NSX [Official] Acura NSX (NC1)

[Zafiro]

Fernando Alonso can buy ten of them easily. One color for each day

 

[KiwiRob]

Fernando Alonso can buy ten of them easily. One color for each day

So there are 10 day's per week in Sweden, it's now wonder us in Norway are living a better life.

 

[Carmaker1]

It looks better than I thought it would and improves on the concepts. One hopes the Lexus LF-LC will do the same thing, in order to not age too prematurely. Look forward to seeing it in person next week, as well as many other new reveals (new SVT Raptor, etc.)

One thing I did notice in the summer, as that in the prototype (which got burnt), the impromptu interior clearly differed from the 2nd concept shown at 2013 NAIAS. I was concerned that Honda/Acura would go with a typical Acura interior (RLX, TLX, MDX), instead of a more bespoke one for the NSX. They managed to mix both of them together well.

 

[Merc1]

Standing in front of it the other day I can't say I was as moved by it as I was the new Ford GT, but it is low, sleek and very remindful of a Ferrari. Need the final output/specs.

M

 

[Soup]

 

[NarutoRamen]

I guess they only sell them in LHD markets except for US/Canada. I would wish they somehow develop unique vehicles (like Lexus and Infiniti) and sell them in other countries as well, cause from what I have seen of these models is that they just beefed up versions of some models sold under the Honda badge in Europe etc.

I'm not completely sure about Infiniti, but many of their cars are Nissans. Lexus on the other hand is pretty much rebadged Toyotas, most of their cars anyway. Acura is developing cars that are specifically Acura now and not rebadged Hondas, at least not as much as before. TLX, RLX, ZDX, and now NSX are Acura specific cars as far as I'm aware. However, I think the Japanese makes get unfair treatments. How come no one complains about BMW/Rolls Royce and pretty much ALL of VW group?

 

[Carmaker1]

I'm not completely sure about Infiniti, but many of their cars are Nissans. Lexus on the other hand is pretty much rebadged Toyotas, most of their cars anyway. Acura is developing cars that are specifically Acura now and not rebadged Hondas, at least not as much as before. TLX, RLX, ZDX, and now NSX are Acura specific cars as far as I'm aware. However, I think the Japanese makes get unfair treatments. How come no one complains about BMW/Rolls Royce and pretty much ALL of VW group?

Sorry, but that is not true at all and not exactly fair. Acuras are still more of rebadged Hondas, in comparison to Lexus. No Lexus models are truly sold as Toyotas anymore, save for the Land Cruiser platform cousins, which still have a good level of differentiation and are already premium in Toyota grade.

Also, remember that there is still a difference between "rebadging" and platform-sharing. The outgoing Euro Accord and TSX are indicative of the latter for sure, as is the newly introduced JDM Honda Legend (KC1). The Lexus ES (XV60) and RX (AL10) are primarily on the K platform, which the Camry (XV50) also uses. The RX (AL10) is on a version of it (with XU40 Kluger) which the Highlander/Kluger (XU50) also still uses, and the Avalon (XX40) with the ES (XV60).

The GS (L10), IS (XE30), and RC (XC10) are on the "New N" RWD platform. The LS (XF40) is still on the "N" RWD platform. The CT (A10) and NX (AZ10) are on different versions of the MC platform, which the Corolla also uses a variation of. The next LS (XF50?) may introduce a new modular platform in 2016, that the LC large coupe (2016-17), proposed large CUV (2016), and next GS (2018) will likely use.

 

[hoffmeister_fan]

Re: Lexus/Toyota rebadging...
The initial ES was a rebadged Camry. When the original LS was introduced, it wasn't a rebadged Toyota (called Toyota Celsior in JDM), in fact, as I've recently learned it was the other way round. When Toyota did develop the original LS400 (codenamed: F1) it was designed with the exporting it the US in mind to be sold as different make. However, since they did not set up another division in Japan, it was sold as a Toyota. Same thing with the Toyota Aristo, as it was originally conceived as a Lexus GS, but was rebadged as the Aristo. Prior to the introduction of the LS and GS, the Celsior or Aristo did not exist.

This was per Wikipedia as I read a few months ago, but it seems to rings true.

As for the NSX....
When I see the concept interior vs. the production, I can't help but think how production-ready and streamlined the concept version is.

And as for Alonso and the NSX...well, Alonso's hero is Senna. And Senna had a hand in developing the original NSX.

 

[NarutoRamen]

Sorry, but that is not true at all and not exactly fair. Acuras are still more of rebadged Hondas, in comparison to Lexus. No Lexus models are truly sold as Toyotas anymore, save for the Land Cruiser platform cousins, which still have a good level of differentiation and are already premium in Toyota grade.

Also, remember that there is still a difference between "rebadging" and platform-sharing. The outgoing Euro Accord and TSX are indicative of the latter for sure, as is the newly introduced JDM Honda Legend (KC1). The Lexus ES (XV60) and RX (AL10) are primarily on the K platform, which the Camry (XV50) also uses. The RX (AL10) is on a version of it (with XU40 Kluger) which the Highlander/Kluger (XU50) also still uses, and the Avalon (XX40) with the ES (XV60).

The GS (L10), IS (XE30), and RC (XC10) are on the "New N" RWD platform. The LS (XF40) is still on the "N" RWD platform. The CT (A10) and NX (AZ10) are on different versions of the MC platform, which the Corolla also uses a variation of. The next LS (XF50?) may introduce a new modular platform in 2016, that the LC large coupe (2016-17), proposed large CUV (2016), and next GS (2018) will likely use.

By what you said, the current acuras are then platform sharing. They're not rebadged Hondas. So again, Acura is getting hate for doing the same thing as Lexus. Why?

 

[Carmaker1]

Re: Lexus/Toyota rebadging...
The initial ES was a rebadged Camry. When the original LS was introduced, it wasn't a rebadged Toyota (called Toyota Celsior in JDM), in fact, as I've recently learned it was the other way round. When Toyota did develop the original LS400 (codenamed: F1) it was designed with the exporting it the US in mind to be sold as different make. However, since they did not set up another division in Japan, it was sold as a Toyota. Same thing with the Toyota Aristo, as it was originally conceived as a Lexus GS, but was rebadged as the Aristo. Prior to the introduction of the LS and GS, the Celsior or Aristo did not exist.

This was per Wikipedia as I read a few months ago, but it seems to rings true.

As for the NSX....
When I see the concept interior vs. the production, I can't help but think how production-ready and streamlined the concept version is.

And as for Alonso and the NSX...well, Alonso's hero is Senna. And Senna had a hand in developing the original NSX.

Yep, that's correct! The LS has never been conceived as a Toyota, but as you read, Toyota never planned for Lexus in Japan nor even the ES. I actually helped a bit with that Wikipedia article and many others (it spreads around). The ES250 was definitely a rebadged Camry Vista facelift, developed (parallel to US Camry refresh for MY90) on the heels of the LS400 design freeze from 1987 to 1989. By 1989, the MY1992 ES300, SC coupe, and GS300 had just been frozen, when both the MY1990 LS400 and ES250 went on sale in the US. Toyota knew very well they had planned a newer ES300 for late 1991, but capitalized on the existing model as a stop-gap.

The Aristo was unusually launched in late 1991, about 18 months before the Lexus GS300, due to some the most mysterious delays for the Lexus version. The first generation GS by Giorgetto Giugiario design from 1988-1989 basically sat on ice for 3.5 to 4 years (despite Aristo 1991 launch), before being launched belatedly in April 1993. It was even 30 months after its 1993 launch, the next generation GS was already signed-off.

When Alonso made mention of the NSX, my mind instantly went to Ayrton Senna. Too bad for Alonso, he didn't get the same last minute involvement in NSX development the way Senna did (1989-1990). The NSX turned out really well in term of aesthetics in my opinion (even productionised by the designer of ZDX concept) and hopefully an NSX facelift interior will may remain true to the 2013 concept interior.

 

[Carmaker1]

By what you said, the current acuras are then platform sharing. They're not rebadged Hondas. So again, Acura is getting hate for doing the same thing as Lexus. Why?

Yes, the MDX (Pilot), RDX (CR-V), TLX (Accord platform?), and ILX (Civic) are platform-sharing, while the flagship RLX has now been rebadged as the KC1 Honda Legend and the Acura NSX might be called Honda NSX in some territories (concept shown). They are not exactly doing better in that area than Toyota, especially that there has not been an identical Toyota (Windom, Celsior, Aristo, nor Altezza) variant in a decade (except RX redesign in 2008 & LC cousins). For Acura, they barely just dropped the Euro Accord/TSX.

The idea that the Highlander & RX and Camry/Avalon & ES are absolutely identical is quite ludicrous from those that make such an argument. Maybe back in the 1990s and early 00s, but today not so much. I am actually quite fine with this anyway, as non-US Hondas/JDM Toyotas are made to a very different standard and are not the average US-spec Civic/Corolla merely trimmed in leather.

 

[NarutoRamen]

^^As far as I remember, I think this was a few years back. The head of development said that going forward Acuras were going to be designed/built for Acura. Basically, I think this started with RLX and maybe even the MDX...but basically they aren't rebadged Hondas as Acura but rather they are Acuras being rebadged as Hondas for overseas market. That's why the Acuras now, except maybe the NSX, are very US centric vehicles and not the other way around.

 

[Merc1]

The RLX is still based on some derivative of an accord platform and it drives like crap for the 60K price. Acura are still nothin but fancy Hondas. Other than the NSX they have nothing unique to them, unlike Lexus which had some grown man models. Acura and Lincoln are just above joke status.

M

 

[NarutoRamen]

The RLX is still based on some derivative of an accord platform and it drives like crap for the 60K price. Acura are still nothin but fancy Hondas. Other than the NSX they have nothing unique to them, unlike Lexus which had some grown man models. Acura and Lincoln are just above joke status.

M

I'm not sure about RLX. But have you even driven the new Acuras? Except for maybe the IS, Acuras are better driving cars. The TLX can outhandle GS/ES Lexus. From what I've heard, the RLX is still a better handling car than LS. MDX and RDX can run circles around ANY Lexus SUV.

The one drawback in the Lexus vs. Acura debate that I would say Acura is still lacking in is the "Luxury"dept. I think, overall, Lexus is far more luxurious than Acura. I believe that has to do with Lexus having better direction than Acura. It's like Lexus was given a target to aim for while the Acura team was throwing darts on a board and just going with whateverthef__k it landed on.

 

[Merc1]

I'm not sure about RLX. But have you even driven the new Acuras? Except for maybe the IS, Acuras are better driving cars. The TLX can outhandle GS/ES Lexus. From what I've heard, the RLX is still a better handling car than LS. MDX and RDX can run circles around ANY Lexus SUV.

The one drawback in the Lexus vs. Acura debate that I would say Acura is still lacking in is the "Luxury"dept. I think, overall, Lexus is far more luxurious than Acura. I believe that has to do with Lexus having better direction than Acura. It's like Lexus was given a target to aim for while the Acura team was throwing darts on a board and just going with whateverthef__k it landed on.

Yes I have, the RLX and the TLX. RLX drives like crap. TLX is sporty, but the design says fancy Accord and it has zero in the way of luxury car substance. The TLX being able to out handle the ES means what man lol? The ES is a pensioner car that isn't even trying to be sporty. The GS is a much bigger car with RWD and a luxury feel and presentation no Acura can match. Ditto with the RLX vs the LS. The LS is a grown man car and it being out handled by a RLX means nothing. Acura (along with Lincoln) is the biggest non event in the luxury car space, an outlet to sell fancy Hondas to foolish Americans who don't know what real luxury is. Acura is fools luxury. Lexus at least has some models specific to them. Acura is just now getting the NSX, finally.

M

 

[Carmaker1]

Yes I have, the RLX and the TLX. RLX drives like crap. TLX is sporty, but the design says fancy Accord and it has zero in the way of luxury car substance. The TLX being able to out handle the ES means what man lol? The ES is a pensioner car that isn't even trying to be sporty. The GS is a much bigger car with RWD and a luxury feel and presentation no Acura can match. Ditto with the RLX vs the LS. The LS is a grown man car and it being out handled by a RLX means nothing. Acura (along with Lincoln) is the biggest non event in the luxury car space, an outlet to sell fancy Hondas to foolish Americans who don't know what real luxury is. Acura is fools luxury. Lexus at least has some models specific to them. Acura is just now getting the NSX, finally.

M

I figured the RLX doesn't drive well, good to hear that they've done well with the TLX. I'm not too shocked anyway, as an XL-Accord isn't on the same level. Honestly there's no way in my opinion that either of them (outside of NSX) compares with the LS and GS.

I do look forward to seeing the NSX in Detroit tomorrow, so I'll be heading to bed (long 14-hr+ journey ahead of me). Did you go (after the first week)? And if yes, was the NSX closed off from the public? If one doesn't go to the VIP/Gallery event, it is very annoying to encounter sectioned off vehicles and only an annoying spokesperson mouthing off about it.

 

[Merc1]

I figured the RLX doesn't drive well, good to hear that they've done well with the TLX. I'm not too shocked anyway, as an XL-Accord isn't on the same level. Honestly there's no way in my opinion that either of them (outside of NSX) compares with the LS and GS.

I do look forward to seeing the NSX in Detroit tomorrow, so I'll be heading to bed (long 14-hr+ journey ahead of me). Did you go (after the first week)? And if yes, was the NSX closed off from the public? If one doesn't go to the VIP/Gallery event, it is very annoying to encounter sectioned off vehicles and only an annoying spokesperson mouthing off about it.

Yes I went last weekend. The NSX is roped off, no access!

M

 

[Carmaker1]

Yes I went last weekend. The NSX is roped off, no access!

M

Not surprised. Thanks!

 

[NarutoRamen]

Yes I have, the RLX and the TLX. RLX drives like crap. TLX is sporty, but the design says fancy Accord and it has zero in the way of luxury car substance. The TLX being able to out handle the ES means what man lol? The ES is a pensioner car that isn't even trying to be sporty. The GS is a much bigger car with RWD and a luxury feel and presentation no Acura can match. Ditto with the RLX vs the LS. The LS is a grown man car and it being out handled by a RLX means nothing. Acura (along with Lincoln) is the biggest non event in the luxury car space, an outlet to sell fancy Hondas to foolish Americans who don't know what real luxury is. Acura is fools luxury. Lexus at least has some models specific to them. Acura is just now getting the NSX, finally.

M

RLX drives like crap...but it still drives BETTER than the LS. The TLX is a better driving car than both GS and ES. I've driven them both. The GS feels like a boat while the ES just feels like a Camry. The reason I mention both of them is because TLX is a confused car. It sits in between the ES and GS. If you care how your car drives, get the TLX with SH-AWD. I've already stated that Acura is lacking direction.

And you talking about the Luxury aspect...what is "luxury". Honestly, that sh!t you wrote is insulting. Americans are "foolish" for choosing the things they want? Choice is what America is about. Get off your high horse dude. So more leather and comfy stuff automatically means true luxury? If so, then Kia K900 is better than any Lexus product. But it's not, isn't it? Why? There are other aspects and luxury is different to different people. Maybe many people don't really give a flying f__k about opulence without substance. And many Lexus models are exactly that. Acura...it's just a confused brand, except they do one thing well and that is driving.

 

[Merc1]

RLX drives like crap...but it still drives BETTER than the LS. The TLX is a better driving car than both GS and ES. I've driven them both. The GS feels like a boat while the ES just feels like a Camry. The reason I mention both of them is because TLX is a confused car. It sits in between the ES and GS. If you care how your car drives, get the TLX with SH-AWD. I've already stated that Acura is lacking direction.

And you talking about the Luxury aspect...what is "luxury". Honestly, that sh!t you wrote is insulting. Americans are "foolish" for choosing the things they want? Choice is what America is about. Get off your high horse dude. So more leather and comfy stuff automatically means true luxury? If so, then Kia K900 is better than any Lexus product. But it's not, isn't it? Why? There are other aspects and luxury is different to different people. Maybe many people don't really give a flying f__k about opulence without substance. And many Lexus models are exactly that. Acura...it's just a confused brand, except they do one thing well and that is driving.

First off you seem to be confused as to what luxury is and what cars compete here. The RLX is nothing but an overstuffed Accord and it drives as such. The Lexus LS is much bigger, RWD, V8 and is a full on luxury car, it isn't trying to be as sporty as a RLX with AWD. The RLX doesn't compare to the LS in feel, quality, ride or anything really. Again, the TLX driving better than a ES proves what? The ES is a blue-hair pensioner special with NO pretense sporting. Driving better? What does that mean to you? Just being sportier? If that is the case then you miss the point of a luxury vehicle.

Acura is not even sold around the world, just primarily here in the U.S. where a separate nameplate was needed to get us to buy fancy Hondas. Even their best car, the NSX is a Honda everywhere else. Acura is fools luxury. It is the perfect brand for people who don't know what a real luxury car is.

Now who said anything about more leather and "comfy stuff" making a luxury car a luxury car? Never ever said anything like that. You can get heated rear seats in a Hyundai Elantra, does that make it a luxury car? Heck no.

Opulence without substance? Are you trying say that an Acura has substance when they're all Accord and Civic based, FWD and lacking in design inside and out? Where is this substance?

Lexus at least stands for quality and reliability, what does Acura stand for? Nothing, they're a joke. I'm not even defending Lexus, but at least they know what they are and have the guts to sell their cars around the world as such and they make some grown models that can't be had at the Toyota store at a discount.

M