Report: BMW M Division dropping high-rev engines in favor of turbos

[klier]

^ hey, at least it lasted a lot longer than the MB = reliable fantasy
BMW is changing because of external factors, and MB did it all to themselves

 

[SKY]

^ hey, at least it lasted a lot longer than the MB = reliable fantasy
BMW is changing because of external factors, and MB did it all to themselves

It´s a point of view. I think that Mercedes does a type of engines, and BMW another, and only one person that have bought both cars know this.

Reading BMW news and post, or rumors, all talk about the same, and what I read is closer to the Mercedes engine phylosophy than to the BMW one.

More torque? Moro comfort? That´s for Mercs, not BMWs!!

 

[mofomat]

scott27, i really look foward to all the information u intend to share with us on this topic. As a bmw fun, I truely Thank u very much for all that u contribute on these forums.

I agree! There's nothing I hate more than people who criticise Scott. I wish people would stop having a go just because he gets a few things wrong. Many people on here hang on his every word and I wouldn't have it any other way to be honest.

 

[asturias]

I agree! There's nothing I hate more than people who criticise Scott. I wish people would stop having a go just because he gets a few things wrong. Many people on here hang on his every word and I wouldn't have it any other way to be honest.

+1
I really aprecciate Scott's contribution to this forum.

 

[kovachian]

I say the more turbos the better. Hell I wish there was a federal law requiring at least one turbo in every vehicle made. Bring 'em on boys, bring 'em on.

 

[Merc1]

^ hey, at least it lasted a lot longer than the MB = reliable fantasy
BMW is changing because of external factors, and MB did it all to themselves

In what world is this? MB being reliable lasted for years and years before, a hell of a lot longer than we've had to read this BMW is pure nonsense, yet a Mercedes is back to being reliable now. BMW is changing to something that you and others said they'd "never" do, has nothing to do with Mercedes. Again, another feeble attempt to dodge the issue.


M

 

[Giannis]

Turbos are not bad. I can have fun with a turbo Volvo, so imagine what can a turbo engine by M deliver!

Though, from my concern NA engines are way cooler. You feel like you have total control.

 

[coolraoul]

Turbos are good, no denying. Awesome motors, some of them.
But an high-revving N/A engine is simply better. Better.

I find BMW extremely shy these times. No supercar, quickly cancelling the CS, now ditching M's whole philosophy...

Is it the right strategy to face both financiel and environmental crisis? Maybe. But from a fan PoV, it's extremely disappointing. Rather than fighting the situation, trying to find solutions, BMW seems to go backwards, to act extra-carefully and, in a sense, without passion.

They have to make cars to win money. They make them.

- Environment problems? let's ditch the big and sporty motors.
- Financial problems? let's ditch the big models.

Why not fighting these problems? Why not putting all they have to find suitable solutions, rather than compromises? Is that what BMW accustomed us to?

Like the Joker said... BMW, what happened? did...did your balls drop off?

 

[AdvEvo]

I have bmw E90 M3. That engine is a master piece revving to 8400 rpm throttle response which is just fantastic. It feels like youre foot is connected to the engine. Only the damn car is to big and heavy.

I have had my share of turbo s evo s subaru s 120d and 135i. Driven all these on tracks also. Oil temps going thru the roof turbo intercooler hoses fel off, Turbo s broke down. No throttle response like High rev M engines.

Turbo engine s are more complexe, intercooler more hoses turbo s etc more things which can go wrong.

Look at circuits all around the globe. E36 and E46 M engine is zo common used as race engines. All those racecar builders / drivers must they go turbo which are more prone to failing on track?

My opinion for M is this. All those heavy cruise ships like X5M X6M and M5, M6 have no need for racebred highrev engines they are to heavy anyway so put turbo s in there. The current M3 is also to heavy. But it really does not need a V8 with 420hp if you can bring the weight down. Look at the 330i engine it has CO2 of 170 that s pretty darn good with 272 hp that engine is not heavy. Alu mag. engine. Make 300hp of that engine and put it in a car which is 1250kg you have a fantastic M car.

It all went wrong to build bigger heavier longer wider cars with bigger en more hp engines in it.

A 3 series car like a E30 or E36 is big enough but no it all has to be bigger and heaver en more hp engine s to win the weight over. But in cornering weight is always youre main problem.

E36 M3 car and engine is most common used als building up a racecar for private racers and teams. The car is just the right size.

If bmw does not downsize the 3 series again. Then M could better concentrate on the 1 series with a 300hp high rev engine. And put Turbo s in all those big heavy boats M3, M5, M6, X5M X6M. And keep the 1 serie s nice and small with a nice real M engine in it.

 

[south]

I look forward over the next two weeks to explain how M Division will become the absolute pinnacle of the "Efficient Dynamics" Programme.

Sounds like the countdown ending on Dec 15th is about an M car!? I'm confused now.


Best regards, south

 

[tatoun]

Turbos are good, no denying. Awesome motors, some of them.
But an high-revving N/A engine is simply better. Better.

I find BMW extremely shy these times.

Is it the right strategy to face both financiel and environmental crisis? Why not fighting these problems? Why not putting all they have to find suitable solutions, rather than compromises? Is that what BMW accustomed us to?

Like the Joker said... BMW, what happened? did...did your balls drop off?

Today's news : Rolls Royce factory is closing five weeks due to crisis slowdown in sales.
Even the upper premium seems to suffer!!
So, being cautious might help in this economic turmoil!

 

[SCOTT27]

Sounds like the countdown ending on Dec 15th is about an M car!? I'm confused now.

No that is the Z4.

 

[Cashmere]

I think its been pretty obvious for quite some time that BMW was going to have to let go of the NA engines. As much as I was kinda saddened that BMW was dropping the NA part of its tradition I am really looking forward to see a turbocharged ///M!

 

[Mr Robert]

I think its been pretty obvious for quite some time that BMW was going to have to let go of the NA engines. As much as I was kinda saddened that BMW was dropping the NA part of its tradition I am really looking forward to see a turbocharged ///M!

Few times in the modern history of engine building have there been quite that much pressure to deliver. M has to do something that everyone thinks is impossible and they have to do it flawlessly, otherwise the judgement will be gruesome.

 

[Mr Robert]

Look at the 330i engine it has CO2 of 170 that s pretty darn good with 272 hp that engine is not heavy. Alu mag. engine. Make 300hp of that engine and put it in a car which is 1250kg you have a fantastic M car.

I have asked about this engine in the 1-series for some time now. No one seems to know if it is comming. I simply can't understand why that engine (with some 290-300 hp) could not be used as a base for a M-ish kind of 1-series at 1 300 kgs.

I would have bought it. For sure. No doubt. I would have sold my yet to be delivered Mini Cooper S.

 

[Sunny]

^ok we will see about that..

I belive there will be high rev Hondas, nissans.. Mazda´s..
Subarus..
And then all those high end cars you told about..

lets see who´s right..

Besides the 4 banger in the S2000, not a single one of them makes a 'high' revving engine.

Out side the exotics and kit cars, high revving engines is already a rarity. There is M V8 and V10, GT3 straight 6 and the Audi V8. And that is about it. And looks like Audi is already moving away from it. Hopefully GT3 will remain NA.

 

[Mr Robert]

The JDM FD2 Civic Type-R sings along until 8,400 rpm and the Euro spec manages 8,000 rpm. That is high revving althogh not at the same level as the GT3 and M3.

 

[martinbo]

Yeah, even the manic 2.0 litre JDM-only turbo engine in the STI "only" revs to 7500 rpm at the absolute max and this after delivering peak power at 6400 rpm.

Really it's just Honda's torque-lite 2.0 litre that sees mainstream production.

 

[Heyhuub]

The new direct injection Porsche engines, especially the Cayman S are still pretty high revving, the Clio sport also springs to mind with 7500+RPM.

And the new Audi R8 V10 with 8700RPM has one of the highest revving engines of all time in a production car i believe. Though that is more an exotic offcourse.

 

[klier]

^ What's your point? The Audi R8 nor the Cayman S has a turbo. They're both NA, thus they can rev like there's no tomorrow....

BTW, my new toothbrush is making 8000 rotations per minute too. I don't think it's that special anymore. It used to be special when BMW and Ferrari pioneered this, but now every car company can do it if they want.....