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Meaning you don't have one because what a lambo driving through a flooded street vs a Tesla driving driving a road in the rain with no flooding is not the same scenario. You're implying it is the same thing and it isn't, that is why I asked what your point was. Maybe you should contact lambo and tell them to add flooded street testing to their low slung sports cars.

M
 
Yeah like the nonsense excuses you tried to post here before about their piss poor build quality and how it was because of their needing to fund their tech. Now you're so thick that you can't even see what happening right now because you're totally hosed with BS. Tesla's poor build quality IS NOT a thing of the past.

M
I will repeat it in a way that even you will be able to undestand. Tesla is constantly but gradually improving. Not everything is solved. The Chinese factory assembles only Model 3 and Y and their assembly quality is perfect. They do not assemble model S and X there. The next factories with great assembly quality (after the initial ramp up of production) are going to be the Berlin factory (again only Model 3 and mostly Y) and Austin (Model 3, Y and Cybertruck). The Tesla Model S and X received great new technologies but their assembly is still ussing methods of the past and that's why they will proceed carrying all the drawbacks that come with these methods.
 
I will repeat it in a way that even you will be able to undestand. Tesla is constantly but gradually improving. Not everything is solved. The Chinese factory assembles only Model 3 and Y and their assembly quality is perfect. They do not assemble model S and X there. The next factories with great assembly quality (after the initial ramp up of production) are going to be the Berlin factory (again only Model 3 and mostly Y) and Austin (Model 3, Y and Cybertruck). The Tesla Model S and X received great new technologies but their assembly is still ussing methods of the past and that's why they will proceed carrying all the drawbacks that come with these methods.

I will repeat it in a way that you even you will be able to understand, what you're saying is shoulda, woulda, coulda excuses. Some of the most ridiculous bullshit I have ever read in defense of building junk. You seem to think that because you can craft a ridiculous excuse that it somehow makes it acceptable or okay. I already knew that everyone was not "solved", that is what I said from the start. So again you can't spin or excuse it away and the predictions of better quality from new factories in the future is just laughable. I don't understand what you're posting this for honestly. It's really stupid to me.

M
 
You keep repeating the same things over and over and I'm not sure why at this point. Again, I never said that the Germans were perfect, I said that they were better than Tesla. Not sure what you aren't getting here. Do you want me to dig for the shit that Tesla does? Nothing speaks higher about Tesla quality when you have to find old pics of older German cars vs new cars being delivered now from Tesla.
Ok got it, tesla sucks.


On topic -
BEV registrations in the U.S. - January 2022
  • Tesla Model Y - 18,549 (36.8% of all BEVs)
  • Tesla Model 3 - 13,604 (27% of all BEVs)
  • Tesla Model S - 3,903
  • Ford Mustang Mach-E - 2,781
  • Nissan LEAF - 1,479
  • Hyundai Ioniq 5 - 1,253
  • Volkswagen ID.4 - 1,153
  • Kia Niro EV - 1,146
  • Tesla Model X - 1,106
  • Porsche Taycan (all versions) - 972
  • other - 4,438
  • Total - 50,384 (up 62% from 31,174) and 4.3% share (up from 2.3%)
    including 37,162 Tesla (73.8% of the total) and 13,222 non-Tesla
 
Ok got it, tesla sucks.


On topic -
BEV registrations in the U.S. - January 2022
  • Tesla Model Y - 18,549 (36.8% of all BEVs)
  • Tesla Model 3 - 13,604 (27% of all BEVs)
  • Tesla Model S - 3,903
  • Ford Mustang Mach-E - 2,781
  • Nissan LEAF - 1,479
  • Hyundai Ioniq 5 - 1,253
  • Volkswagen ID.4 - 1,153
  • Kia Niro EV - 1,146
  • Tesla Model X - 1,106
  • Porsche Taycan (all versions) - 972
  • other - 4,438
  • Total - 50,384 (up 62% from 31,174) and 4.3% share (up from 2.3%)
    including 37,162 Tesla (73.8% of the total) and 13,222 non-Tesla

Yes build quality wise they sure do.

M
 
I will repeat it in a way that you even you will be able to understand, what you're saying is shoulda, woulda, coulda excuses. Some of the most ridiculous bullshit I have ever read in defense of building junk. You seem to think that because you can craft a ridiculous excuse that it somehow makes it acceptable or okay. I already knew that everyone was not "solved", that is what I said from the start. So again you can't spin or excuse it away and the predictions of better quality from new factories in the future is just laughable. I don't understand what you're posting this for honestly. It's really stupid to me.

M
Ok, I've overestimated, that even you would understand.
 
Ok, I've overestimated, that even you would understand.

There is nothing to understand. You're just posting bullshit excuses. You're telling me that they're getting better but aren't quite there yet. WTF? What is there to understand? I TOLD YOU from the start that they still had junk quality as they're still delivering poorly built vehicles from the California factory in 2022. Let me guess what is the excuse now? The California factory doesn't count anymore? The rest of what you're posting is not factual, it's just your tired speculation about new factories and what quality should be like. Again, what is there to "understand" here? Could it be possible that you're lost in your own minutia?

M
 
There is nothing to understand. You're just posting bullshit excuses. You're telling me that they're getting better but aren't quite there yet. WTF? What is there to understand? I TOLD YOU from the start that they still had junk quality. The rest of what you're posting is not factual, it's just your tired speculation about new factories and what quality should be like. Again, what is there to "understand" here? Could it be possible that you're lost in your own minutia?

M
The quality of the Chinese made cars is factual. What's so hard to understand. The next two new factories are using the same assembly lines like the ones in China only with some further improvement, which based on the high level of automation guarantees the high quality. And these three factories at the end of 2023 are going to produce more than 3 mln cars per year with high quality (recently 1 mln cars coming from China are with this high quality). The Chinese made cars are not hypothetical. Try to comprehend this.
 
The quality of the Chinese made cars is factual.

Yep. Also according to a number of certified, independent German automotive quality control authorities as well. Especially when it comes to Tesla, the cars assembled in the companys' Chinese facilities are vastly superior to those produced in the U.S. in terms of assembly quality, fit and finish. It will be interesting to see how the Grünheide-produced Model Ys' will fare.
 
The quality of the Chinese made cars is factual. What's so hard to understand. The next two new factories are using the same assembly lines like the ones in China only with some further improvement, which based on the high level of automation guarantees the high quality. And these three factories at the end of 2023 are going to produce more than 3 mln cars per year with high quality (recently 1 mln cars coming from China are with this high quality). The Chinese made cars are not hypothetical. Try to comprehend this.

Why would I care about Chinese made cars in America when that isn't where our market gets it's cars from? Again, what does what is going to happen in future do with the junk on the ground right now from existing factories? I'm trying to get you see that your hypothesis about the future doesn't mean squat for the customers taking delivery right now. Don't you get that? Are you not able to use google or youtube to see what is actually happening NOW vs 2023??? Try to comprehend that the Chinese made cars don't mean squat here. Do you get that? Brand new model X and S models are being delivered RIGHT NOW as junk. What does 2023 have to do with or for that? You're arguing bullshit about the future vs what is being delivered RIGHT NOW.

M
 
Why would I care about Chinese made cars in America when that isn't where our market gets it's cars from? Again, what does what is going to happen in future do with the junk on the ground right now from existing factories? I'm trying to get you see that your hypothesis about the future doesn't mean squat for the customers taking delivery right now. Don't you get that? Are you not able to use google or youtube to see what is actually happening NOW vs 2023??? Try to comprehend that the Chinese made cars don't mean squat here. Do you get that? Brand new model X and S models are being delivered RIGHT NOW as junk. What does 2023 have to do with or for that? You're arguing bullshit about the future vs what is being delivered RIGHT NOW.

M
It means that they make all the correct steps to solve the issues. And the issues will be solved in 2023. The customers of all current US made Teslas, according to most of the studies are happy with their cars, which means that they are glad that they can get in 2022 a car which technologically is 10 years ahead of all the rest, despite having to cope with bad quality. The alternative is no Tesla up to 2023. Obviously their choice is the former.
 
CAN A MOD CLEAN THIS THREAD!!!!

It's completely overflowing with off topic BS. This is ridiculous, I come here to see sales numbers.

The customers of all current US made Teslas, according to most of the studies are happy with their cars, which means that they are glad that they can get in 2022 a car which technologically is 10 years ahead of all the rest

LMAO
 
It means that they make all the correct steps to solve the issues. And the issues will be solved in 2023. The customers of all current US made Teslas, according to most of the studies are happy with their cars, which means that they are glad that they can get in 2022 a car which technologically is 10 years ahead of all the rest, despite having to cope with bad quality. The alternative is no Tesla up to 2023. Obviously their choice is the former.
Which doesn't mean anything for the vehicles being delivered right now. Not sure what you aren't getting here. This is 2022, NOT 2023. Do you honestly not get that what is being delivered today is junk? Surveys about being happy with a car doesn't mean they are of great quality. They do love the tech so they excuse the piss poor quality. Same way many have done the same things with European and American cars in the past, they love XYZ so they forgive flaws about the vehicles. Furthermore you don't know what you're talking about as far as studies in the USA because Tesla won't even let all their customers participate in quality studies in every market. The studies you're talking about are some bullshit about how you "feel" about your car, not an actual measure of quality. So you're just plain wrong here and again don't know what you're talking about. Tesla's "quality" whenever there is even attempt to measure their quality comes in the at the bottom of the list, dead last whenever there is enough data to examine it. You're just cheerleading now and pretending to be so slow that you can't understand what I'm saying here about the here and now, vs improvements to be made in 2023. I mean yeah I would agree that when you make cars as poorly as they do it can't get much worse.

M
 
Which doesn't mean anything for the vehicles being delivered right now. Not sure what you aren't getting here. This is 2022, NOT 2023. Do you honestly not get that what is being delivered today is junk? Surveys about being happy with a car doesn't mean they are of great quality. They do love the tech so they excuse the piss poor quality. Same way many have done the same things with European and American cars in the past, they love XYZ so they forgive flaws about the vehicles. Furthermore you don't know what you're talking about as far as studies in the USA because Tesla won't even let all their customers participate in quality studies in every market. The studies you're talking about are some bullshit about how you "feel" about your car, not an actual measure of quality. So you're just plain wrong here and again don't know what you're talking about. Tesla's "quality" whenever there is even attempt to measure their quality comes in the at the bottom of the list, dead last whenever there is enough data to examine it. You're just cheerleading now and pretending to be so slow that you can't understand what I'm saying here about the here and now, vs improvements to be made in 2023. I mean yeah I would agree that when you make cars as poorly as they do it can't get much worse.

M
Currently 65% of all delivered Teslas are made in China. Can't you get this?
 
Mercedes-Benz-Benz Cars & Vans
Net profits 13.9 billion euros

BMW group
Net profits € 12,463 million

You can't be a sales leader and the high margin leader at the same time.
Yes you can and in premium brands it is very usual if they are well managed

If we subtract the profits from the 386,000 commercial vehicles (non-premium vans) that are included, BMW is top in sales and profits (this was the case during the 10 years that BMW was also No.1 in world sales)

They can buy Alpina...
Impressive figures (until 2019 they had never exceeded 9.0 billion, today the figures are + - /15 billion dolars

I think they even surpassed VW if I'm not mistaken
 
Mercedes-Benz-Benz Cars & Vans
Net profits 13.9 billion euros

BMW group
Net profits € 12,463 million


Yes you can and in premium brands it is very usual if they are well managed

If we subtract the profits from the 386,000 commercial vehicles (non-premium vans) that are included, BMW is top in sales and profits (this was the case during the 10 years that BMW was also No.1 in world sales)

They can buy Alpina...
Impressive figures (until 2019 they had never exceeded 9.0 billion, today the figures are + - /15 billion dolars

I think they even surpassed VW if I'm not mistaken

This isn’t a discussion about the current state. 2 years ago Ola said he wants to take their profit margin to 10% or higher beyond 2025. BMW is not aiming for the same target, which is fine.
 
This isn’t a discussion about the current state. 2 years ago Ola said he wants to take their profit margin to 10% or higher beyond 2025. BMW is not aiming for the same target, which is fine.
I know, Ola made a whopping 13%.

I'm just posting the excellent and fresh financial statement 2021 presented today by BMW, where it also reflects a historical record with a 227% increase in earnings and their profit margin.

 
The February sales numbers of Sports Cars in Germany looks impressive for the Porsche 911. Although the sales figures for the Boxster and Cayman are very minute.

Check how many Ferraris were bought by wealthy Germans!!

The Ferrari F8 was the 11th most popular sports car in Germany with 35 cars sold, the Roma was 14th with 22 units sold and the SF90 was 16th with 13 cars sold!!

New sports car registrations February 2022
PlaceModelApprovals
1PORSCHE 911672
2BMW Z4213
3MERCEDES AMG GT154
4AUDI TT141
5FORD MUSTANG132
6MERCEDES E-CLASS COUPE96
7PORSCHE BOXSTER95
8JAGUAR F-TYPE75
9PORSCHE CAYMAN48
10AUDI R836
11FERRARI F835
12ALPINE A11027
13TOYOTA SUPRA23
14FERRARI ROMA22
15ASTON MARTIN V813
16FERRARI SF9013
17ASTON MARTIN DB117
18FERRARI PORTOFINO7
19LEXUS LC4
20FERRARI 4881
 

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