One supercar or several CSL versions?

[bmer]

Yes, Luw but your comparing apples to oranges. Porsche and Lamborghini are sportscar manufacturers, sportscars are their core products.
Also: if sportscars made enough cash for them, why did Porsche bother to make the Cayenne?

 

[LaArtist]

I wonder what would happen with this thread when BMW launches the next Z8-based, M10 supercar. This thread would be so pointless! Let's face it, BMW does not have a supercar NOW, but they want one for sure!

imma tell you whats gonna happen..
the BMW fans will dick ride that M10 like there was no tomorrow..
thats what will happen..

 

[Mr Robert]

imma tell you whats gonna happen..
the BMW fans will dick ride that M10 like there was no tomorrow..
thats what will happen..

And god knows they by no means will be out of line doing just that

Jokes aside, my personal preference says small, light and fun to drive cars before big, powefull and dull cars... (just look at the last CSL)

Think 1-series CSL. That would do the trick.

 

[Centurion]

Yes, Luw but your comparing apples to oranges. Porsche and Lamborghini are sportscar manufacturers, sportscars are their core products.
Also: if sportscars made enough cash for them, why did Porsche bother to make the Cayenne?

MB are selling plenty of SL55s and CL63/CL600s. There is a plenty of demand for two seater cars priced between 120-150k. Although the profit margins for such cars are enormous they also do serve as technical studies pushing development of sports cars forward. But their biggest purpose is giving the brand enthusiast the ultimate car.

The reason why Porsche went a long with the Cayenne was to make some quick cash and lots of it to finance big Panamera project.


Thankfully BMW has registered the trademark M10 which indicates that there will indeed be an Uber sports car to go against cars like the R8.

 

[LaArtist]

^lol that they wont be..
thats why they should keep quite now..

 

[RICHBOY]

imma tell you whats gonna happen..
the BMW fans will dick ride that M10 like there was no tomorrow..
thats what will happen..

You hit the nail on the head! Long as they believe BMW doesn't want a play they will agree, but soon as BMW decides to produce a supercar be prepared for the biggest flip flop of our time! And I have every intention on calling people out on it at that!

 

[Centurion]

^lol that they wont be..
thats why they should keep quite now..

Yupp. They always bash the competitors until BMW does the same thing themselves.

Super chargers and turbo chargers

Past: They suck, NA is the only way to go.

Present: The turbo charged 335i and 135i

M philosophy

Past: AMG aren't as serious as M, they offer AMG versions of heavy cars like the ML, GL and S-class.

Present: 2 ton M version of the X6 on the way.

Crossovers

Past: It's all marketing rubbish the MB CLS is not a coupe.

Present: The X6 is not an SUV, it's a SAC, a proper coupe.

Super cars

Present: BMW is already a strong brand. MB and Audi only use them to improve their image. Pointless cars.

Future: BMW M10, best super car on the market MB and Audi can't compete with their automatics and four wheel drive

 

[EnI]

Are stupid or what?

M10 won't be a supercar.

A performance top-end coupe - yes, a supercar - no.

In the case you label M10 as supercar, then by the same analogy M3 CSL & M6 can be labeled as supercars as well. And cars like SL63 AMG & CL63 AMG too.

It's kind a ridiculous that some of you demand a supercar, while at the same time you have no clue what supercar actually is.

What is a supercar? Tell me.

 

[RICHBOY]

Yupp. They always bash the competitors until BMW does the same thing themselves.

Super chargers and turbo chargers

Past: They suck, NA is the only way to go.

Present: The turbo charged 335i and 135i

M philosophy

Past: AMG aren't as serious as M, they offer AMG versions of heavy cars like the ML, GL and S-class.

Present: 2 ton M version of the X6 on the way.

Super cars

Present: BMW is already a strong brand. MB and Audi only use them to improve their image. Pointless cars.

Future: BMW M10, best super car on the market MB and Audi can't compete with their automatics and four wheel drive

You really need to stop. You got pie all over some members faces!

 

[LaArtist]

^exactly..
you have a gift of telling the future..
or are they so predictable..lol

 

[EnI]

Luw, don't be a pussy, and name all the people referred as "THEY" in your post.

Who are "THEY"?


Btw, your latest post screams populism all along. Any intentions to enter a politics?

 

[Centurion]

I won't name names since I don't know any. If see the accusations as false and don't feel targeted then you should worry about the post, and the same goes for the others. Do that do recognize themselves should feel their hearts bleed.

Are stupid or what?

M10 won't be a supercar.

A performance top-end coupe - yes, a supercar - no.

Ok, then answer this question. Will it be a one off car like the Z8 looking like an existing car in the line up?

If the answer is yes, then it can be consider a "super car" ie an R8 competitor.

If the answer is no then it can be considered a standard premium car like the M3, RS4 or what ever.

 

[EnI]

Ok, then answer this question. Will it be a one off car like the Z8 looking like an existing car in the line up?

If the answer is yes, then it can be consider a "super car" ie an R8 competitor.

If the answer is no then it can be considered a standard premium car like the M3, RS4 or what ever.

According to my info M10 will be Z8 M with non-folding roof (= Z8 M Coupe) - imagine SL63 AMG with a fixed roof. Similar concept.

And BMW intend to offer carbon fixed roof on M10 only since Z8 will get a folding metal-composite roof.

If IYO M10 is a supercar, than M3 CSL is a supercar as well.

Again: what is a supercar? Define supercar. I have a feeling you mix supercar with performance coupe / roadster.

Btw, was Z8 a supercar? It was a stand alone car, with V8 M engine only, it was fast, it was expensive, it was exclusive (limited production). IMO it was a performance roadster.

 

[RICHBOY]

I won't name names since I don't know any. If see the accusations as false and don't feel targeted then you should worry about the post, and the same goes for the others. Do that do recognize themselves should feel their hearts bleed.




Ok, then answer this question. Will it be a one off car like the Z8 looking like an existing car in the line up?

If the answer is yes, then it can be consider a "super car" ie an R8 competitor.

If the answer is no then it can be considered a standard premium car like the M3, RS4 or what ever.

Hey Luw the next thing they'll be saying is BMW shouldn't make a M7! I can see it now, that's the worst freakin idea ever! Then BMW comes out with one and they'll be like ! God I love this place..

 

[Centurion]

According to my info M10 will be Z8 M with non-folding roof (= Z8 M Coupe) - imagine SL63 AMG with a fixed roof. Similar concept.

And BMW intend to offer carbon fixed roof on M10 only since Z8 will get a folding metal-composite roof.

If IYO M10 is a supercar, than M3 CSL is a supercar as well.

Again: what is a supercar? Define supercar. I have a feeling you mix supercar with performance coupe / roadster.

Btw, was Z8 a supercar? It was a stand alone car, with V8 M engine only, it was fast, it was expensive, it was exclusive (limited production). IMO it was a performance roadster.

So let me get this right. There will be a new BMW Z8 and the M-version of it will be the M10?

In this discussion the word super car is loosely used simply referring to an R8 or 599GTB competitor. More or less one coming in one version with only one engine choice. The Z8 can be considered a "super car". It was an expensive, top end, one off, exclusive and the best performing Bimmer when it was around.

super car or not the M10 as you described it is the exact car we want to see from BMW.

 

[bmer]

MB are selling plenty of SL55s and CL63/CL600s. There is a plenty of demand for two seater cars priced between 120-150k. Although the profit margins for such cars are enormous they also do serve as technical studies pushing development of sports cars forward. But their biggest purpose is giving the brand enthusiast the ultimate car.

The reason why Porsche went a long with the Cayenne was to make some quick cash and lots of it to finance big Panamera project.


Thankfully BMW has registered the trademark M10 which indicates that there will indeed be an Uber sports car to go against cars like the R8.

First of all the SL isn't a limited-production supercar.
Secondly according to the info so far, the Z8/M10 project is similar to SL/SL 63 BS, it's not a supercar.
Thirdly I doubt that Panamera was the reason for Cayenne. New models are long-time investments. No new model is just to "grab fast money" (there are other measures for that) especially with such a limited lineup as Porsche has.
Finally you can propably see that I voted for "one supercar" so I'm not against it.

 

[RICHBOY]

More details on BMW’s upcoming super-sports car

BMW prides itself on having some of the most dynamic and involving vehicles on the market today, but its fleet still lacks a genuine sports car or a true successor for the original M1. Some may argue that BMW already offers the 507hp V10-powered M6 Coupe, but to the purists the M6 is an overweight four-seater GT that compromises performance for comfort.
Instead, BMW is rumored to be working on a new super-sports car to rival Audi’s R8 and Porsche’s 911 with its release scheduled for the end of the decade. According to Germany’s Auto Zeitung, development work is being handled strictly by BMW’s M division with the new model likely to be named the M10. The source also reports that BMW has ruled out building a mid-engined car and instead will go with a front-engine, rear-drive layout.
Powering the M10 will most likely by an upgraded version of the M5/M6 5.0L V10, with power boosted to around the 550hp level, however, a turbocharged version of the 4.0L V8 destined for the new M3 has also been considered.
The key goal of the M10 project is to save weight. Extensive use of carbon-fiber, magnesium and aluminum are to be employed to ensure overall weight is kept below 1,400kg. The styling for the M10 is said to be influenced heavily by the Concept CS, which was displayed recently in Shanghai. The most notable features that should carry over include the oversized kidney grilles, aggressive front bumper and the low roofline.

Well I'm happy where able to put the whole M10 supercar or sports car thing to bed!

 

[bmer]

Yupp. They always bash the competitors until BMW does the same thing themselves.

Super chargers and turbo chargers

Past: They suck, NA is the only way to go.

Present: The turbo charged 335i and 135i

M philosophy

Past: AMG aren't as serious as M, they offer AMG versions of heavy cars like the ML, GL and S-class.

Present: 2 ton M version of the X6 on the way.

Crossovers

Past: It's all marketing rubbish the MB CLS is not a coupe.

Present: The X6 is not an SUV, it's a SAC, a proper coupe.

I'm with you on the two latter ones, if the X6 M weights 2 tons then there isn't very much M philosophy in it and it's not a coupe but rather an SUV with a sleek coupeish roofline.

However the FI part need clearing up. BMW didn't use turbocharging because they weren't happy with how the turbo-lag changed the engine characteristics. They have been testing it all these years and weren't happy with it until now. Turbo technology has advanced vastly within few years as you know (997 TT with variable turbine geometry, BMW x35d engines, Mercedes dropping supercharging in favor of turbos etc.)

 

[EnI]

So let me get this right. There will be a new BMW Z8 and the M-version of it will be the M10?

In this discussion the word super car is loosely used simply referring to an R8 or 599GTB competitor. More or less one coming in one version with only one engine choice.

According to my info there will be Z8 M roadster with folding metal roof (like eg. SL63 AMG) and a coupe spin-off which will be actually just getting fixed carbon fibre roof insted of folding metal one, and M10 bdge insted of Z8 M.

Z8 M roadster & M10 will look almost the same - with a bit different boot lid cut lines.


Regarding R8 - will still be considered as supercar when it gets V10 engine? Since there will be 2 variants offered.

This all thread is a bit fishy --- I'm more & more convinced we do not have same definitions for a term "supercar".


To me supercar is:

a stand alone model (only 1 engine variant offered),
with stand alone design - not just a special racing kit put on a regular model,
highly exclusive - with limited edition production (either defined total number, or very small number per year) - with max 5,000 examples during lifecycle;
very expensive: let's say quite over €100k ; the top model (price & performance wise) in the brand product line
very fast (Vmax over 300km/h)

All the other cars can be labeled as performance coupes / roadsters. Some of them having more mainstream designs & layouts (eg. front engine RWD), some with more exotic designs & layouts (eg. mid-engine AWD, or rear-engine RWD / AWD).

Typical supercars:

MB SLR
Carrera GT
Ferrari Enzo & FXX
Lamborghini Murcielago, Galardo
Bugatti Veyron
Ford GT
upcoming Lexus LF-A
Pagani Zonda

etc

R8 status is fishy.

All the other cars are considered as performance coupes / roadsters / spiders.

 

[LaArtist]

^Sounds so great.. i hope its true..
kinda sad that its not mid engined..

but maybe its all BS and there is no M10??

PS
Lets not aim to high.. SLR, Murcie and such

I would be extremely happy if we can get a BMW to match a SL,911,R8 and so on..