Hot! All kind of sales Audi / BMW / Mercedes

[Matski]

Mini is not bringing a lot to the BMW brand but BMW has to sacrifice some heritage to keep MINI profitable

Maybe not to the brand, but to BMW Group it brings further volume across a wider customer base and economies of scale BMW would not otherwise achieve on both platforms and engines, it gains market share for BMW Group against their primary competitors, and no doubt somewhere there it also helps BMW Group meet emissions targets.

How many of BMW Groups competitors don't leverage their platforms against their brands? How many of BMW Brands competitors don't leverage FWD platforms to bolster their sales?

If Mini was not suitably profitable why would BMW maintain it? They flogged Rover to the Chinese and sold Range Rover after they scalped the knowledge, they assimilated GLAS and have prospered thanks to their plant, they off-loaded Husquvana pretty quickly too... but yet with MINI and Rolls-Royce they've used classic brands with cult status to book-end their own brand, and it seems to be working. They're having to sub-out BMW brand manufacture as it is... if Mini was dead weight surely they'd re-purpose BMW Oxford Plant to produce BMW models instead of using Magna/VDL ?

I don't want to rant on about it, because I can fully understand why you might not like the direction the BMW Brand is taking at the bottom end of the market, but that's an enthusiasts argument... the subject here is cold hard volume, and that means appealing to Joe Public, not enthusiasts. As far as I can see, there is no way to actually quantify the drain/contribution to BMW on the balance sheet... they show it as Automotive segment, Motorcycle segment, and Financial Services Segment... I can tell you now that BMW Motorrad contributes very little, but I doubt there's many fans that would like to see that piece of BMW's heritage disappear?

Mini (and Rolls-Royce) bring their own heritage to the BMW group, which BMW appears to nurture, value and respect... and cash in on.

Honestly, I think you give Mini a hard time for no reason... maybe once I've driven an F40 1-er, and power understeered off my favourite corner (in about 10 years time) I'll feel the way you do, but until then, I'm giving BMW and Mini the benefit of the doubt on this one.

..

I have to add, I've never driven the current 1-er, but my E87 1-er is dramatically compromised in terms of its usability... it is cramped, it's proportions mean that even by 5'7" height and 80kg mass doesn't get in either the front, or back, as easily as its FWD competitors, the boot is tiny for a compact hatch.. my first car was a Peugeot 106 and the load space in that was much more usable than the E8x 1-er... so although I do enjoy the dynamics of my 1-er, I really do understand why BMW would want to offer something more useable to families that are forking out for a "premium" hatchback.

 

[Amat46]

I really hope MB won't make anything similar to the BMW GT range.

 

[hovabongZA]

@Matski I really enjoy reading your posts , always very informative. Keep up the good work.

 

[CrunchSlaughtered]

@Matski
Neither you, nor me know if MINI is really profitable for BMW
Concerning your other arguments:

"Maybe not to the brand, but to BMW Group it brings further volume across a wider customer base and economies of scale"
So does Opel for GM

"BMW would not otherwise achieve on both platforms and engines, it gains market share for BMW Group against their primary competitors"
So does Opel for GM

"it also helps BMW Group meet emissions targets"
and so does Opel for GM

But GM wants to get rid of Opel

 

[Deleted member 25]

I have always viewed Mini as a cash machine for BMW, they sell heaps of it for very high prices, i would be very surprised if it was not profitable.

 

[CrunchSlaughtered]

I have always viewed Mini as a cash machine for BMW, they sell heaps of it for very high prices, i would be very surprised if it was not profitable.

The fact that they are expensive doesn't necessarily transmits into being profitable, because the costs are too high

 

[Matski]

@Matski
Neither you, nor me know if MINI is really profitable for BMW

No, this is true. But logic dictates the BMW Group benefits more from having Mini, than not... or else why would they keep it? It's a simple premise that companies will do what is best for them and their shareholders....

Concerning your other arguments:

"Maybe not to the brand, but to BMW Group it brings further volume across a wider customer base and economies of scale"
So does Opel for GM

"BMW would not otherwise achieve on both platforms and engines, it gains market share for BMW Group against their primary competitors"
So does Opel for GM

"it also helps BMW Group meet emissions targets"
and so does Opel for GM

But GM wants to get rid of Opel

It's a pretty massive over simplification to try and compare GM's situation to BMW's. As an example, BMW generates about the same net income as GM... from about a quarter of the unit sales... so really, I wouldn't want to comment on why GM wants to offload Opel. However... if we were considering such questions, SEAT makes an actual reported loss for VW -- it's net income is a minus figure on their reports, yet they keep it.. Bentley generates about an eighth of the net income that Skoda does for VW, yet they keep it.

Like I say.. simple premise..

Opel is not good for GM, so they want to get rid
Mini is good for BMW, so they keep it

 

[CrunchSlaughtered]

No, this is true. But logic dictates the BMW Group benefits more from having Mini, than not... or else why would they keep it? It's a simple premise that companies will do what is best for them and their shareholders....



It's a pretty massive over simplification to try and compare GM's situation to BMW's. As an example, BMW generates about the same net income as GM... from about a quarter of the unit sales... so really, I wouldn't want to comment on why GM wants to offload Opel. However... if we were considering such questions, SEAT makes an actual reported loss for VW -- it's net income is a minus figure on their reports, yet they keep it.. Bentley generates about an eighth of the net income that Skoda does for VW, yet they keep it.

Like I say.. simple premise..

Opel is not good for GM, so they want to get rid
Mini is good for BMW, so they keep it

Im not saying that the case with GM and Opel is the same like BMW and MINI, Im only saying that your arguments are not valid. Its much more possible that your thesis is the corect one, not mine, but from the available information that is given to us both cases are posible.

 

[Matski]

Im only saying that your arguments are not valid

Oooookay then.. they're not really my arguments; Expansion driven growth, economies of scale, cost ammortisation, buying power, risk mitigation through diversification, market share, and adaptation of new principles to meet regulatory requirements.... are proven, accepted and practiced elements of business and manufacturing. The fact GM can't manage this properly does not invalidate the principles, and in the case of BMW, who is growing the Mini brand, not trying to sell it all would seem to apply... so...

Its much more possible that your thesis is the correct one, not mine, but from the available information that is given to us both cases are possible.

Yes..

 

[speed_kills]

Appealing to the enthusiasts is great, until you don't have a business anymore. Sadly, take Lotus example, they're much better run now, but they will always balance a thin line to avoid losses.

 

[EnI]

Mercedes-Benz on successful path month by month: four years of continuous growth

06. March 2017
Stuttgart

• Mercedes-Benz delivered 153,862 vehicles to customers in February, an increase of 15%
• Thanks to its 48th consecutive record month, Mercedes-Benz has grown for four years
• New best figures in all three core regions: Europe, Asia-Pacific and NAFTA
• More than 70% growth for E-Class Saloon and Estate

More: http://media.daimler.com/marsMediaS...b1R5cGVJZD00MDYyNiZ2aWV3VHlwZT10aHVtYnM!&rs=0



Yep, Mercedes is on fire lately. Literally: http://www.germancarforum.com/threa...-1-million-vehicles-due-to-fire-hazard.56843/

 

[SCOTT27]

The fact that they are expensive doesn't necessarily transmits into being profitable, because the costs are too high

The previous generations of the MINI we're not profitable but the high amounts of personalisation purchased were.
The new F56 series of MINI are now profitable thanks to their sharing the UKL architecture with the equivalent BMW models.
And again include personalisation options. The BMW UKL models were brought in to make MINI far more profitable than it was originally.

 

[HUTSUTAo]

Mercedes-Benz in March: strongest-ever sales month with more than 228,000 cars sold

06.

April 2017
Stuttgart
Press Contact for this Press Release (3)
Fuel consumption combined: 7,1 l/100 km; Combined CO2 emissions: 185 g/km

• Mercedes-Benz sold more vehicles in March than ever before in one month: 228,296 cars were handed over to customers, an increase of 14.8%.
• From January to March, Mercedes-Benz achieved sales of 560,625 units (+16%) – its best quarter of all time.
• In the Europe region, more than 100,000 vehicles were sold in one month for the first time.
• A new best-ever month for the E-Class Saloon and Estate with 35,626 units sold and 64.7% growth.

 

[Rolf]

Mercedes are on a role, E-class with over 35000 cars a month is amazing. If this continues more than 300,000 cars could be sold by end of the year. I would be interested to know how many C-class and S-class models (run out Phase for pre FL model) were sold.

 

[HUTSUTAo]

Mercedes are on a role, E-class with over 35000 cars a month is amazing. If this continues more than 300,000 cars could be sold by end of the year. I would be interested to know how many C-class and S-class models (run out Phase for pre FL model) were sold.

The good sales have to compensate for the rnd spent on the car.

 

[Amat46]

^R&D

 

[tristatez28lt1]

^Research & Development

 

[Merc1]

What region is driving E-Class sales like that? The Coupe couldn't have done all that yet? The coupe and cabrio are months away from the U.S. market.

M

 

[fortuner]

What region is driving E-Class sales like that? The Coupe couldn't have done all that yet? The coupe and cabrio are months away from the U.S. market.

M

I would say the sedan its a great car..
The Coupe is still new in Uk saw the first on the road yesterday a white one looks stunning on the road.

 

[Mr. Mercedes]

It looks like BMW outsold Mercedes for the month of March by a narrow margin driven by massive numbers of the X3 and X5.