M3/M4 New BMW M3 Chop!

[Deutsch]

The thing is that the M3 has a front located engine and with configuration it will impossibly be able to beat the more composed 911 or the well balanced F430. It will probably beat the cayman around the ring but give the cayman the same power and it will without hesitation beat the M3 on any track. Porsche are simply too good to be true.

I think your brand favoritism is hindering your ability to judge. First off, how on earth does the 911 and F430 being rear engined make the cars any more capable performance wise than the M3??? If anything at all, it's the Cayman that has all 3 cars licked in the handling department thanks to the fact that it's engine sits closer to the middle of the car, which in the end is thee most ideal engine configuration for the simple fact that the weight is more evenly distributed over the front and rear axles. As far as I'm concerned the cars being rear engined doesn't make a difference in their capability compared to that of a front engined car, it's how everything (chassis, engine, etc.) harmonizes together on the drive. I'm afraid you missed out on one other thing, though Porsche without a doubt a superior car maker to just about any other automaker (#1 on my list always, I just don't see the need to shout it, the brand is stand alone in my eyes w/ out peer, though cars are open for defeat), there's a saying, "if it's 'too good to be true', more than likely it probably is.

 

[LaArtist]

when BMW fans compare the M3 to F430 and 911 Turbos and such.. i must say that its an extreme overestimation ... more like a wet fanboy dream

 

[Matt]

I think its going to be right up the Carrera S's alley in terms of speed and lap times although I do think it will break 8 minutes on the nurb....I think..

 

[wltsm]

I think its going to be right up the Carrera S's alley in terms of speed and lap times although I do think it will break 8 minutes on the nurb....I think..

It would be nice if this was true, but considering the M6 can't even beat the Carrera S in a comparison with so much more power, how is the M3 going to have a chance?

 

[Zafiro]

It would be nice if this was true, but considering the M6 can't even beat the Carrera S in a comparison with so much more power, how is the M3 going to have a chance?

the M6 is heavy, the M3 weigh less but I dont think they are aiming to beat the Carrera, they are going after RS4

 

[wltsm]

Oh right, well the RS4 should be easy meat!

 

[Imhotep Evil]

The thing is that the M3 has a front located engine and with configuration it will impossibly be able to beat the more composed 911 or the well balanced F430. It will probably beat the cayman around the ring but give the cayman the same power and it will without hesitation beat the M3 on any track. Porsche are simply too good to be true.

You're BS again Luw.

1.

The F430 is rather mid-rear configuration, more like Cayman, as oposed to the rear-end configuration of the 911, witch is something like a mirrowed/reversed Audi.

A BMW is actually a front pushed twards the middle, unlike Audi pushed twards the front, altough only the Z4 is actually a pure front midship architecture.

It's a better configuration than 911s.

The 911 is flawed car since, since it's actually and evolution of the 356, witch is a basicaly a Bettle evolution/derivation.

When F. Porsche created the Bettle, he pushed the engine in the back not beacause driving dynamics and/or performance were important, but because
it gave the car more interior space.

(This Porsche RWD rear-end engine architecture, was droped in favoure of its mirrored/reversed version the FWD way-front-engine architecture, witch becamed popular with the Mini.)

Then the Porche company took the Bettle, choped the roof and voila the 356.

Then camed the 911, witch was suposed to die in the 1970s when the 928, was suposed to replace this neaderthalian bettle architecture, witch it seemed was no longer capable to survive the new saftey and emision laws; not to mention that the 911 was never made to have an engine bigger that 3 litres.

The fact the 911 has survived and is such a great car is Porsche's great merit.

That's what the 911 is all about, the triumph of engineering over flaw, victory against all the odds.


2.

And a Cayman would beat a 911 too given more power

 

[Top Secret]

I think your brand favoritism is hindering your ability to judge.

Does anyone find this quite ironic?

The man who thinks the E90 M3 will "munch" the 911 and the F430 says brand bias is hindering their ability to judge if they disagree with his statement.

BTW, Imhotep, while the M3 would've been a more composed car than the early 911's, with it's scary snap-oversteer, it's arguably the opposite now - despite the flawed engineering behind the 911, the car is more neutral than most front-engined cars, including the M3.

And furthermore, what's with this endless and pointless dribble you always manage to conjure up in your posts?

 

[Deutsch]

Does anyone find this quite ironic?

The man who thinks the E90 M3 will "munch" the 911 and the F430 says brand bias is hindering their ability to judge if they disagree with his statement.

BTW, Imhotep, while the M3 would've been a more composed car than the early 911's, with it's scary snap-oversteer, it's arguably the opposite now - despite the flawed engineering behind the 911, the car is more neutral than most front-engined cars, including the M3.

And furthermore, what's with this endless and pointless dribble you always manage to conjure up in your posts?

How old are you? 16???? You sure as hell act like it. It seems as if you always have some wise crack post to make that's suppose to make you come across as if you have something truly profound to say. Save it. If I were you I'd watch my words, cuz right now you're talking out your... euhm.

What I love is how I made a very general statement and everyone is trying to twist it to suit their cause for launching some sort of attack... if you like what I have to say, great, you don't? Sucks for you, move on... Fact still stands that the new M3 will represent a step up in the M3's performance game, whether we'd like to believe it or not. Noticed the word "munch", I didn't say "beat", it will be right up there w/ those cars, no doubt about it, and it will be a good fight. I trust that BMW M is going to make a true thouroughbred sports car w/ the M3, it's the brands halo car and they know that they have to deliver. Not even the M5 or M6 has the kind of cachet the M3 has, it's attainable, class best performance showcase for M GmbH. For all the nay sayers that think the M3 is some kind of Jr. performer, there will be, without a doubt a compsrison test between the M3 and the cars mentioned plus many many many more.

 

[wltsm]

OK guys, it's getting a bit heated here, calm down!

To cool everyone down, I'll say the M3 is gonna suck big time! You can't call me a fanboy now!j/k

 

[Deutsch]

I don't think this is a case of "fanboy" antics as much as it is "tunnel vision". Everyone is only seeing what they want to see instead of having an open mind, open to a possibility, however close or remote it may be in realtiy. This is getting very off topic though. So for that I do apologize.

 

[Centurion]

You're BS again Luw.

1.

The F430 is rather mid-rear configuration, more like Cayman, as oposed to the rear-end configuration of the 911, witch is something like a mirrowed/reversed Audi.

A BMW is actually a front pushed twards the middle, unlike Audi pushed twards the front, altough only the Z4 is actually a pure front midship architecture.

It's a better configuration than 911s.

The 911 is flawed car since, since it's actually and evolution of the 356, witch is a basicaly a Bettle evolution/derivation.

When F. Porsche created the Bettle, he pushed the engine in the back not beacause driving dynamics and/or performance were important, but because
it gave the car more interior space.

(This Porsche RWD rear-end engine architecture, was droped in favoure of its mirrored/reversed version the FWD way-front-engine architecture, witch becamed popular with the Mini.)

Then the Porche company took the Bettle, choped the roof and voila the 356.

Then camed the 911, witch was suposed to die in the 1970s when the 928, was suposed to replace this neaderthalian bettle architecture, witch it seemed was no longer capable to survive the new saftey and emision laws; not to mention that the 911 was never made to have an engine bigger that 3 litres.

The fact the 911 has survived and is such a great car is Porsche's great merit.

That's what the 911 is all about, the triumph of engineering over flaw, victory against all the odds.


2.

And a Cayman would beat a 911 too given more power

Me, BS? explain please.
Everything you mentioned about the F430's, Audi's and BMW's is neither incorrect nor unknown to me. Yes! Technically the Z4 has a better configuration than the 911 but in reality it is the 911 which is the star, despite it having the engine in the wrong place.

More over this whole E92 beating the 911 issue doesn't bother me at ll since I doubt it will happen. I'll beleive it when I see it but you guys known which one I would place my money on.

 

[Deutsch]

but you guys known which one I would place my money on.

Which is why you say exactly what you say.

 

[Imhotep Evil]

Me, BS? explain please.
Everything you mentioned about the F430's, Audi's and BMW's is neither incorrect nor unknown to me. Yes! Technically the Z4 has a better configuration than the 911 but in reality it is the 911 which is the star, despite it having the engine in the wrong place.

Yes you do go on some BS parades some times.

And the greatness of Porsche 911 is being the star despite having an engine in the wrong place.

What I wanted to say was that the engine of M3 will be in a better position, and it will be a good balanced car.

Ofcourse comparing it to F430 is pure BS from some highly biased BMW fan(s), althought the CSL will slap it silly.

The M3 will probably be something inbetween the (997) Carrera and the Carrera S.

More over this whole E92 beating the 911 issue doesn't bother me at ll since I doubt it will happen. I'll beleive it when I see it but you guys known which one I would place my money on.

It depends what 911 variant we are talking about.

Anyway, BMW can beat Porsche if they want too.

 

[Zafiro]

the 997S and the laptime 8.05 min was done with ceramic brakes. If the M3 dont get ceramic brakes it wont beat the 997S.

 

[warot]

when BMW fans compare the M3 to F430 and 911 Turbos and such.. i must say that its an extreme overestimation ... more like a wet fanboy dream

I agree that comparing the regular M3 with the 911 and F430 might be a bit too much. Now if we are talking about a CSL, now the tables have turned because it's a totally different animal.
A CSL laps the nurburgring in 7:50 while the F430 does it in 7:55. Like I said though, it depends what variants you are looking at.

 

[Top Secret]

How old are you? 16???? You sure as hell act like it. It seems as if you always have some wise crack post to make that's suppose to make you come across as if you have something truly profound to say. Save it. If I were you I'd watch my words, cuz right now you're talking out your... euhm.

What I love is how I made a very general statement and everyone is trying to twist it to suit their cause for launching some sort of attack... if you like what I have to say, great, you don't? Sucks for you, move on... Fact still stands that the new M3 will represent a step up in the M3's performance game, whether we'd like to believe it or not. Noticed the word "munch", I didn't say "beat", it will be right up there w/ those cars, no doubt about it, and it will be a good fight. I trust that BMW M is going to make a true thouroughbred sports car w/ the M3, it's the brands halo car and they know that they have to deliver. Not even the M5 or M6 has the kind of cachet the M3 has, it's attainable, class best performance showcase for M GmbH. For all the nay sayers that think the M3 is some kind of Jr. performer, there will be, without a doubt a compsrison test between the M3 and the cars mentioned plus many many many more.

Yeah, Deutsch, I am actually 16 - is that a problem for you? Am I too 'immature' to be on this forum? Please, save the cliche 'age' argument, it's getting old.

No, sorry, the fact that you think the M3 is going to "munch" (which is more similar to 'beat' then 'compete against') the 911 and the F430 is just plain BS. I'm merely being a realist. I appreciate that the M3 will be good, but better? No, not likely.

Oh, and save the BMW fanboy spiel - I've heard it too many times by the insane number of BMW fanboys here.

And, oh! Your 'threats' might be threatening in real life, but here, it's just funny. Keep that in mind.

 

[Matt]

I actually think BMW will get this thing to the point where it's competing in lap times with the Carrera S, with or without ceramic brakes. It all depends on how much power they can soak out of that 4.0 litre and if its anything like the last m3 (which was a 107 hp per litre) they will be able to grunt 430ish hp out of that bad boy. The hope is that BMW uses plenty of light weight materials to keep the weight down. It should also be weighted better than the Carrera because BMW almost always gets that 50-50 weight distribution.


P.S. Im seeing alot hate here...and boy am I getting alot of entertainment out of it...Keep it coming before a mod takes over lol.

 

[LaArtist]

I agree that comparing the regular M3 with the 911 and F430 might be a bit too much. Now if we are talking about a CSL, now the tables have turned because it's a totally different animal.
A CSL laps the nurburgring in 7:50 while the F430 does it in 7:55. Like I said though, it depends what variants you are looking at.

ofcourse the CSL is a whole diffrent issue..
but like i said overestimation is always fun..but rearly valid or real..

PS
If you want to compare track oriented bimmers with other cars..then throw in track oriented versions of the other brands to..
F430 Challange Stradale vs new M3 CSL vs GT3..

 

[Deutsch]

Yeah, Deutsch, I am actually 16 - is that a problem for you? Am I too 'immature' to be on this forum? Please, save the cliche 'age' argument, it's getting old.

No, sorry, the fact that you think the M3 is going to "munch" (which is more similar to 'beat' then 'compete against') the 911 and the F430 is just plain BS. I'm merely being a realist. I appreciate that the M3 will be good, but better? No, not likely.

Oh, and save the BMW fanboy spiel - I've heard it too many times by the insane number of BMW fanboys here.

And, oh! Your 'threats' might be threatening in real life, but here, it's just funny. Keep that in mind.

First off I don't reason w/ stupidity, if I wanted to make a threat, I would have said something w/ ten times more weight than what I did say, and that was more of a warning so you'd stop making a fool (for the lack of a better word) out of yourself.

I could honestly care less about what anyone else thinks about my idea on the performance and competition of the new E92 M3. In time you guys will see exactly what it is that I'm trying to say once the car gets here. In the mean time, play bandwagon all you want.

P.S. Im seeing alot hate here...and boy am I getting alot of entertainment out of it...Keep it coming before a mod takes over lol.

your point is? Grow up Matt, you're not in highschool anymore....