The Quandts finally forming an automotive holding!

[EnI]

BMW Shareholder Quandt Forms Holding Company

By Andreas Cremer

Oct. 20 (Bloomberg) -- German billionaire Stefan Quandt formed a Societas Europaea holding company and may transfer his stake in Bayerische Motoren Werke AG to the new concern, Financial Times Deutschland reported, citing a spokesman.
Aqton SE is designed to help acquire and administer shares in companies related to the auto industry, the newspaper said, citing the unidentified spokesman for Quandt.
Still, there are no plans to transfer any of Stefan Quandt's 17.4 percent stake in BMW to Aqton this year, the newspaper said, citing the spokesman.
Quandt shifted almost 1.86 million shares in BMW to a holding company called Stefan Quandt GmbH & Co. KG fuer Automobilwerte on Oct. 8, according to statements issued by the carmaker a week late.

Bloomberg.com








Daimler, be afraid! The Quandts are coming!

 

[EnI]

Some old posts ...

A holding company incorporating BMW AG + Daimler AG is quite possible. The Quandts are very eager about zhis idea.
Operative businesses would remain independent, synergies possible in R&D, purchasing, etc. Production, marketing, etc would remain separate.

The vicious rumor mill ... fresh news ...:

The Quandts have met with high officials from Kuwaiti government ... A coincidence? The one in the know doesn't think so.

Subject: the stake in Daimler AG. The Quandts allegedly want to buy back their share in Daimler from the Kuwait state. The Quandts (Herbert & his brother's widow) sold their stake in Daimler-Benz to Kuwaitis in 1974. Kuwait state now owns about 7% of Daimler AG, making Kuwait Government the biggest single shareholder of DAG!
Kuwaiti high officials have been seen in Bad Homburg a while ago ... in a town where the Quands resident. Perhaps Kuwaitis just came to visit the local spa. Yeah, sure.

I don't think BMW will acquire a stake in Daimler. The Quandts will - directly by themselves, with their own money (not via BMW). If ever. Big if.

BMW share is protected enough. Daimler's one is much more exposed.

Also as you can see the Quandts are supposedly negotiating directly with Daimler's major shareholder, and not buying shares via stock exchange market (= not hyping the price of a share).

Now when Porsche will acquire VAG, the Quandts & Co. are trying to create another big German automotive holding in the future: BMW AG, Daimler AG, and some car-parts suppliers - all under the same holding.

They are lobbing a lot. They "donate" a lot of Euros (figure in millions!) to the ruling German party: CDU / CSU.

According to my info the Quandts are not acting alone. They are just the initiators.

Mind that for Quandts it's enough to acquire the Daimler stake from Kuwaitis and named their man into Daimler supervisory board.

Also, btw: in a holding structure operative business are independent. Only using the most necessary synergies.

This BMW - MB game will be very interesting in the future.

Time will tell ...

Here we go again ...

Not only the Quandts met with Kuwaiti officials in October (Kuwait state owning about 7% of Daimler - sold to them by Quandts in 70s), but my sources report the Quandts met few days ago with the officials of some financial institutions & investment funds - which are suspiciously similar if not same to some Daimler investors / owners.

I tell you, something is going on ... The Quantd family is up to something. The insiders suggest they are trying to acquire (not BMW but the Quandt family directly!) a part in Daimler AG. If they succeed they will install their man in Daimler's supervisory board - trying to convince other members of SB, and the Management board to bond more with BMW AG.

The Quandts have been successful ... they convinced the investors (the ones who have a share in both companies - BMW AG & Daimler AG) to make a pressure on the Daimler management via the Supervisory board.

Of course both companies will profit from the synergies of new cooperations (mainly R&D + purchasing) ... Yet for Daimler AG management is a matter of pride ... playing only a second fiddle, while BMW having an initiative.

Too ensure such long-term cooperation between BMW & Daimler the Quandts are seeking a minority share in Daimler AG. To place their own man in Daimler's supervisory board ... eg. some ex-BMW member of the board.

In the case Quandts & Co. acquire a stake in Daimler, a holding would be created: consisting of two independent companies: BMW AG, and Daimler AG. Institutionally the cooperations would be much easier to achieve - since the owners of both companies would be the same.

But the operations of Daimler & BMW would be strictly separated.

Think PAH, WAG, PAG situation. Yet much better organized, and less family business involved.

So, technically BMW would not own Daimler , nor vice versa. Yet both would have same owner: the holding. Stakeholders of Holding would be joined stakeholders of BMW & Daimler: Quandt family being far largest individual stakeholder of the Holding. The problem is the Quandts want to have a controlling stake in the Holding, and are now - so say the rumors - trying to find the best way to achieve this objective.

But this will not happen anytime soon: perhaps in three years, not earlier.

 

[Deleted member 25]

The Drak Side is gonna win.

.

What's that ?

 

[EnI]

The Drak Side is gonna win.

No comment.

What's that ?

The dot is gone ... replaced by my old posts.

 

[LaArtist]

This seems like a nice idea..
A holding group instead of outright ownership from either side..

But i feel that the Quandts my have to bugde a bit on their goal...
To be the FAR largest stake holder..
Cause that will more or less result in a outright ownership from BMW´s side
And i dont think MB wants to play that game AT ALL..
So imo..i think this deal will happen when its balanced out between both parties..

Until then..no go..

 

[Tarek]

So does this new holding company will try to acquire a large stack in Daimler shares? making BMW somehow owns parts in MB?.....is that what u mean Eni?

 

[EnI]

So does this new holding company will try to acquire a large stack in Daimler shares? making BMW somehow owns parts in MB?.....is that what u mean Eni?

No, just meaning BMW AG & Daimler AG will have some same owners in the end. So, the same people then can influence decisions & plans in both companies.


Eg.:

the Quandts form a holding (Aqton SE) - being its 100% owner (eg. 1/3 each). Then they transfer their BMW shares to the holding. So, instead of Stefan, Susanne & Johanna, the Aqton SE now owns 47% of BMW AG.

Then Aqton SE acquires shares in eg. Daimler AG, ZF, Getrag etc. A minor but significant percents. (eg. 10% in Daimler AG).

Then Aqton SE appoints its man to Daimler's Supervisory Board ... eg. Mr. Stefan Quandt.

In the end Stefan Quandt is a member in BMW & Daimler Supervisory Board ... knowing all the plans of both companies, confirming strategic plans prepared by the Directors, influencing the decisions of Board of Directors.

Meaning: pushing both companies to cooperate as much as possible - to lower the purchasing, manufacturing, R&D costs etc.

So, the common owner has an interest that both companies prosper - via cooperations. Forcing the CEOs to act more rational, and to forget about their egos.

It's more an act to force both companies to cooperate.

 

[Giannis]

BTW, does "Aqton" mean actually something?

 

[Mr. Mercedes]

I'm actually all for this. BMW has prospered under the Quandt's close watch and a shared holding would provide Daimler with the security against takeover by a less worthy entity.

The possibilities that exist between BMW and MB are also ENDLESS!

 

[Tarek]

No, just meaning BMW AG & Daimler AG will have some same owners in the end. So, the same people then can influence decisions & plans in both companies.


Eg.:

the Quandts form a holding (Aqton SE) - being its 100% owner (eg. 1/3 each). Then they transfer their BMW shares to the holding. So, instead of Stefan, Susanne & Johanna, the Aqton SE now owns 47% of BMW AG.

Then Aqton SE acquires shares in eg. Daimler AG, ZF, Getrag etc. A minor but significant percents. (eg. 10% in Daimler AG).

Then Aqton SE appoints its man to Daimler's Supervisory Board ... eg. Mr. Stefan Quandt.

In the end Stefan Quandt is a member in BMW & Daimler Supervisory Board ... knowing all the plans of both companies, confirming strategic plans prepared by the Directors, influencing the decisions of Board of Directors.

Meaning: pushing both companies to cooperate as much as possible - to lower the purchasing, manufacturing, R&D costs etc.

So, the common owner has an interest that both companies prosper - via cooperations. Forcing the CEOs to act more rational, and to forget about their egos.

It's more an act to force both companies to cooperate.

I'll take that as a good news

 

[martinbo]

It's terrible news.

As consumers we stand to lose because the competition between the brands becomes artificial. Undbridled, mercenary competition between major players in the market is a far better progress driver - and certainly more customer-centric.

I want consumer expectation and constant innovation to shape the destiny and progress of automotive brands - not some megalomaniac dynasty.

 

[Giannis]

Indeed! What happens with the competition?

When the holding will "own" both companies, will influence the one in favour of the other or will place the one slightly more (or less) upmarket than the other?

 

[Tarek]

I really don't think that will happen,competition and conflict would of course be there everyone would still make it's own models according to it's own plans and customers.This is just gonna be much more beneficial and effective on R&D,materials and better cleaner cars.

 

[EMpower]

Not good for consumers. They can make a luxury car cartel and dictate prices. They can also delay introduction of new technology.

 

[coolraoul]

It's terrible news.

As consumers we stand to lose because the competition between the brands becomes artificial. Undbridled, mercenary competition between major players in the market is a far better progress driver - and certainly more customer-centric.

I want consumer expectation and constant innovation to shape the destiny and progress of automotive brands - not some megalomaniac dynasty.

Exactly. What is the aim of this? Simple. The Quandt see the price of the shares of Daimler/ZF/Siemens/Bosch etc... are historically low, and want to profit from it. So they buy them when they're low and after that, see their prices going high again after the crisis's gone and calculate the profit... All the big words are only marketing.

It's absolutely counter-productive to force two big companies to cooperate when they don't want to. See the problems Porsche is having with VW's management, the problems between Daimler and Chrysler...

I'm sorry, Dr.Z and Reithofer are currently talking about it, why would the Quandt want to interfere with that? Furthermore, what do they wanna do with a mere 10%, if not annoying the other members of the Board whith their ideas? Look at Piech...

I'm sot sure either that the EU will appreciate that a lot. They're quite touchy with "free competition" in Brussels.

This is, imo (and I'm by no way in the' know, so feel free to correct), quite a bad idea. Only good for the Quandt...

 

[Sayyaaf]

We will eventually all drive a Toyoda

 

[Tarek]

So am i the only one who thinks some good may come out of this? and if i'm wrong does MB and BMW are doomed?

 

[coolraoul]

I don't think it will change anything for you and me. Unless they decide to take a very very substantial part of Daimler, they won't have enough influence over the Board.

 

[Mr. Mercedes]

So am i the only one who thinks some good may come out of this? and if i'm wrong does MB and BMW are doomed?

I still think it's a good idea. Lexus, Audi etc. will ensure sufficient competition is present. Besides MB and BMW cannot afford to sit back and do nothing with the way Audi is going. Audi has access to SO much for so little $.

 

[coolraoul]

Yes, MB and BMW are about to cooperate, they are discussing it. But if they finally don't want to, it's not because of one Director @ Daimler would be called Quandt that they would happily and freely cooperate. This structure will do nothing for Daimler, only a way for the Quandt to increase their wealth and to be present at Daimler.

Is it good that a BMW man could sit at Daimler's Board? I'm not so sure. The Quandt want to take a stake in some German automotive companies; it will change nothing in their way to work. It's only good for the Quandt, that's about it.

And rest assured that it will pose problems if a BMW man sits at Daimler's Board and starts to talk too loudly... I see it as an obstacle to their possible cooperation, Daimler doesn't like to be forced to anything.