F-Type [Official] Jaguar F-Type

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[Kilcrohane]

- the generally extremely preferential to Brit products "carscoops" web site questions the credibility of the hyped as a true sports car F-type. Hilariously, Gaydon's army of paid shills pile in to limit the damage and question the author's sanity. Now where have we seen that kind of thing before?

his so called facts have been proven to be untrue.

- name just one.

As well as every man and his dog now realising the hyped up F-type is nothing but a cut and shut 7 yr old XK, as mentioned above, does the general public also know Jaguar's 'new' V6 engine has the V8 engine's block? If anyone short of the old Lada or some gimcrack Chinese outfit pulled the same stunt - fitting a V8 block to a V6 engine - you'd never hear the end of it, and they'd be a standing joke, but because it's JLR and 'British' we're supposed to turn a blind eye and call it 'character' - something the Krauts can never manage, apparently, according to the Brit car-philes.

Joke car, joke engine, joke engineering, bad-joke company.

 

[hoffmeister_fan]

As well as every man and his dog now realising the hyped up F-type is nothing but a cut and shut 7 yr old XK, as mentioned above, does the general public also know Jaguar's 'new' V6 engine has the V8 engine's block? If anyone short of the old Lada or some gimcrack Chinese outfit pulled the same stunt - fitting a V8 block to a V6 engine - you'd never hear the end of it, and they'd be a standing joke, but because it's JLR and 'British' we're supposed to turn a blind eye and call it 'character' - something the Krauts can never manage, apparently, according to the Brit car-philes.

Joke car, joke engine, joke engineering, bad-joke company.

Wasn't the old 3.6L V6 in the Panamera based on the 4.8L V8?
Also, you implied elsewhere that the 6 year-old XF is old hat...how long is the 5er's and E-class' average life-cycle?
You, in the past, have refered to German articles where Porsche, a German subsidiary of VAG, has summarily trumped the F-type. Wouldn't the German press have a vested interest in protecting their industry, quite like the British press would have an interest to protect British brands that build cars in the UK?

Now, I am no planted "shill" for JLR or, for that matter, any car manufacturer. I have no horse in this race, but I, along with a number of folks here, question your motive on this forum. While I enjoy reading informed contrarian opinions, you provide little to none outside of JLR. Every comment you make here is, at best, a thinly veiled insult to JLR, and, at worst, just bad-mouthing JLR, in an admittedly entertaining way. Now this begs the question, Kilcrohane, does someone from JLR use your breakfast every morning as their own personal outhouse to have such focused disdain?

I await, what is likely to be a witty retort....

 

[JLBM]

Yip, I enjoy contrarian opinions too. It's essential to be able to digest differing views and information to form an accurate assessment of any situation, automotive or otherwise. But there is only one word for the impassioned hatred of these tedious and predictable rants. TROLL.
Why this forum continues to put up with him/her is annoying to me as it is obvious there is an agenda here being executed through blatant TROLLING.

 

[JLBM]

Ps - he/she's been asked a hundred times to come clean on the source of this hatred, but ducks and dives the question.

 

[Sunny]

I am sorry, I don't agree with lot of the stuff Kilcrohane says but he doesn't have to "come clean" on anything to any one here. All I see is people question his motivation, not his opinion.

 

[Kilcrohane]

Wasn't the old 3.6L V6 in the Panamera based on the 4.8L V8?

- you've failed to grasp the point. The 'new' JLR V6 actually uses the V8's block. Do you see now?

The Porsche V6 is indeed a six-pot version of its V8, BUT it has a 6-pot casting. How clear does it have to be made?

You do realise that by Jaguar using a V6 with a V8 block any potential weight-saving of the 'smaller/lighter' engine is severely restricted, and more importantly, the potential to move the weight balance backwards due to a shorter engine is thwarted. Besides, if JLR really were coining up to £2bn/yr, as claimed by their media mouthpieces, surely a measly engine block casting would be a trifling matter to fund? Maybe those £2bn profit tales are as reliable as L/Rover's weight claims.

Also, you implied elsewhere that the 6 year-old XF is old hat

- you really are a sucker for punishment, aren't you: The F-type is a cut and shut 2006 XK - even JLR has acknowledged that through Autocar last year; the first presented in 2005 XK is actually a cut and shut itself of the 2002 XJ(X350); so the 'new' F-type is actually riding on a Ford-developed, 11 yr old, originally 5 metre+ long platform, which explains why a 4.4m supposed 2-seater sports car is so fat and so wide. Even Clarkson at the time of the XK's advert test drive for Top Gear in 2006 admitted that the 'new' XK was a compromised package, due to the need to adopt the 2002 XJ's platform.

By the way, all Jaguar's products ride on antiquated, Ford era-developed platforms - the XF dates back to the 1998 joint Lincoln LS/S-type, with of course the 2009 XJ just being a reskin of the original 2002 aluminium XJ. And of course Land Rover's 'new' Range Rovers are riding on the same original Ford-developed 2002 XJ's platform, which again explains why they are so obese and why the ride quality and handling is so far behind even the about to replaced competition, the X5 and Q7.

 

[Sunny]

- you've failed to grasp the point. The 'new' JLR V6 actually uses the V8's block. Do you see now?

The Porsche V6 is indeed a six-pot version of its V8, BUT it has a 6-pot casting. How clear does it have to be made?

You do realise that by Jaguar using a V6 with a V8 block any potential weight-saving of the 'smaller/lighter' engine is severely restricted, and more importantly, the potential to move the weight balance backwards due to a shorter engine is thwarted.

Wait, are you saying that the Jag V6 actually has 8 pots/holes and that they did not even lop off the two unused ones? If true, yes, that is beyond ridiculous.

 

[Kilcrohane]

Seeing as how everyone is so keen to ask me questions, about my ulterior motives, I'd like to put a question out there.

Remember all the talk of JLR's brave new world of multi billion pound annual investments in R&D and the many new products that would flow as result? Where are they? Thus far, there have only been warmed over, antiquated Ford platforms and a world's-first V6 engine with an eight cylinder block.

So, my question, who out there knows about these mysterious 'Hotfire' engines? If the factory in which they are to made is nearing completion and they really are due in-vehicle in 2014 we should be getting the first hard details by now. So what are they?

 

[Levi68]

Just as you are demanding me pics of M3 V6 I want pics of JLR V8 with two missing pistons.




As to Kilcrohane's motives/reasons, I think he bought some shares at JLR, and that was a wrong decision, invsetors information was deceit.

 

[Kilcrohane]

Wait, are you saying that the Jag V6 actually has 8 pots/holes and that they did not even lop off the two unused ones? If true, yes, that is beyond ridiculous.

apparently so, that's the rumour. No one has come forward to deny it.

Once the 2013MY XFs and XJs already out there with the 'new' V6 supercharged engine in them get into customer hands, garages and so on we should be able to finally settle this amazing rumour.

 

[Kilcrohane]

re. the 8-pot V6 rumour, some kind of corroboration. There was mention made of this on Pistonheads.com's forums about 6 months ago and then this on the XFforum:

The explanation for the weight is probably the same one for the odd design of the V6. Instead of re-casting a shorter V8 block leaving off the surplus cylinders Jaguar casts the same block for both, uses a crankshaft of the same length and fits shorter heads, leaving the rear two "cylinders" empty and unfinished. There is method to this madness but it sure ain't a pretty engine.

http://www.xfforum.co.uk/threads/9855-F-type-vs-New-Porsche-Cayman/page6

- 'Jagular' wrote this on 23/4/2013. Bear in mind 'Jagular' is pretty obviously a 100% Jaguar fanboy and was arguing with a more reasoned member, 'Baron95', FOR the F-type, but even he appears to have heard the rumour of the V6 engine's V8 engine block casting.

The full thread discussion is very entertaining and worth a read.

 

[Levi68]

The full thread discussion is very entertaining and worth a read.

A bit like most threads on GCF.

 

[Betty Swollocks]

The issue with Kilcrohane is quite simple as far as I'm concerned.

For whatever reason he clearly has a huge agenda against JLR. It's far beyond that what should be considered normal opinion or debate. Whether what he is saying is factually correct or not is irrelevant. He's using the forum as his own personal soapbox. It is no different to Scott being allowed to use the forum as a means of promoting BMW by stealth, but even Scott doesn't cross that line too often. Both examples, if left unchecked, are nothing other than trolling.

Just my humble opinion, but telling other forum users to "block" Kilcrohane is not an acceptable solution as why should other people have to resort to that when it's ONE person who is antagonising several people. As far as I was aware, trolling is not acceptable.

He has already been banned from other forums.


And for the avoidance of doubt, I couldn't give a toss about Jaguar. I have no interest in them and I wouldn't buy any of their current offerings, not even the F-Type.

 

[Deckhook]

http://www.crankandpiston.com/on-the-road/jaguar-reveals-f-type-motor-380bhp-supercharged-v6-yup/

Please guys if you have similar pics of other V6 engines to share it would help to explain if this rumor is indeed true or false.

 

[Sunny]

re. the 8-pot V6 rumour, some kind of corroboration. There was mention made of this on Pistonheads.com's forums about 6 months ago and then this on the XFforum:

The explanation for the weight is probably the same one for the odd design of the V6. Instead of re-casting a shorter V8 block leaving off the surplus cylinders Jaguar casts the same block for both, uses a crankshaft of the same length and fits shorter heads, leaving the rear two "cylinders" empty and unfinished. There is method to this madness but it sure ain't a pretty engine.

http://www.xfforum.co.uk/threads/9855-F-type-vs-New-Porsche-Cayman/page6

- 'Jagular' wrote this on 23/4/2013. Bear in mind 'Jagular' is pretty obviously a 100% Jaguar fanboy and was arguing with a more reasoned member, 'Baron95', FOR the F-type, but even he appears to have heard the rumour of the V6 engine's V8 engine block casting.

The full thread discussion is very entertaining and worth a read.

If true - again I still have my doubts, if not for any reason other than it is such a colossally stupid thing to do - that would be, well, colossally stupid. I wonder if there is any other engine that does this, I definitely never heard of it before.

 

[klier]

Wait, are you saying that the Jag V6 actually has 8 pots/holes and that they did not even lop off the two unused ones? If true, yes, that is beyond ridiculous.

I don't believe it.

 

[Levi68]

Watch carefully at 00:07!!!

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WTF?

 

[Carmaker1]

Coupé patent filings from Auto Motor und Sport:
View attachment 17445 View attachment 17446 View attachment 17447 View attachment 17448

I'm sorry, but those are not filings for the F-Type coupe. These are for the 2011 C-X16 Concept and were filed on August 17, 2011. The source that "found" these images, is rather clueless and should have done a better job studying differences between the C-X16 and F-Type. It is 100% identical to the C-X16 and doesn't have detailed productionized elements(i.e. reverse lights) seen in the F-Type patent images filed June 14, 2012. The production F-Type coupe's patent images are currently being deferred/withheld and won't be released anytime soon. The F-Type design was barely approved in March/April 2011 and one wouldn't know if both variants were signed off on simultaneously.

The same journalists' mistake was made last summer with the CLS Shooting Brake, in which many naively assumed the 2010 concept's patent images to be the production 2012 model(turned out to be different). I'm rather getting tired of lazy journalists not being 100% sure concerning such matters and misleading people.

Initial patent filing-August 17, 2011

Mysterious re-filing in B/W-February 17, 2012

Production models filing-June 14, 2012

V8 S model

 

[Deckhook]

Watch carefully at 00:07!!!

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WTF?

I've watched it repeatedly now and at first I thought I saw the four pots on the block but now I'm not so sure.