S600 vs S550 -- for the long term, best choice?

[trumpet1]

Vibrations in a V12 are LESS than in a V8 or less. They are more balanced and therefore don't vibrate as bad, less strain on the individual parts, so in effect , you would think a V12 would give less trouble.

 

[coolraoul]

Vibrations in a V12 are LESS than in a V8 or less. They are more balanced and therefore don't vibrate as bad, less strain on the individual parts, so in effect , you would think a V12 would give less trouble.

Are you sure about that? I had always read that in fact, a V8 was quite a perfect configuration for a motor, and everything above was only useful to make your neighbours jealous...V8 in fact are the less vibrating configuration, from what I knew.

But I am not a engineer, so i could be wrong.

Anyway, neither 550 or 600 are the kind of motor that vibrates... the 320cdi and 420cdi are much more vibrating than both.

I would take the 550, if cost is an issue. Because there are a lot of 550 sold every year, on the CLK, E, S, ML, G, GL, R, S, SL, CL... The 600 is pretty rare, only on S, CL and SL...

So the spare pieces of a 550 will be less expensive than the exclusive 600, and the dealers will have more experience on any problem you can have. Also the biggest torque means more stress on the gearbox and mechanical elements, but they can handle the 65 AMG so no problem here.

On the other hand, 600 is magical, it is the top, and even the interior is slightly better... It does not have the 7G-Tronic though. It may be less reliable, I absolutely don't know if it is the case. I don't see why it would be less reliable, even if it is a bit more complex, here you have to ask to engineers or MB dealers.

Thing is, there are really few noticeable differences between a 550 and a 600 in the S-Class, where the power of the 550 is really more than enough. So both are fabulous, the best cars in the world.

If cost is still an issue, take the S550.
If it is not that important, well, a V12 is a V12...A V8 is much more common.

 

[Merc1]

Hmmm...I kinda think the 600 cars may be more "reliable" in the survey sense because the engine is older and more proven as is the gearbox. The S550 debuted a new engine and fairly new gearbox, the 7G only coming out 3 years before and still buggy according to ML/R owners. Don't understand why that is, but they seem to be the only models in which the 7G is giving trouble.

I'd always been told that a V12 and an I6 are the only perfectly balanced engines. Which when you put 2 I6's together you get the best balance.

M

 

[Deleted member 182]

Vibrations in a V12 are LESS than in a V8 or less. They are more balanced and therefore don't vibrate as bad, less strain on the individual parts, so in effect , you would think a V12 would give less trouble.

You're right. V12's are smooth.

About the smoothness of engines

 

[coolraoul]

Thanks ojis, very interesting article!
So V12 indeed offers advantages over V8...

I've learned something today, cool!

 

[trumpet1]

www.e31.net

This link gives a full explanation of each type of engine. From what I can tell, the V12 should be the most balanced of the engines. The 6 and 8 cylinders are also very good.

 

[Pagani]

These links are indeed very educative.
As for the argument about the number of valves and sparkplugs, the 600 only has 4 more valves than the 550 (3 x 12 - 4 x 8 = 36 - 32 = 4). With a seven speed and new engine design and 388hp on tap, the 550 is indeed a very tempting proposition in light of the V12. Ultimately, options that come standard with the S600 become the deciding factor to the discerning conspicuous buyer.

 

[JohnnyWatts]

Any comments from those who switched from a 500/550 S class to a 600?
In the long run they depreciate so much that there is little spread between them and the resale value sucks.
Plus after the ext. warranty expires are you looking at a nightmare in repairs?
Thanks!

Had my 2004 s600 for a few years and no major issues that cost more than a grand (vacuum hoses and new valve cover gaskets, 1200 combined). Love the feel of that v12, would NEVER trade it for a v8. Don't buy into the fear, prices are higher but not THAT higher.

 

[Wunderkind]

Vibrations in a V12 are LESS than in a V8 or less. They are more balanced and therefore don't vibrate as bad, less strain on the individual parts, so in effect , you would think a V12 would give less trouble.

Not really, the V12 engine is very heavy and the engine mounts and front axle bushes (steering & suspension arms) do wear out faster (my experience with the BMW 850i). Also, many parts of the S600 are bespoke and made in much smaller number than the V8-engined model and hence costs more.

I'd pick the S550 over the S600 as a long-term keeper.

 

[mini_cooper4]

Not really, the V12 engine is very heavy and the engine mounts and front axle bushes (steering & suspension arms) do wear out faster (my experience with the BMW 850i). Also, many parts of the S600 are bespoke and made in much smaller number than the V8-engined model and hence costs more.

I'd pick the S550 over the S600 as a long-term keeper.

It's a decade old comment you're replying to

 

[Mr Robert]

It's a decade old comment you're replying to

Well, so is the V12, times two.

 

[mini_cooper4]

Well, so is the V12, times two.

To be honest it's even older than that

 

[hovabongZA]

Are there any plans to update or build a new V12 maybe something from AMG since they are now responsible for the V12?

Does the demise of Maybach mean they don't see a business case of building a V12 only for the S class and S class Maybachs kits?
I'm thinking the only real reason BMW are able to update their V12s in the 7 series is because of Rolls Royce. Without RR BMW would still use V12s from 20 years ago.

 

[Merc1]

Maybach's demise? Maybach kits? Sigh..........


M

 

[Rolf]

The AMG V12 is also built for Pagani although in very limited numbers also. The main draw card I guess for production of a V12 is for exclusivity. A V12 engine nowadays is not produced by many companies in large numbers, only Ferrari, Lamborghini, BMW/RR, Mercedes, and Audi/Bentley with their W12 produce 12 cylinder engines. It's the engine of choice for the exclusive and exotic cars.

Mercedes Benz V12 now is an old design originally dating back to the 3 valve Turbo debut in the FL W220 in 2003. A new more modern power plant needs to debut to put the engine on a different level to the new 4,0 V8 in output and performance. The new S65 is a good point of discussion, looking at the specs of the new S63 in comparison 99% of people will tell you to rather buy a S63 as it's faster, much cheaper and more economical than the S65, but then some people will say go for the S65 it will be more exclusive and you will stand out from the crowd.

 

[Pagani]

The V12 is due to be a modular version of the current 4.0L V8. That happens to be an even 6L capacity. It does not need to be tunable to 1.5 times 600+ horsepower... 750 to 800 will do. AMG should be working on this already if they are serious about the V12. Although, with this V8, I doubt the point of having a V12 in the portfolio anymore.

 

[Centurion]

The V12 is due to be a modular version of the current 4.0L V8. That happens to be an even 6L capacity. It does not need to be tunable to 1.5 times 600+ horsepower... 750 to 800 will do. AMG should be working on this already if they are serious about the V12. Although, with this V8, I doubt the point of having a V12 in the portfolio anymore.

I feel Mercedes should replace the V12 with a hybrid V8. At low speeds and idle it would be as quiet and smooth as the V12, but have enough thrust for brisk acceleration.

On the flip side I wouldn't blame them for developing another V12 to offer a no-fuss powerplant thats unconditionally fast and smooth. The pullman needs that prestige and power in order to rival RR and Bentley cars.

 

[MercFan]

The V12 is due to be a modular version of the current 4.0L V8. That happens to be an even 6L capacity. It does not need to be tunable to 1.5 times 600+ horsepower... 750 to 800 will do. AMG should be working on this already if they are serious about the V12. Although, with this V8, I doubt the point of having a V12 in the portfolio anymore.

Nothing says a man has failed in life quite so well as a V8 badge on his S-class...

 

[Merc1]

With this new I6, a new V12 is inevitable IMO. MB will never let go of the V12 as long as their rivals have one.

M

 

[Rolf]

MB will never let go of the V12 as long as their rivals have one.

M

I agree with you, the Jaguar XJ and then the BMW 750iL started the V12 segment in the luxury class and BMW are still producing the V12 in the 760iL and RR models so Mercedes wouldn't want to play second fiddle to them and stop making their V12, its a status symbol that a person is playing in another league if they have purchased a V12 model. I think they will bring out a revised V12 or new V12 within the next 2 years to be able to dominate this segment again.