Comparison tests Porsche 918 vs McLaren P1 vs LaFerrari

[treynor]

Hi Ben,

How good is Randy compared to a normal pro driver at Laguna Seca or a highly skilled amateur like yourself? Did he express a subjective preference for either car?

I will say this: Randy was beaming ear to ear when he got out of one of the two cars. And he was impressed by both of them.

In terms of skill, his record speaks for itself.

 

[Rolf]

Ben do the manufacturers allow an owner of a 918 and P1 to do any dyna testing of these cars to check if their power is in line with factory claims? If so then this could also be an interesting exercise to check if the car is up to scratch and performing as one would expect.

 

[boyko23]

I want to ask, when this test is going public?

 

[treynor]

Ben do the manufacturers allow an owner of a 918 and P1 to do any dyna testing of these cars to check if their power is in line with factory claims? If so then this could also be an interesting exercise to check if the car is up to scratch and performing as one would expect.

No restriction on the P1; not sure about the 918.

And, the article will be published in the May issue of Motor Trend

 

[boyko23]

918 is impossible to be measured on a regular dyno, due to its complicated drivetrain.
Even Quattroroute mentioned this and if I am not mistaken, they tested the exact same car.

 

[Emu]

like how mclaren returned to angelsy weeks after the comparison with the trofeo R tyres (and possibly different camber, caster and toe-in angle)

Some factories cheat from the off by fitting semi-slicks as standard (and possibly adjusting suspension geometry prior to the first test).

 

[Apolo1]

918 is impossible to be measured on a regular dyno, due to its complicated drivetrain.
Even Quattroroute mentioned this and if I am not mistaken, they tested the exact same car.

That's correct they did.....

Respectfully not sure I understand the point here, I take it that the P1 is a customer spec car, and knowing Porsche as I do, I have no reason to think that they would provide a 918 in any other spec other than" customer one". The only variable being that the Mag ensures that taking into account that these are HB cars, that both batts are fully charged, along with all standard "assets" are available...as set out above.

The result is then, just that the result, is it not?

 

[ajjers]

Some factories cheat from the off by fitting semi-slicks as standard (and possibly adjusting suspension geometry prior to the first test).

And some factories claim lap times at major circuits but don't release any evidence. They also ask for a redo using the stickiest semi slick tyre available after their car has already lost on its standard tyres. And by stopping magazines from publishing said laptimes until they've had their second attempt. Emu, what do you think about McLaren fitting Trofeos as standard on the 675LT? Is that cheating as well?

That all said it is a shame that Ben didn't get his original wish of two customer cars even though Porsche traditionally has a very hands off approach to magazines testing their cars.

"And during all that time, Porsche has never sent anyone to our tests to change its cars’ tyres, nor even check pressures, or fluid levels; yet still it often emerges totally dominant.

So it was daft to expect anything different for the 918; and even though Porsche’s technician had some spare tyres in the back of his Macan, he looked quite happy to leave them there. His idea of checking the rubber currently fitted to the car was to have a quick look, place his hand on one to see how hot it was, and shrug his approval.

In the event, the 918 Spyder completed all of the tests we set it at MIRA on a single set of tyres and, in the process, went faster than anything else we’ve tested around our dry handling circuit – Bugatti Veyron Super Sport, McLaren P1, Radical SR3 SL, a works Vauxhall Vectra BTCC car included – with considerably less support. In the hands of deputy road test ed Saunders, the 918 was more than a second clear of the next fastest."

http://www.autocar.co.uk/blogs/new-cars/why-porsche-s-918-spyder-has-earned-its-five-star-rating

Ben, if you're allowed to say, what did Porsche send in the way of technical support and did McLaren send anyone?

Cheers.

 

[ajjers]

I will say this: Randy was beaming ear to ear when he got out of one of the two cars. And he was impressed by both of them.

In terms of skill, his record speaks for itself.

I think his subjective impression will be as interesting as the lap times themselves. Looking forward to the article/video. Well done for making this happen.

 

[Emu]

And some factories claim lap times at major circuits but don't release any evidence. They also ask for a redo using the stickiest semi slick tyre available after their car has already lost on its standard tyres. And by stopping magazines from publishing said laptimes until they've had their second attempt. Emu, what do you think about McLaren fitting Trofeos as standard on the 675LT? Is that cheating as well?

That all said it is a shame that Ben didn't get his original wish of two customer cars even though Porsche traditionally has a very hands off approach to magazines testing their cars.

"And during all that time, Porsche has never sent anyone to our tests to change its cars’ tyres, nor even check pressures, or fluid levels; yet still it often emerges totally dominant.

So it was daft to expect anything different for the 918; and even though Porsche’s technician had some spare tyres in the back of his Macan, he looked quite happy to leave them there. His idea of checking the rubber currently fitted to the car was to have a quick look, place his hand on one to see how hot it was, and shrug his approval.

In the event, the 918 Spyder completed all of the tests we set it at MIRA on a single set of tyres and, in the process, went faster than anything else we’ve tested around our dry handling circuit – Bugatti Veyron Super Sport, McLaren P1, Radical SR3 SL, a works Vauxhall Vectra BTCC car included – with considerably less support. In the hands of deputy road test ed Saunders, the 918 was more than a second clear of the next fastest."

http://www.autocar.co.uk/blogs/new-cars/why-porsche-s-918-spyder-has-earned-its-five-star-rating

Ben, if you're allowed to say, what did Porsche send in the way of technical support and did McLaren send anyone?

Cheers.

Well it's hardly fair timing a lap with PZCS vs MPSC2, we saw the advantage MPSC2s give in the Z06 vs Nimo GTR comparison in MT.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests..._2015_nissan_gt_r_nismo_comparison/specs.html

BRAKING, 60-0 MPH91 ft vs 97 ft
LATERAL ACCELERATION1.17 g (avg) vs 1.03 g (avg)
MT FIGURE EIGHT22.3 sec @ 1.06 g (avg) vs 23.1 sec @ 0.99 g (avg)

As I recall the 918 lost, hardly dominant. There's still no guarantee they supply the car standard if one wants to be childish and paranoid about this though.

Why do you fail to recognise that the track was wet in the P1's Autocar test? And it was a different driver.

 

[boyko23]

Two damp spots on the straight are far from wet track. They will not make a difference even in F1. Live with it.

 

[Bucketslash11]

Well it's hardly fair timing a lap with PZCS vs MPSC2, we saw the advantage MPSC2s give in the Z06 vs Nimo GTR comparison in MT.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests..._2015_nissan_gt_r_nismo_comparison/specs.html



As I recall the 918 lost, hardly dominant. There's still no guarantee they supply the car standard if one wants to be childish and paranoid about this though.

Why do you fail to recognise that the track was wet in the P1's Autocar test? And it was a different driver.

except the fact that the nismo was on the less sticky tyre

anyway for the record i've provided an "aero review" on the nismo vs ZO6 thread where i compare the ZO6 with the simularly aero equipped Z/28 where i use what i've gathered from their comparison to determin the biggest factor for the good laptimes of the Z/28

before we go more off-topic i would like this discussion to continue in the nismo VS ZO6 thread

 

[ajjers]

Well it's hardly fair timing a lap with PZCS vs MPSC2, we saw the advantage MPSC2s give in the Z06 vs Nimo GTR comparison in MT.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests..._2015_nissan_gt_r_nismo_comparison/specs.html



As I recall the 918 lost, hardly dominant. There's still no guarantee they supply the car standard if one wants to be childish and paranoid about this though.

Why do you fail to recognise that the track was wet in the P1's Autocar test? And it was a different driver.

The point I and the Autocar article were making is that Porsche don't try and optimise their cars for magazine tests. Quite the reverse in fact, barely checking tyre pressures/temperatures. They could be described as lackadaisical.

 

[Emu]

The point I and the Autocar article were making is that Porsche don't try and optimise their cars for magazine tests. Quite the reverse in fact, barely checking tyre pressures/temperatures. They could be described as lackadaisical.

The point I'm making is that you're comparing a wet lap with a dry lap, which is ridiculous.

 

[Emu]

except the fact that the nismo was on the less sticky tyre

That's my point. The Dunlop GT600 was a very sticky tyre and the MPSC2 completely destroyed it.

anyway for the record i've provided an "aero review" on the nismo vs ZO6 thread where i compare the ZO6 with the simularly aero equipped Z/28 where i use what i've gathered from their comparison to determin the biggest factor for the good laptimes of the Z/28

before we go more off-topic i would like this discussion to continue in the nismo VS ZO6 thread

Agree.

 

[Emu]

Two damp spots on the straight are far from wet track. They will not make a difference even in F1. Live with it.

Err... if they're on the corners, sure they will. Less sticky tyres and colder weather plus damp track.

 

[boyko23]

I said on the straight. Steve himself stated this!

 

[Emu]

We'll see.

 

[ajjers]

The point I'm making is that you're comparing a wet lap with a dry lap, which is ridiculous.

Eh? I haven't quoted that article to prove that the 918 is quicker than the P1. I have quoted that article to show that Porsche doesn't have a history of prepping their cars for magazine tests, the reverse is true in fact. Why is this so difficult for you to understand????

 

[treynor]

Ben, if you're allowed to say, what did Porsche send in the way of technical support and did McLaren send anyone?
Cheers.

Both companies sent a couple of support people. Neither did anything very unusual - they taught Randy how to charge the respective cars on off laps, took care of checking and setting tire pressures between multiple lapping sessions, and in Porsche's case, suggested a braking strategy for the faster corners. In my view it was all resaonable, particularly given how little time Randy had to learn each car.