VW debuts 503-hp Design Vision GTI at Wörthersee

[LaArtist]

Wow looks insane..i like it

 

[Sunny]

As for the VR6, I'll give you a hmm. I counted six cylinders, but it's certainly no V6. Then again, VAG doesn't have any I6 history, so it must be a VR6. I bet there must be a different way to figure that out, though.

(Until somebody comes up saying he/she read the press release)

Well, that is VR6 for you. With it's very narrow V angle not really a V6 but not an I6 either, but something in between -

As for the car, not too crazy about it's transformer-ified looks.

 

[Giannis]

Well, that is VR6 for you. With it's very narrow V angle not really a V6 but not an I6 either, but something in between -

Thanks, even though I knew that

I just wondered if there was another way to deduct that the engine is a VR6, given the photographs of page 1, other than what I thought of.

 

[Sunny]

Thanks, even though I knew that

I just wondered if there was another way to deduct that the engine is a VR6, given the photographs of page 1, other than what I thought of.

Haha, yes, I had a feeling.

As for how to tell, well there is the label on the engine cover which claims it is a V6, I guess that rules out an I6. And by appearance it is clearly not a traditional V6 either.

 

[martinbo]

Guys, the plumbing of a VR6-type engine is the dead give away: inlet manifold on one side (front-facing), exhausts and turbos on the other (rear-facing) in this case. A traditional V6 has exhaust manifolds either side of the engine and the induction system running into the centre of the Vee. Even in the case of a hot-side inside configuration there would still be the same manifold either side of the engine.

If this truly is the engine that's to power Macan and certain Audis then who saw it coming that it would be a VR6-type engine?

 

[Kilcrohane]

If this truly is the engine that's to power Macan and certain Audis then who saw it coming that it would be a VR6-type engine?

it isn't. The Macan('MLB' Q5-based) we already know for definite gets the brand new Porsche 3 litre bi-turbo V6, as just launched in the facelifted Panamera.

This new VR6 will, if it ever goes into a production vehicle, be for FWD architecture, transverse engined cars.

The surprise here is that VW would appear to not be solely relying on high output 4 cylinder engines to counter the likes of Mercedes-AMG's 360 PS 4-cyl. engine.

To have both circa 300 PS 4-cyl units for the likes of the Golf R, S3 and next TT-S and the option of a very high power, extremely compact V(R)6 for markets like the US and China could have thrown a curve ball into AMG's, and possibly BMW M's plans. A circa 350 horsepower 4-cyl engine is a wonderful thing but the heart still says a six-cylinder one with similar fuel efficiency if they can manage it is even better.

 

[Deckhook]

The VR6 was a clever solution of getting six cylinders into a fwd setup but if I recall correctly it wasn't that great when it came to economy and probably emissions but boy did it make a lovely note IMO and by all accounts could be tuned to some dizzy heights.

Does anyone know why it was dropped only to return again here and now?

 

[martinbo]

Thanks K,

Informative as usual. People are getting their Vees confused. This is not the V6 that's in the Panamera or forthcoming Macan. Whilst it's obvious that the VR-layout is engineered for transverse applications primarily, VR-type engines have been used in longitudinally oriented applications in Porsche and VAG products in the past. So it's not exclusively precluded from being implemented length-ways.

Sorry to quote this lot but hey:

Cutaway shots of the Volkswagen Golf GTI Design Vision GTI concept have revealed that it appears to use a new VR6 engine, as opposed to the previously rumoured V6.
Volkswagen has not confirmed whether the engine is indeed a VR6 but, judging by the configuration of the intake and exhaust systems, it seems likely to be the case.
The new six-cylinder engine, which has a single cylinder head and a claimed 15-degree angle between its rows of cylinders, is said to displace 3.0 litres. Thanks to direct fuel injection and twin turbochargers, its output is stated to be a substantial 496bhp and 413lb ft.
It's reputedly set to see service in future models, which may include high-performance versions of the Volkswagen CC and the recently unveiled CrossBlue coupé — although the engine will most likely be detuned for economy, emissions and drivability reasons.
A senior Porsche engineer confirmed that the new Volkswagen engine was a narrow-angle VR6, but that it wasn't in any way related to new engines being developed for the Porsche Macan.
It's not yet known whether the new unit is a development of an existing VR6 or an all-new engine, or if it will be available in UK models, but it is thought that its smaller capacity - compared to recent VR6 units - is a result of a Chinese-market specific tax break.
Volkswagen has a long history of popular VR6 engines; the first were developed in the late 1980s and introduced in 1991 in the Corrado and Passat. Later, the engine made its way into the Golf.
The new Golf Design Vision concept, which is equipped with a transversely mounted 496bhp version of the new VR6, is capable of accelerating from 0-62mph in a supercar-rivalling 3.9sec. Its top speed is 190mph.

 

[Levi68]

That is one good looking Golf.

 

[Deckhook]

Does anyone have any idea as to why this engine couldn't be used in the conventional manner under the hood of an A4 or the likes, height is the only thing that springs to mind and though I'm no engineer I would have thought that a single head should shave something off the overall weight compared to a traditional Vee.

 

[Kilcrohane]

boy did it make a lovely note

Does anyone know why it was dropped only to return again here and now?

It could be because as you indicate a six cylinder will always have more cachet than a 4-cyl. and make a far nicer exhaust note, and crucially it doesn't have the drawback of robbing engine bay space front to back like a conventional V6 would in a transverse application, so allowing an almost 4 cyl.-like crash protection crumple zone. my 2 cents.

 

[Deckhook]

^I agree with these benefits but I thought the reason it got axed before with due to it being not very economical and high emissions, two things which in our current climate goes against what manufacturers are trying to achieve. Unless VAG have found a way of improving these up to current V6 standards. Personally I reckon this engine would be sweet in a lot of things but does it really offer any real benefit over a traditional V6, or is it more likely a replacement for the Audi's 5cyl that graces the TT and RS3?

 

[martinbo]

Of course, the engine you refer to was a naturally aspirated, big (3.2 to 3.6 litre) capacity gas guzzler of relatively low tech. Turbocharging combined with direct injection significantly alter the situation now.

 

[Tumbo]

Am I the only one that thinks that this car is overdesigned and trying to hard to be an R8?

Im impressed by its engine and techical specs for sure, but the looks. Nah. I'll take a standard R easily over this.

 

[martinbo]

Well it is just a concept with outlandish go-faster bits. In spite of this it still looks good without going all Mansory.

 

[Deckhook]

Of course, the engine you refer to was a naturally aspirated, big (3.2 to 3.6 litre) capacity gas guzzler of relatively low tech. Turbocharging combined with direct injection significantly alter the situation now.

True, though I don't recall VW offering this engine with FI to know exactly how much things would have improved by. All I remember of it was the note it made which was to my ears different than a traditional V6, a note to me which was full of character as the revs increased.

Hope this engine makes it to production, a TTRS or RS3 or VW R with this would be wicked.

 

[mini_cooper4]

If only the S3 had a VR6 under it's hood...
Hopefully the RS3 will get it

 

[JHF]

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[Giannis]

Guys, the plumbing of a VR6-type engine is the dead give away: inlet manifold on one side (front-facing), exhausts and turbos on the other (rear-facing) in this case. A traditional V6 has exhaust manifolds either side of the engine and the induction system running into the centre of the Vee. Even in the case of a hot-side inside configuration there would still be the same manifold either side of the engine.

Ah, thanks Martin! I didn't expect anything less

If this truly is the engine that's to power Macan and certain Audis then who saw it coming that it would be a VR6-type engine?

it isn't. The Macan('MLB' Q5-based) we already know for definite gets the brand new Porsche 3 litre bi-turbo V6, as just launched in the facelifted Panamera.

This new VR6 will, if it ever goes into a production vehicle, be for FWD architecture, transverse engined cars.

Hmm.

On the other hand, this VR6 3l engine could be the heart of the upcoming RS3 and next generation TT-RS, which do have a transverse mounted engine!

If BMWs offers (read M135i and Z4 sDrive35i) are 6-cylinder-ed, why can't Audi do the same?

 

[Human]

School boys' wet dream, right there

Looks great, I like it, actually I love it!

I guess at 37 anything that lets out the inner 'Bad Boy' and puts a smile on your face could only be a winner!

EDIT: Dash shows Lamborghini-ques and influence....O'l naughty Borg Alcantara & CF + two helmets a great touch