Gone off track Off topic posts from Tesla Model S thread

[Monster]

You better show a picture than claiming.

Claiming what? the picture is there for everyone to see.

 

[Marc-1]

A 997.II GT3 with that wing.
Edit: May be, you are right. Didn't noticed upper part, worse perspective.

 

[Monster]

A 997.II GT3 with that wing.
Edit: May be, you are right. Didn't noticed upper part, worse perspective.

Look at the wing and the wheels, in fact the wheels will tell you exactly which car it is, regardless of the perspective, the photo shows more than enough.

 

[Sunny]

Your photo unmasks you as a hypocrite, no EVs, no Tesla, you prove you don't believe in anything you are telling.

And your posts unmask you don't have basic reading comprehension. Go back to school.

BTW, what is this ugly rear wing on your 991 good for? Not enough weight by the engine installed behind the rear axle? Some kg additional downforce at the rear? Or should the front comes up, more drag for the car that others can easier overtake? Just because we talked about lack of the technical know-how.

lmao, you are an even bigger tool than I imagined!

 

[Marc-1]

Sorry @Sunny, I've largely overestimated your garage (991).

 

[Sunny]

Sorry @Sunny, I've largely overestimated your garage (991).

Accepted. And sorry, I largely overestimated your intelligence.

Please continue off all topic stuff in this thread.

 

[Marc-1]

I see, all arguments in favor of EVs are topic and all arguments that speaks against EVs are off topic (3 pages and scientific facts). That fits quite well with your statements and reveals your intellectual proximity to China.

 

[Monster]

I see, all arguments in favor of EVs are topic and all arguments that speaks against EVs are off topic (3 pages and scientific facts). That fits quite well with your statements and reveals your intellectual proximity to China.

Of course you are correct Marc-1, the Earth is also flat and the unicorn floats around rainbow bridges.

 

[Marc-1]

Of course you are correct Marc-1, the Earth is also flat and the unicorn floats around rainbow bridges.

Indeed, your EVs are green, cleaner, faster and cheaper than ICEs, perfect for travelling long distances, good in rough conditions, Taiga and Tundra, deep cold and tropical climate, and keep you warm through the night caught in snow storm traffic jam, and

ideal vehicle in case of power outages.

(22.300 '16) 20.200 EVs vs. 3.200.000 ICE in 2015, despite the €4.000 boost from government.
@Monster wonders about all the oncoming vehicles on the freeway, he is the only one driving in the right direction.

 

[Monster]

Indeed, your EVs are green, cleaner, faster and cheaper than ICEs, perfect for travelling long distances, good in rough conditions, Taiga and Tundra, deep cold and tropical climate, and keep you warm through the night caught in snow storm traffic jam, and

ideal vehicle in case of power outages.

(22.300 '16) 20.200 EVs vs. 3.200.000 ICE in 2015, despite the €4.000 boost from government.
@Monster wonders about all the oncoming vehicles on the freeway, he is the only one driving in the right direction.

Find a direct quote of me saying EVs are green, cleaner and faster and cheaper than ICE. No you can't because I never said so.

 

[Marc-1]

Find a direct quote of me saying EVs are green, cleaner and faster and cheaper than ICE. No you can't because I never said so.

Oh, I see, moving all scientific facts and arguments against EVs in off topic means you are a democrat, are you not.
You are interested only in an 'Echo-Forum', reading your own opinion; weak position.

 

[martinbo]

You see @Marc-1 there's a fundamental flaw in all of your argumentative points here.

Do you know what it is? I'll tell you...

It's not that you fail to recognise the rational points of view offered by others.
It's not that you're missing everyone's point that electric vehicles are in their absolute infancy.
It's not that you can't appreciate that everyone here loves ICE technology and yet - for some - they realise the obvious benefits of EVs for the vast majority of our planet's commuters.
It's not that you can't see the reason for moving your OFF-TOPIC anti-EV rantings from an Official Tesla threads - as is the custom of our long-standing forum.
It's not even that you're an incredibly rude and insulting person.

No Marc-1, it's none of the above. It's because you are a first-class, stupid prick.

 

[Monster]

Oh, I see, moving all scientific facts and arguments against EVs in off topic means you are a democrat, are you not.
You are interested only in an 'Echo-Forum', reading your own opinion; weak position.

Nice attempt to drag politics into the forum and deflect my previous post. The fact that you couldn't address my post directly is very telling. We welcome all members on this forum, and they are free to post their opinions, within the guidelines of course, and everyone have the same access to all the posts, the fact that you are still allowed to post proves that this is not the so called "echo forum"

But please do continue, I want to see how entertaining you can be.

 

[Marc-1]

It's not that you fail to recognise the rational points of view offered by others.

I didn't read anything like that. There aren't, only lorem ipsum. You can be the first telling something rational 'Pro-EV' but there is no reason to expect this to happen, it's because you are a first-class, stupid prick.

 

[Cashmere]

Great desperation, you don't have a clue, guess what, EVs are not as green as everybody is thinking, they are a new business for making money:

Environmental Research study commissioned by the Federal Ministry for the Environment, Nature Conservation and Nuclear Safety of Germany

In-depth analysis of the environmental balance of electric vehicles was compiled by the Institut für Energie- und Umweltforschung Heidelberg, was founded 1978 by scientists of Heidelberg University.

https://www.umweltbundesamt.de/site...7_2016_umweltbilanz_von_elektrofahrzeugen.pdf
https://www.ifeu.de/english/index.php?seite=startseite
https://www.ifeu.de/english/index.php?seite=mitarbeiter

Page 79-83
Chart 13: Greenhouse Gas Emissions
Chart 14: Acidification Potential - ICE is better
Chart 15: Summer Smog Potential
Chart 16: Eutrophication Potential
Chart 17: Particulate Emissions - ICE is better
Chart 17: Human Toxicity, Comparative Toxicity Units - ICE is better

I would recommend you share your research with the German Environment Minister, Johannes Remmel who recently ordered a Tesla Model S.

German Environment Minister buys a Tesla Model S, takes a swipe at domestic automakers in the process

German government officials most often use German cars as their official vehicles since the German auto industry is one of the country’s most important industries and a source of national pride. That’s why it made the national news this week when the German Environment Minister for North Rhine-Westphalia bought a Tesla Model S as his official car.

The fact that it’s an American car isn’t the main focus. The 110,340 euros ($115,000) price tag is not helping public opinion, as the vehicle has been ordered with public money through the Ministry of the Environment.

When German newspaper Bild asked a spokesperson for the ministry why Environment Minister Johannes Remmel approved the purchase of the expensive vehicle, they responded that the Model S was the only electric vehicle with enough range to enable travel in the large state of North Rhine-Westphalia.

In the process, they highlighted the unfortunate fact that there are no long-range electric vehicles currently available from Germany’s big three automakers: Daimler, BMW, and Volkswagen.

As we reported earlier this week, that’s about to change with several vehicles in development.

The paper also balked at the fact that they went with one of the most expensive versions of the Model S, the Model S 90D, but it’s also one of the versions with the most range.

It’s not the first time this year that the price of Tesla’s vehicles has been in the center of a little controversy in Germany.

When Germany introduced its new plan to boost electric vehicle adoption through new incentives, including a 4,000 € discount at purchase, Tesla claimed that they were purposely left out of the program because of a cap for vehicles with a starting price of less than 60,000 € negotiated by the government and the German auto industry.

Since the cap was only for the starting price of the car, Tesla later unbundled a bunch of basic options of the Model S in order for its customers to get access to EV incentives in Germany. But through that loophole, even Tesla’s top-of-the-line $120,000+ Model S P100D had access to the discount since it’s technically just a different configuration of the Model S, which now had a starting price under 60,000 €. The government was accused of financing vehicles for the rich.

Technically, the Ministry of the Environment should get access to the 4,000 € discount for their Model S and therefore, the German automakers are partly paying for the vehicle since they are contributing to the fund to finance the incentive.

Tesla has been investing more heavily in Germany lately with the acquisition of a German engineering firm to create ‘Tesla Advanced Automation Germany’. During the announcement, Tesla CEO Elon Musk said the automaker is partly becoming a “German company.”

https://electrek.co/2016/12/28/german-environment-minister-tesla-model-s/

 

[Marc-1]

I would recommend you share your research with the German Environment Minister, Johannes Remmel who recently ordered a Tesla Model S.

I would but he would not understand. Johannes Remmel, member of the Green Party, began a teaching degree in the subjects of History, Catholic Theology and Sport.

His party colleague Oliver Krischer said:
"If the Paris agreement to curb climate-warming emissions is to be taken seriously, no new combustion engine cars should be allowed on roads after 2030."

Member of the Green Party would ban ICE next year if possible. They have lots of ideas, how people have to live and would realize this by order prescribe.

Anyway, in the Green party is a competition, who is the greenest - a Tesla can help.

But Remmel isn't the prove, that Germany goes electric. As I mentioned, (22.300 '16) 20.200 EVs vs. 3.200.000 ICE in 2015, despite the €4.000 boost from government and Tesla target for Germany stands at 1,000 Model S a month, but 2016 until now 1.314 vs. 1.348 in 2015.

 

[Matski]

As I mentioned, (22.300 '16) 20.200 EVs vs. 3.200.000 ICE in 2015,

USA, c. 1900... 24,000,000 horses vs. 4000 cars...

Failure to recognise potential benefits that may reside on the other side of a technical challenge is to stand knee deep in horse shit, proudly proclaiming "Get a Horse!". I suspect many people reading this thread already recognise the limitations and drawbacks of EV's, what they also recognise is that the potential yet to be unlocked is well worth pursuing - just as those who actually had technical know-how did over a hundred years ago.

__


FWIW, I'll state again, my personal preference at the moment would be for something like a 330e. I'm pissing away diesel at around 15 mpg because of many short trips made with a cold engine... I could easily charge an EV at home, and at work, and pay a fraction of the price... on the flipside, if I need to drive 500 miles to get into Europe, I don't want to be messing around finding public charging points and factoring in 30 minute stops here and there, an EV would be quite frustrating. For me personally PHEV is the way to go, and it's not because I care about the environment, it's because it is the more elegant solution for me.... I'd like to add, I laugh in the face of range anxiety - If you've recently owned an early 80's BMW with a leaky service indicator light battery, and an odometer whose plastic gears have disintegrated away, you'll know what I mean

... having said that, the possibility of moving from burning non-renewables on a per metre driven basis, to using stored energy from renewable sources is an intriguing one... it is a technical challenge to be embraced! Similarly, where is the next big shift in internal combustion efficiency going to come from? We've been at it for over 100 years, we've improved it dramatically, but now, where will the gains come from? How will we move ICE to a point where they can utilise renewable resources? These too are technical, geographical and political challenges not to shy away from.

 

[Marc-1]

Failure to recognise potential benefits that may reside on the other side of a technical challenge is to stand knee deep in horse shit, proudly proclaiming "Get a Horse!".

That's exactly what I wanted to say. Speaking of 'potential benefits' but don't telling which should be. Reading the scientific study and taking Minister Remmels Tesla (BEV 400 would be in the charts), so we find, this EV cause more CO2 emissions in Life-Time, 3x low particulate emissions, 3x human-toxic potential (cancerogenic heavy metals, Chromtrioxid emissions, cadmium, mercury, zinc, lead, nickel, lithium and manganese), and 2,5x acidification potential.

Same results come from Honk Kong: Electric shock – Tesla cars in Hong Kong more polluting than petrol models, report claims

Let us hear what Thomas Edison On Energy Storage has to say:
'The storage battery is, in my opinion, a catch-penny, a sensation, a mechanism for swindling by stocking companies. The storage battery is one of those peculiar things which appeal to the imagination, and no more perfect thing could be desired by stock swindlers than that very self-same thing.'

FWIW, I'll state again, my personal preference at the moment would be for something like a 330e. For me personally PHEV is the way to go, and it's not because I care about the environment, it's because it is the more elegant solution for me.... I'd like to add, I laugh in the face of range anxiety

You didn't understand a PHV. Comparing 330e with 330i, you will pay several thousends of dollars more and get
184 hp + 88 electric hp vs. 252 hp 330i
+ 165 kg more weight than BMW 330i
- 110 L less luggage compartment
- 19 L less fuel tank
- 25 km/h Vmax (225 km/h) less than BMW 330i 250 km/h

For what reason? Claims are:
2,1 L/100km acc. BMW vs. 6,5 L/100km EU-Drittelmix
Test 1) 6,8 L/100km vs. 8,1 L/100km
Test 2) 6,9 L/100km vs. 9,5 L/100km

You will get a heavier car with less boot space, less speed, for what? Saving fuel after given several thousends more before?

Where is your battery pack to find in your 330e - unter the trunk. Watch carefully Moose test Mercedes C350 e (Hybrid) with same position under the trunk.

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'Motor Trend': 2016 BMW 330e Plug-In Hybrid First Test Review
The 330e starts at $44,695, representing a premium of $4,950 over a base 330i. The EPA only assigns the 330e a 72-mpg-e (mpg equivalent) and 31-mpg combined rating, but in our Real MPG tests the plug-in achieved 27.4/38.6 mpg city/highway, which tops the 2017 330i’s EPA rating of 23/34 mpg. The model’s fuel economy numbers are also higher than our previous long-term diesel-powered 328d xDrive wagon, which scored 19.3/35.0 Real MPG.

 

[klier]

I didn't read anything like that. There aren't, only lorem ipsum. You can be the first telling something rational 'Pro-EV' but there is no reason to expect this to happen, it's because you are a first-class, stupid prick.

WTF, man!

 

[Marc-1]

WTF, man!

I didn't get your arguments 'Pro-EV' and 'Pro-PHV'.
Listen, all facts telling, EVs and PHVs are not the solution in either terms.

Everything you brought into the discussion is 'WTF'. That means, you have been outed as ...