has the edge. But what happens when desirability is not there?

The only Mercedes I'd buy is the G-Class, luxury, quality and desirability. There is a ton of them for sale on the used market but Mercedes dealers are telling its very hard to order, maybe I need to order some of their crap first.

 

[klier]

The only Mercedes I'd buy is the G-Class, luxury, quality and desirability.

Completely agree. The G clicks on all fronts. The rest of their lineup should just be just as desireable, at least from the E (C) class up.

 

[kiki voinea]

The only Mercedes I'd buy is the G-Class, luxury, quality and desirability. There is a ton of them for sale on the used market but Mercedes dealers are telling its very hard to order, maybe I need to order some of their crap first.

That's because they can do it. They want to keep the hype up. It works...

Just wait a few more months. The current economic situation is not very bright. This hype cars will slowly fade...

 

[Gor134]

Audi once aimed to become the leading premium car manufacturer.

It seems that leadership is now a dream for Audi and they are falling further behind with each passing year.

Every single Audi "volume seller" is on the verge of a new successor, wait until this year and next year to get a better picture of global sales volumes once the new Q3/A5/Q5/A7/Q7/Q9 are on full scale production.

Sales to go down as a model line comes to an end is very expected, if anything I expected Audis total numbers to be worse than they are

 

[AndreB]

Every single Audi "volume seller" is on the verge of a new successor, wait until this year and next year to get a better picture of global sales volumes once the new Q3/A5/Q5/A7/Q7/Q9 are on full scale production.

IMO the new Audi cars look less attractive than previous models and making them more expensive will lower the sales even further. BMW is not much better as their new 5-series and X3 are as cheap inside like A6/Q6.
Then the EVs from China are entering the markets which will affect everybody. 2025 is gonna be difficult.

 

[Merc1]

Yes I fully agree with you, Mercedes is nowhere near as good in many areas like they used to be. Quality and Reliability has taken a massive step back. The interior is not as luxurious as older models, they don't have metal or chrome strips or door handles and the wood is hollow and not thick and dense like older models.

How do you build a car like the old ones in today’s world? You can’t unless Mercedes decides they want to be like Bentley. Can things be improved and cut their margins some, I’m sure but it’s never going back to the old days. I think it’s time to move on from it. It’s not gonna happen. The new E and S are likely as good as it’s gonna get for now. There is no way to build a car like my W140 S500 today and it not be 200K to start.

M

 

[Gor134]

IMO the new Audi cars look less attractive than previous models and making them more expensive will lower the sales even further.

Perhaps, but customers are tired of driving the same shit at higher costs since 2017. Current outdated models are already more expensive than they used to be.

Many will be pleased just for the sake of something new.

 

[Mr. Mercedes]

Rolf , with all due respect , but let's be real : MB is NOT what it used to be...

The quality is sooo far down , that a better drive is not enough . MB used to be "the best drive". Luxury , high quality , and high reliability.

1. Luxury : What used to be called luxury back in the days? Leather , wood , nice amenities ( electric seats , good power , good gear box , etc ) .

Now , every car has that....Even the low end Renaults have massage seats...

If you count desirability as a luxury (and I agree) , yes , MB has the edge. But what happens when desirability is not there?

2. High quality: Not even close to what it used to be. My experience with MB (mine ,and friends that own) , is just meh at best. I remember when I first drove W203 ( and from my perspective , this generation of cars are the last true MB heritage of high quality cars ) , man , what a piece of true german engineering. It felt strong.

And last year I had an experience with a friend that received an W206 as a replacement car for his broken AMG GT , and it felt more chinese than any chinese car I had seen....Yes , it was low spec , but it does not matter ! Quality was trash !

3. High reliability: Haha...that is a bad joke for current lineup of MBs...

A lot of what you say is true, but Marcus' take on it is the reality. The E is supposed to mark a turning point, the CLA will demonstrate if that is the case.

The situation is also NOT exclusive to MB though and BMW and AUDI are in the same boat. In fact BMW's cost cutting has now just begun made worse by their ridiculous new interior design language.

How do you build a car like the old ones in today’s world? You can’t unless Mercedes decides they want to be like Bentley. Can things be improved and cut their margins some, I’m sure but it’s never going back to the old days. I think it’s time to move on from it. It’s not gonna happen. The new E and S are likely as good as it’s gonna get for now. There is no way to build a car like my W140 S500 today and it not be 200K to start.

M

 

[kiki voinea]

A lot of what you say is true, but Marcus' take on it is the reality. The E is supposed to mark a turning point, the CLA will demonstrate if that is the case.

The situation is also NOT exclusive to MB though and BMW and AUDI are in the same boat. In fact BMW's cost cutting has now just begun made worse by their ridiculous new interior design language.

I really hope that all german manufacturers will see the turning point , and act on it.

They had billions in PROFIT , in the last years , historical ones, and they made few to no real development .

Ok, BMW looks like they have started their shift. New UI , new design. But let's see the pricing...

The pinnacle of MB fleet , the future S facelift looks like a disappointment to me , honestly. At least for now...

 

[Sunny]

So...

ZEV Mandate for 2024 was 22%

Out of 1,952,778 cars sold, 381,970 were EVs (19.56%), to hit 22% it would have needed to have been 429,611 EVs sold... a miss of 47,641 units.

This is after an estimated £4.5 Billion in manufacturer discounts to stimulate EVs.

Crudely speaking, at £15,000 fine per vehicle, that would mean the UK motor industry owed a fine of £715 million for 2024 (it perhaps seems more realistic that instead of this money flowing to the government to invest in better solutions than cars, a similar amount might flow to the electric car makers who can sell their allowance to improve their profit margins, which .. helps cut emissions? I guess?)

Over the coming year, the target is 28%. Assuming similar overall sales, this would require 548,800 EVs to be sold in 2025. This is a 44% increase from this years total, or 166,830 units. For some context the increase in '24, from '23, was only 67,283 units, and according to the SMMT, around 64,000 of those were registered to businesses, NOT private buyers, and this is likely because of tax breaks for companies buying EVs. It seems realistic to say that at the moment demand is nowhere near what the government thought it would be ... EVs are discounted, subsidised and mandated, and we're still at <20% market penetration... and the government thinks we're going to get to 80% in the next 5-6 years?

The ZEV mandate is a bad plan.

When I read your post, I didn't quite follow. But this video explains the British ZEV mandate -

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.

And I agree, it seems like a really dumb idea.

 

[Matski]

And I agree, it seems like a really dumb idea.

It's stupid on basically every level, but the thing that really irks me specifically not about the existence of the mandate, but the implementation of it, is the manufacturer pooling. The government is mandating that some companies will be paying out a shit tonne of money for missing the target, but then allows them to funnel it into the pockets of shareholders of foreign automakers. What they should do is enforce the fine properly and take the money and plough it into things that will actually help the situation, like getting more public transport sorted out and funding infrastructure that helps promote greener mobility solutions (i.e. the charging network). I could bang on a lot about the need for better public transport and less car dependency - which would be odd for a car enthusiast forum - but part of the ZEV mandate is to reduce to vehicle miles travelled by (IIRC) about 25%... the government HAS to invest in alternatives if they want to cut VMT.

They should also reduce the fine based on how many people are employed in the UK by that manufacturer. Ford is far from the biggest employer in the UK, but their potential fine is (apparently) equal to (very roughly) HALF the profit they make in the UK. A similar target-miss next year, basically wipes out most of it, and if it's anything like the same in 2026 it is literally not worth Ford employing ~10,000 people in the UK (with associated supply chain etc.) - and with the bigger players, it's not just jobs, it's entire communities. As f#cked as our car industry is when compared to other major economies, it's still a major employer and driver of trade.

Those are the two big things for me. As I've said before, if EVs are genuinely better then the market would decide without mandates and subsidies. It should be fairly clear by now that EVs being better isn't the perception of the market so instead of just taking choice away the Government's efforts should be targeting whatever the shortcomings of EVs are, and the misgivings of the market, or providing alternatives to car dependency, so instead of people spending a lot money on one thing (a car), they can use public transport to re-distribute their money amongst more businesses in their regional community.

 

[Rolf]

How do you build a car like the old ones in today’s world? You can’t unless Mercedes decides they want to be like Bentley. Can things be improved and cut their margins some, I’m sure but it’s never going back to the old days. I think it’s time to move on from it. It’s not gonna happen. The new E and S are likely as good as it’s gonna get for now. There is no way to build a car like my W140 S500 today and it not be 200K to start.

M

In todays age of advanced computing and even tighter machine and build tolerances, it is probably easier nowadays to build a car with better build quality than in the old days. It's actually quite amazing how the older engineers managed to design and manufacture their cars to such perfection when they didn't have any advanced computer aided design and mostly started things with hand sketches and clay models.

You right, all of us die hard Mercedes enthusiasts cannot expect a return to the good old days with the current Mercedes philosophy, nowadays they only care about shareholders profits. All the cars are built to a price.

 

[leylandi]

 

[Rolf]

Looking at VW Group sales figures, I don't know what all the hoo haa is about falling sales when you look at their individual sales figures, VW only lost 70K cars compared to last year with totals still on 4.8mill while SKoda and Seat together increased sales by 100K vehicles, so the core part of the group was up 27K cars since last year. The biggest loser and cause of the major 210K sales drop of the entire group is Audi, it lost 224K in sales in 2024 vs 2023.

 

[Merc1]

In todays age of advanced computing and even tighter machine and build tolerances, it is probably easier nowadays to build a car with better build quality than in the old days. It's actually quite amazing how the older engineers managed to design and manufacture their cars to such perfection when they didn't have any advanced computer aided design and mostly started things with hand sketches and clay models.

You right, all of us die hard Mercedes enthusiasts cannot expect a return to the good old days with the current Mercedes philosophy, nowadays they only care about shareholders profits. All the cars are built to a price.

Tighter tolerances yes, but that doesn’t have anything to do with the materials used. Those old cars used heavier everything, steel, wood, leather, glass, plastic, all those things that have a Benz is signature smell and heft would cost fortune to build today imo. I’m not sure about the sheet metal they use today but back in the day after a hail storm every Japanese car would have hail damage but not the Mercedes, Volvos etc. lm not sure about today’s Mercedes tho. I think the Maybach 57/62 was their last car like that.

M

 

[kiki voinea]

Porsche and Bentley are down a little , but it does not really matter , because the margin is great...

But man , Audi is bleeding hard....