Rivian Rivian - started production

[Centurion]

I can't stand the front. The light-bar with those perpendicular ellipses looks so naff and un-rugged.

Do you dislike cuteness?

 

[Matski]

Do you dislike cuteness?

Yeah.. @martinbo do you dislike cuteness???

How can you dislike this?? WTF is wrong with you??

 

[martinbo]

Do you dislike cuteness?

Not at all. But, living in the land of pick-up mania, there's an expectation when it comes to a bakkie (that's what they're called down here) portraying a certain image of toughness. The Rivian is doubtless very tough and capable but that front-end is at odds in depicting this. Anecdotally - saw a new LC 300 yesterday evening... now, THAT's how you look the part!

@Matski - thanks for the great laugh. You made my day!

 

[WBarnes]

R1T in Top Gear this month - 314 mile range, 835hp, 908lbft, 2.8t, $67k.

 

[Sunny]

First (rather lame) test -

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[Jo_Sta7]

IPO going to be huge. My broker is telling me expect $122 per share at open.

 

[Cashmere]

IPO going to be huge. My broker is telling me expect $122 per share at open.

Hope you don’t mind, but can we avoid stock pricing discussion if that’s okay? Far too easy to manipulate, and day-to-day changes are not always representative of the product.

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

Interesting numbers on the range/efficiency.
Rivian gets 315 mile range from 135 kW battery seems really poor and I think a lot of it has to do with it having traditional truck shape. Rivian has been mum on sharing the drag coefficient but I bet it’s way up there.

 

[WBarnes]

Hope you don’t mind, but can we avoid stock pricing discussion if that’s okay? Far too easy to manipulate, and day-to-day changes are not always representative of the product.


Interesting numbers on the range/efficiency.
Rivian gets 315 mile range from 135 kW battery seems really poor and I think a lot of it has to do with it having traditional truck shape. Rivian has been mum on sharing the drag coefficient but I bet it’s way up there.

Well yeah, but that's true of almost any ICE truck. They'll all heavy and loosely resemble wheeled barns, that's why I think they've picked a clever market segment where the weight and range penalties are nullified by the fact that poor range, heavy weight and low top speed are kind of par for the course where trucks are concerned, while AWD and huge torque are much appreciated.

 

[klier]

They’re going to IPO at $80b and from there is anyone’s best guess. So yes I do get how much money that is. They are going to be main competitor for Tesla in a few short years time. I’ve spoke to many industry expert and for two years this is the company I’ve been consistently told is the one to look out for. Their valuation multiple will be Tesla-ish. I believe Tesla’s market cap is $900b currently. You can think that’s over valued but it’s reality.

No that's not reality. That's some insane American overvaluation. It's absolute crazyness opf the highest order, and it's not going to work out.

All the best to you though, hope you become (even more) rich.

 

[WBarnes]

Markets are funny things, 250GTOs have exchanged hands privately for £100m. If cold analysis were laid upon it, it's a 60 year old sports car that's irrelevantly slow by modern standards and probably costs a fortune to maintain, but this is a world of £0.25m watches and shit, so anything goes.

 

[klier]

Markets are funny things, 250GTOs have exchanged hands privately for £100m. If cold analysis were laid upon it, it's a 60 year old sports car that's irrelevantly slow by modern standards and probably costs a fortune to maintain, but this is a world of £0.25m watches and shit, so anything goes.

Except a Rivian is a modern piece of junk that'll be obsolete in 3 years when new and better batteries arrive. But yeah, anything goes in todays hyped up BS world.

 

[Jo_Sta7]

No that's not reality. That's some insane American overvaluation. It's absolute crazyness opf the highest order, and it's not going to work out.

All the best to you though, hope you become (even more) rich.

I welcome you to join reality and look at the actual price it’s trading. You might not agree with the valuation, not sure I totally do either. If they achieve their projections then sure. It’s all about the trading multiple. For whatever reason, and again, not saying I necessarily agree, the market values these EV companies at insane multiples. But agree or disagree, you need to accept the reality that it’s happening and then formulate a strategy and profit. If you cannot then you will not.

 

[Deleted member 57437]

IPO going to be huge. My broker is telling me expect $122 per share at open.

Simply curious...

You mean a real-life, human being broker ? Ha-I didn't know that they still existed (with electronic trading having encompassed the entire transaction process including (including pre-and post transaction , including risk management).

Interesting.

 

[CrunchSlaughtered]

IPO going to be huge. My broker is telling me expect $122 per share at open.

It was $107. Time to change the broker.

 

[Jo_Sta7]

Simply curious...

You mean a real-life, human being broker ? Ha-I didn't know that they still existed (with electronic trading having encompassed the entire transaction process including (including pre-and post transaction , including risk management).

Interesting.

These type of transactions are weird. Essentially there are these brokerage firms that cobble together money and allow people to buy into companies at various stages of fundraising and various valuations. Perhaps the principal at the firm knows someone who knows the CEO, that type of thing. So you don’t actually keep any money there. They certainly don’t manage your money. They just know you, maybe enough to like you, and they’ll inform you of current deals including the company, valuation, minimums, etc.

If you like the deal, you buy in by wiring them the cash. This is the “broker” I’m referring to. They take 15% carry and a 1% fee. Sometimes upfront fee is waived if the amount invested is large.

 

[klier]

I welcome you to join reality and look at the actual price it’s trading. You might not agree with the valuation, not sure I totally do either. If they achieve their projections then sure. It’s all about the trading multiple. For whatever reason, and again, not saying I necessarily agree, the market values these EV companies at insane multiples. But agree or disagree, you need to accept the reality that it’s happening and then formulate a strategy and profit. If you cannot then you will not.

I genuinely wish you all the best with your investments. I personally think it's a giant bubble.

 

[Jo_Sta7]

I genuinely wish you all the best with your investments. I personally think it's a giant bubble.

You could very well be right. Time will tell. Of all the EV company investments, Rivian is my favorite and will scale the best. I don't think it should be worth $100b, personally. But if Tesla is worth 1.2 TRILLION (worth being only a reflection of the market and not of my personal feelings) then sure, why not.

 

[WBarnes]

Except a Rivian is a modern piece of junk that'll be obsolete in 3 years when new and better batteries arrive. But yeah, anything goes in todays hyped up BS world.

It's the company being valued not the car though.

You could very well be right. Time will tell. Of all the EV company investments, Rivian is my favorite and will scale the best. I don't think it should be worth $100b, personally. But if Tesla is worth 1.2 TRILLION (worth being only a reflection of the market and not of my personal feelings) then sure, why not.

Microsoft and Apple are worth $2.5tr. Tesla's profit margin is very, very large relative to other car companies, something like 30% per car, whereas for other traditional companies the profit margin is roughly 0% per car, with only profit on parts. So when you compare the profit on a clutch replacement in 5 years time vs $30k at point of sale, it's not that difficult to see why its value is so much higher than other car companies.

 

[Deleted member 57437]

Way back sometime during the end of the 1990s'/ beginning of the pre-9/11 00s', former U.S. Federal Reserve Chief Alan Greenspan spoke of "irrational exuberance" regarding an explosive upwards spiral in share prices. What was then perceived as "irrational" has long become the norm. I'm old enough to clearly recall when market followers closely gauged P/Es' into their assessment of given shares-the reliable method of detecting "over" and/or "-under-valuation". Today, Tesla's P/E is somewhere in the vicinity of 330. Back in ol' Alan's time, people would have said "Get the f**k outta here !".

 

[WBarnes]

Way back sometime during the end of the 1990s'/ beginning of the pre-9/11 00s', former U.S. Federal Reserve Chief Alan Greenspan spoke of "irrational exuberance" regarding an explosive upwards spiral in share prices. What was then perceived as "irrational" has long become the norm. I'm old enough to clearly recall when market followers closely gauged P/Es' into their assessment of given shares-the reliable method of detecting "over" and/or "-under-valuation". Today, Tesla's P/E is somewhere in the vicinity of 330. Back in ol' Alan's time, people would have said "Get the f**k outta here !".

True but P/E tends to vary from sector to sector and P/E only becomes relevant once the company stops growing, because if a growing company starts paying huge dividends then it has no money to spend on expansion and growth grinds to a halt.