F1 2007 Hungarian GP

[Gene]

THE MODERATORS HAVE ALREADY ADDRESSED THE ISSUE MOSS HAS BEEN PM'ED. PLEASE DROP THE INSULTS AND RACIST COMMENTS. KEEP IT CLEAN AND NOT PROFESSIONAL. WE DONT WANT TO CLOSE THE THREAD. LETS MOVE ON GUYS!

Sounds fair to me, didn't realise he had been PM'ed, just defending my position since I don't deserve to be called a loser or racist for stating my opinion.

 

[450SEL6.9]

The interesting thing is that Alonso is contracted until 2010 to be the primary driver of McLaren. If Hamilton wins the championship or is given primary driver status next year, it might be an out-clause for Alonso to leave?

I used to think there is something in his contract about his status as primary driver. After reading his comments this weekend, I don't think there is. A reporter asked Fernando if he expected to have priority status and he said that he did expect it. I don't think he have to expect that status if it was specifically written in his deal, but that's just my interpretation.

Good job mate
It seems I am late to the party- I am still recovering from my bruises. The race was a disaster in my opinion.
My hopes of us winning the Constructors and WDC is becoming a fleeting illusion.

Chonkoa, haven't seen you here recently. I'll just start by telling you that I no longer refer to the team with Mercedes engines by the team name. Since they always defend their integrity, I only refer to them as "TOUI" (Team of Utmost Integrity).

This season is turning into a disaster for us Ferrari fan. The only way that Ferrari wins either title is if the TOUI gets docked points for its involvement in Stepneygate. Ferrari has lost and thrown away points with poor reliability and questionable driving by its pricey talent. As if that's not enough, some 780-pages of their secrets have been seen by the opponent and nothing was handed out in the form of punishment.

However, Chonoka, I do admit that I am secretly not too upset that Ferrari did so badly this weekend. I am happy because I knew they wouldn't be competitive in Hungary to be begin with and I also know that their drivers are out of the title chase already. The reason I secretly wanted them to do badly is that I think they can now really take the gloves off with TOUI, the FIA and WMSC with regards to the spy scandal. At this point I think Ferrari has nothing to lose and the team should play hardball. If TOUI again escapes any penalty, I would like Ferrari to threaten to withdraw their cars from the remaining races in protest. Now that they are out of the title races, there is certainly less to lose by making a harsh stance.

 

[Imhotep Evil]

> I'm really hoping that this Stepney gate can activate Alonso's contract clause witch can set him free from McLaren.

 

[chonkoa]

Chonkoa, haven't seen you here recently. I'll just start by telling you that I no longer refer to the team with Mercedes engines by the team name. Since they always defend their integrity, I only refer to them as "TOUI" (Team of Utmost Integrity).

I was just a bit disheartened with the outcome of the last two races.
Massa losing the lead to Alonso in the European GP after the pit stop.
Couldn't understand why Massa always end up being shafted after pit stops.

This season is turning into a disaster for us Ferrari fan. The only way that Ferrari wins either title is if the TOUI gets docked points for its involvement in Stepneygate. Ferrari has lost and thrown away points with poor reliability and questionable driving by its pricey talent. As if that's not enough, some 780-pages of their secrets have been seen by the opponent and nothing was handed out in the form of punishment.

However, Chonoka, I do admit that I am secretly not too upset that Ferrari did so badly this weekend. I am happy because I knew they wouldn't be competitive in Hungary to be begin with and I also know that their drivers are out of the title chase already. The reason I secretly wanted them to do badly is that I think they can now really take the gloves off with TOUI, the FIA and WMSC with regards to the spy scandal. At this point I think Ferrari has nothing to lose and the team should play hardball. If TOUI again escapes any penalty, I would like Ferrari to threaten to withdraw their cars from the remaining races in protest. Now that they are out of the title races, there is certainly less to lose by making a harsh stance.

Come to think of it- you might be on to something.
It will be quite a welcoming news to see the TOUI(TOUI- I like that) being penalised. I was extremely disappointed with the FIA initial rulings- that was scandalous in my opinion.
People could say all they want, but I think the TOUI benefited from the stolen designs. A team that has a dismal unreliability, and not so good aerodynamics package last year suddenly have everything together. The 2007 Mclaren car reminds of the F2004GA that was super reliable and super quick.

With Ferrari leaving the sports- I doubt that though, they have always sided with the FIA.

 

[Remy Zero]

Well Alonso can always go back to Renault, judging by the way things are going for Fisichella, there will be an empty seat at Renault by the end of this year, but then he has to deal with Heikki Kovalainen, who isn't as soft and slow as Fisichella.

i don't see Fred going back to Renault. they're really down the pecking order. the only teams, are probably BMW, which, off the record already confirmed Kubik and Quick Nick. which leaves us to Ferrari. i'd probably shed tears when i wake up and see Fred signed for my beloved team....

 

[Remy Zero]

check out f1-live.com

they reported saying that Fred father, Jose Luis went as far as contacting Flav to see if there's a way Fred can break his current contract, and 'flee' to another team. things are really not well at Mclaren, they let this get outta hand. like one of my frens mentioned, Ferrari suddenly looks like a genius during the Schumacher era, making it clear that he's the numero uno.


but frankly, i reallly don't see what the problem is. look at it this way, Hammi screwed up team orders, but who the heck is Fred to 'punish' him or take matters into his own hands?

Fred, should have, kept it clean, face Hammi like a man to fight for the pole, and whats the worst case scenario? he could have fin the quali in 2nd place, behind Hammi.

then, he could have had the jump on Hammi at the start, or gain position during the pit stops. he should have just kept it cool, and let Ron Dennis deal with Hammi internally within the team.

yet, it was his typical ego that got into the way, and he was penalised. in fact, i would have sent him back to the grid, and not to 6th place. what he did was totally disgusting.

To me, Fred set his own pants on fire. Hammi already apologized to Ron Dennis, and apologized and cleared the air with the rest of the team, but Fred's the only person remains bitter.

another reason why i just can't stand Alonso.

 

[Imhotep Evil]

i don't see Fred going back to Renault. they're really down the pecking order. the only teams, are probably BMW, which, off the record already confirmed Kubik and Quick Nick. which leaves us to Ferrari. i'd probably shed tears when i wake up and see Fred signed for my beloved team....

So compare:

McLaren 2006 vs. 2007
or better yet
McLaren 2004 (5th) vs. 2005 (2nd)

What does this tell you ?!
Answer: that things can change over one year radically.

Renault's situation now (similar to 2003 season) is quite rosy compared to when Alonso joined them in 2002, when in the previous season they managed just 10 points barely snatching 7th place from Jaguar by just 1 point.

 

[Remy Zero]

So compare:

McLaren 2006 vs. 2007
or better yet
McLaren 2004 (5th) vs. 2005 (2nd)

What does this tell you ?!
Answer: that things can change over one year radically.

Renault's situation now (similar to 2003 season) is quite rosy compared to when Alonso joined them in 2002, when in the previous season they managed just 10 points barely snatching 7th place from Jaguar by just 1 point.

Good analysis. but don't forget, Mac got a head start back in 2006. they were already developing the 2007 cars by mid of last year, as they realized that the 2006 car just wasn't competetive.

Plus, the 19k rev limit has been helping them engine wise.

don't forget Ferrari went thru a similar process back in 2005. but the fact of the matter here, Renault has been struggling with grip, tyres and aero issues. They don't have the luxury to show records that they made a great comeback.

Ferrari, and Mac, OTOH, has been multiple world champs in the past. the basically have zero worries, budget and resource wise. Renault, as we all know, operate on a tight budget. so why would Fred go there?

yes, he might be number 1 there again, but will he be no1 in the whole field?

 

[Imhotep Evil]

^



> But Renault won vs. McLaren and Ferrari despite a lower budget and smaller staff.

That's the way Renault are, opposite to the likes of Toyota and Honda and McLaren too.
McLaren on the other hand, since the begining of the century, with the ever growing complexity and an ever more hectic development pace, have only managed to be the perenial wannabe/runner-up loser.
The only thing McLaren truly have done in this century, is to come up with the phrase "this is our year" and than make up silly excuses at the end of the season as to why they have been beaten by the likes of Ferrari and/or Renault. McLaren lost the plot at the end of the last century, when Ferrari turned the tide, and so far had 0 WDCs and WCCs.
Renault on the other hand have won 2 WCCs and 2 WDCs.

 

[450SEL6.9]

It will be quite a welcoming news to see the TOUI(TOUI- I like that) being penalised. I was extremely disappointed with the FIA initial rulings- that was scandalous in my opinion.

People could say all they want, but I think the TOUI benefited from the stolen designs. A team that has a dismal unreliability, and not so good aerodynamics package last year suddenly have everything together. The 2007 Mclaren car reminds of the F2004GA that was super reliable and super quick.

With Ferrari leaving the sports- I doubt that though, they have always sided with the FIA.

I too think they benefited from the data, especially with respect to adapting to the Bridgestone rubber. Some of the improvement is Alonso's work and skill, but I don't buy the argument that TOUI is full of integrity.

As Briatore said, possession of another's data is a violation that brings a penalty of exclusion. The WMSC found TOUI guilty of possession and didn't even fine the team.

 

[450SEL6.9]

but frankly, i reallly don't see what the problem is. look at it this way, Hammi screwed up team orders, but who the heck is Fred to 'punish' him or take matters into his own hands?

then, he could have had the jump on Hammi at the start, or gain position during the pit stops. he should have just kept it cool, and let Ron Dennis deal with Hammi internally within the team.

Hammi already apologized to Ron Dennis, and apologized and cleared the air with the rest of the team, but Fred's the only person remains bitter.

Remy, you made extremely good points in your post. I'll just respond to a few things. Indeed Hamy ignored team instructions, but I don't think it's too ridiculous for Alonso to take the matter into his own hands and exact vigilante justice. Alonso has been alleging favoritism for a long time, so maybe he didn't trust Mr Integrity enough to handle the matter internally. My 2-cents.

Are you surprised Hamy apologized? If you cursed off your boss/mentor, you'd be apologizing too . . . until it happens again!

 

[Remy Zero]

Good post, SEL. i bet Fred does regret whatever he did now.

well, like i said, tempers do tend to flare went ur in the sports industry. but, Fred is known to make his feelings known/public, which, IMO, is not a good thing to do.

i think, he lost a lot of respect in HUngary, as a champion. if he did indeed let the team deal with it internally, it would all be a whole lot diff scenario. Hammi would have been crucified by the media.

 

[Remy Zero]

^



> But Renault won vs. McLaren and Ferrari despite a lower budget and smaller staff.

That's the way Renault are, opposite to the likes of Toyota and Honda and McLaren too.
McLaren on the other hand, since the begining of the century, with the ever growing complexity and an ever more hectic development pace, have only managed to be the perenial wannabe/runner-up loser.
The only thing McLaren truly have done in this century, is to come up with the phrase "this is our year" and than make up silly excuses at the end of the season as to why they have been beaten by the likes of Ferrari and/or Renault. McLaren lost the plot at the end of the last century, when Ferrari turned the tide, and so far had 0 WDCs and WCCs.
Renault on the other hand have won 2 WCCs and 2 WDCs.

yes. bigger budget doesn't really mean anything, aside from your spending power. just ask To-Yoda. they spend almost 400 mil annually, and till this very point, they've achieved nuts.

i admire Flav a lot. he runs a small team, in a small factory. he believes in efficiency. he doesn't like big asss factories, where, like he said, u need a taxi to go to another department. he was of cos, hitting out at Mac indirectly

but, Renault's future in the sport doesn't seem to be cemented up like Mac and Ferrari. and like it or not, anyone would like to race for a team with healthy budget. Vodafone throws money like confetti to Mclaren. and so does Santander. thats one of the facts why Fred is where he is today.

 

[chonkoa]

Good post, SEL. i bet Fred does regret whatever he did now.

well, like i said, tempers do tend to flare went ur in the sports industry. but, Fred is known to make his feelings known/public, which, IMO, is not a good thing to do.

i think, he lost a lot of respect in HUngary, as a champion. if he did indeed let the team deal with it internally, it would all be a whole lot diff scenario. Hammi would have been crucified by the media.

I think Fred needs to attend an anger management course. What he did was inexcusable and outrightly silly.

 

[Centurion]

I think Fred needs to attend an anger management course. What he did was inexcusable and outrightly silly.

Yeah! I mean who does he think he is, the Spanish Inquisition?

 

[Remy Zero]

i'm about to go to bed now. but, what news is rolling around b4 i hit the sack....it seems, Fred has been given the green light to leave Mac at the end of the current season.



the '07 season is full of dramas, controversy, and whoever wins the titles will be a tainted title.

 

[450SEL6.9]

If Fernando is allowed to leave, then I think it's pretty self-explanatory. The Team of Utmost Integrity is allegedly p**ved off at both its drivers. Yet we hear about the double-WDC that is all but certain to leave. Hmm . . . I wonder why. Geez, no bias here.

 

[Remy Zero]

If Fernando is allowed to leave, then I think it's pretty self-explanatory. The Team of Utmost Integrity is allegedly p**ved off at both its drivers. Yet we hear about the double-WDC that is all but certain to leave. Hmm . . . I wonder why. Geez, no bias here.

i like to read the nicknames Ron Dennis gets in most racing forums

Mclaren isn't well at all, but to be frank, we all know, people, or the media is just making this stuff up. we don't know how severe the damage between Fred, Hammi and Ron Dennis is. it could be worse, or heck, it could be nothing at all.

i still think Fred and Hammi ain't goin anywhere for the 2008 season.

 

[Bartek S.]

McLaren deny Hamilton’s Hungarian profanities.
http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/09082007/58/hamilton-denies-war-reports.html
In an article entitled Qualifying wrap published on Sunday ahead of the Hungarian Grand Prix, we carried a reported transcript, attributed to L. Hamilton and Ron Dennis, where profanities were used following the tense and dramatic qualifying session the day before. McLaren today refuted such reports. The following is a press release from the team.
McLaren Statement
Over the last few days there has been some inaccurate and misleading reporting of certain events which transpired during the qualification for the Hungarian Grand Prix.
Whilst the team would normally not comment on such speculation, Lewis has asked us to correct one important matter of untrue critical commentary. It has been reported that Lewis used the “F word” to Ron Dennis over the team radio immediately after the qualification session had been completed.
The team have investigated this claim and reviewed the radio transmissions and we can categorically confirm that Lewis did not use the “F word” at any time during any conversation with the team.
The team and Lewis are extremely disappointed that the use of the “F word” appears to have been invented and repeated to the media.
Lewis has requested that the team issues the following statement on his behalf:
“For the record, Fernando and I are fiercely competitive and respectful of each other. We are both ambitious drivers who want to win. However, we are not drivers at war, as has been widely reported.
Although we did not speak on Sunday we have spoken since the weekend and continue to have a professional working relationship. In fact, Fernando and I plan to meet up over the holiday period.
As an individual in my first year in Formula 1 I have done my utmost to conduct myself in a professional and open manner. Of course, I have made mistakes, not least during the last weekend, and those are open to public scrutiny. I have my own regrets and have dealt with matters arising. However, it is disappointing that inflammatory and untrue material is given to the media and published which may damage reputations. This inflammatory material is then commentated on by many others as if it is factual.
Whilst I wouldn't normally communicate through press statements, I felt it important to set this matter straight."
McLaren deny Hamilton’s Hungarian profanities - Yahoo! Eurosport UK

 

[NarutoRamen]

^^That is a usual "Damage Control" Statement. Of course, they're not going to admit that their cash cow has acted in a bad manner.

Does anyone seriously expect any team to come out and say, "We can confirm that (driver name) used multiple profane words include the "F" word."