LaFerrari [Official] Ferrari LaFerrari

[Mafalda]

I just wish they would give the car a more exciting set of wheels! Something that better matches the dramatic looks.

Ferrari has already explained about the wheels: they're the lighest choice, others add 0.25 Kgs ...

 

[Monster]

One more. Just look at it, weapon like, lethal, and dead sexy.

 

[Monster]

The car is on show in Japan now.

 

[klier]

Koenigsegg has carbon fibre rims if I recall correctly...

Not that difficult for Ferrari to add if they want to I'd imagine.
Are the Koenigsegg rims lighter than the Ferrari rims?

 

[Monster]

Not that difficult for Ferrari to add if they want to I'd imagine.
Are the Koenigsegg rims lighter than the Ferrari rims?

The interesting thing is Ferrari, Mclaren and Porsche chose to stay with forged magnesium wheels instead of using carbon fiber rims.

 

[Levi68]

The interesting thing is Ferrari, Mclaren and Porsche chose to stay with forged magnesium wheels instead of using carbon fiber rims.

It is a matter of time before they offer carbon fiber rims.

 

[klier]

It is a matter of time before they offer carbon fiber rims.

Oh? Because they are making a kitcar at your school with them?

 

[Levi68]

Oh? Because they are making a kitcar at your school with them?

No. Because that is what Mr. Koenigsegg said.

 

[klier]

Mr Ferrari and mr Porsche are smarter people.

 

[Monster]

Please take this over to the internal combustion thread.

 

[klier]

Yes yes, relax. We're done.

 

[Sunny]

Just curious... why doesn't someone make CF rims?

I don't think CF is good choice of material for rims cause of the fact CF breaks instead of bending like metal. Last thing you probably want is a wheel to shatter after hitting a pothole or bump at speed.

 

[Levi68]

I don't think CF is good choice of material for rims cause of the fact CF breaks instead of bending like metal. Last thing you probably want is a wheel to shatter after hitting a pothole or bump at speed.

CF rims (if well designed of course) are stronger than any other metel wheel. Most cars have cars alloy wheels, and compared to steel wheels, they would crack, and not bend. Forged wheels will bend. While forged wheels will bend, CF will stay intact. If a CF wheel cracks, there is more to be worried than about the wheel.

Why no CF rims? Because they are expensive and because regulations do not allow them, thus no development. It is a matter of time before we get CF rims.

 

[Monster]

CF rims (if well designed of course) are stronger than any other metel wheel. Most cars have cars alloy wheels, and compared to steel wheels, they would crack, and not bend. Forged wheels will bend. While forged wheels will bend, CF will stay intact. If a CF wheel cracks, there is more to be worried than about the wheel.

Why no CF rims? Because they are expensive and because regulations do not allow them, thus no development. It is a matter of time before we get CF rims.

There are a few misconceptions in your posts, each material has it advantages and disadvantages, so the engineers use the best material for the best application. CF have very high tensile strength and they are extremely stiff, also they have great energy absorption ability but the down side is when they fail they will fracture and shatter suddenly. In general, metals have better toughness characteristics, meaning they can absorb a high level of impact before deforming and fracturing, and the failure do not occur as suddenly as CF. Also if the resin are damaged on a CF rim, for example when you scrape the wheel then you will weaken the strength of the entire wheel. I don't see how you can make assumptions such as "forged wheels will bend while CF will stay intact" with out knowing any data of the materials or the design of this theoretical wheels of yours.

Why no CF rims? Perhaps it is because these forged magnesium alloy wheels might be just as light or a little heavier but with better impact absorption ability, thus it is the best material for this application? I am not aware of any regulations out there which exclude the use of carbon fiber wheels, can you point them out to me? If not then you post is just pure speculations.

 

[Human]

FYI

On Koenigsegg CF wheels.

The 2013 Agera R features the world’s first hollow, one piece, super light carbon fiber wheel, using a proprietary method developed by Koenigsegg named Aircore™ Technology. The Aircore™ wheels save close to 20kg in unsprung mass, while providing great integrity and safety. The only metal part in the wheel is the tire valve – the rest is all once piece hollow carbon.

Also:

The carbon fiber phenomenon has gone from fiercely functional (1980s-era F1 cars) to annoyingly decorative (1990s-era Pep Boys accessories) and all the way back to square one (see: Boeing Dreamliner.) And while the carbon wheel has dodgy implications on the passenger car scene (bling bling, anyone?), there are plenty of functional arguments to be made for the high-tech hoops including quick acceleration and turn-in, crisp handling, and smooth ride quality.

Australian manufacturer Carbon Revolution claims they're responsible for the world's first one-piece carbon fiber wheels, and the weight specs are nothing short of breathtaking: their 19 x 8.5 CR9 wheel tips the scales at only 15.2 lbs, while a 19 x 12 rear comes in at a featherweight 17.8 lbs. The hitch? Equally breathtaking is the CR9's price-- about $15,000 per set.

Carbon Revolution says their wheels were developed at Opel's Dudenhofen proving grounds in Germany using an "extended durability program to OEM procedures" involving impact strips, potholes, and cobblestone. But the real question inevitably circles back to two eternally conflicting values: form and function.

Will prosperous poseurs opt for these wheels simply because they look cool, or will serious drivers indulge for the sake of that elusive win/win in the spider graph of performance, comfort, and efficiency? These are questions that haunt the outer edges of the aftermarket, and won't be answered until the well-heeled one percent vote with their Amex Black Cards.

​

 

[Human]

The car is on show in Japan now.

Make no mistake, I am a HUGE Pangani-fan(boy) But lets face it, these recent photos proves the LaFerrari to be on of the best looking machines EVER from all and any manufacturer. The cabin lacks the painstaking perfection of the Hyuara, but I will not mind having to look at a life size poster of the LaFerarri for the rest of my life, bowled over I am

 

[Levi68]

There are a few misconceptions in your posts, each material has it advantages and disadvantages, so the engineers use the best material for the best application. CF have very high tensile strength and they are extremely stiff, also they have great energy absorption ability but the down side is when they fail they will fracture and shatter suddenly. In general, metals have better toughness characteristics, meaning they can absorb a high level of impact before deforming and fracturing, and the failure do not occur as suddenly as CF. Also if the resin are damaged on a CF rim, for example when you scrape the wheel then you will weaken the strength of the entire wheel. I don't see how you can make assumptions such as "forged wheels will bend while CF will stay intact" with out knowing any data of the materials or the design of this theoretical wheels of yours.

Why no CF rims? Perhaps it is because these forged magnesium alloy wheels might be just as light or a little heavier but with better impact absorption ability, thus it is the best material for this application? I am not aware of any regulations out there which exclude the use of carbon fiber wheels, can you point them out to me? If not then you post is just pure speculations.

Sorry for being clumsy.



Sure, there is no black on white, every metal has its pros and contras. Contra of CF wheels is price resulting from complexity.

Do CF wheels shatter? Yes, but if a CF wheels shatters, so will all other, a well designed CF wheel will shatter at higher forces. Another point is that a CF wheel will not have "fatigue" as the other wheels. CF is stronger and lighter than anything else (ATM), but it has to be properly designed and it costs alot more. If CF wasn't stronger chassis would not be made of CF. Why are roll-cages not made of CF? Well, first cost, and then for race organisations it is more hard to judge the viability. The same goes about wheels.


Example from FIA F1 Regulations:
12.3 Wheel material:
Wheels must be made from AZ70 or AZ80 magnesium alloys.


Bikes on the other hand already have CF wheels. Sure CF wheels shatter, but don't believe the buzz, that is like supercar crashes.

It is not the CF barrel that shattered, but the forged aluminium center of this hybrid wheel.

CF wheels can pass the same testing standards as other wheels, while being significantly lighter. Other than the price there are no issues.



For more self study:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultimate_tensile_strength
http://www.carbonrev.com/technology.php
http://www.dymag.com/?q=technology

 

[Giannis]

It is not the CF barrel that shattered, but the forged aluminium center of this hybrid wheel.

So this is a proof that CF is better than forged aluminum.

Bear in mind that when talking about strength, the (tensile or ultimate) strength of a material is not the only factor to take into consideration. You also need to know how much material is used.

 

[Levi68]

So this is a proof that CF is better than forged aluminum.

Bear in mind that when talking about strength, the (tensile or ultimate) strength of a material is not the only factor to take into consideration. You also need to know how much material is used.

Where did I say it was a proof of CF wheels being better than other wheels?


That is why I say "properly designed". Cheap CF body parts are heavier than aluminium body parts. What does that prove?

 

[Monster]

Sorry for being clumsy.
Sure, there is no black on white, every metal has its pros and contras. Contra of CF wheels is price resulting from complexity.
Do CF wheels shatter? Yes, but if a CF wheels shatters, so will all other, a well designed CF wheel will shatter at higher forces.

The issue here is not about how much force it can handle before it shatters, the issue here is the manner which the material fails when it is subjected to forces beyond its design limit. Do you want a wheel that bends and deforms or do you want one that completely shatters when it fails?

Another point is that a CF wheel will not have "fatigue" as the other wheels. CF is stronger and lighter than anything else (ATM), but it has to be properly designed and it costs alot more. If CF wasn't stronger chassis would not be made of CF. Why are roll-cages not made of CF? Well, first cost, and then for race organisations it is more hard to judge the viability. The same goes about wheels.

Er chassis design is completely different from wheel design.

Example from FIA F1 Regulations:
12.3 Wheel material:
Wheels must be made from AZ70 or AZ80 magnesium alloys.

I don't know how you jumped from discussing road car wheels to race car wheels.

Bikes on the other hand already have CF wheels. Sure CF wheels shatter, but don't believe the buzz, that is like supercar crashes.

It is not the CF barrel that shattered, but the forged aluminium center of this hybrid wheel.

CF wheels can pass the same testing standards as other wheels, while being significantly lighter. Other than the price there are no issues.

For more self study:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultimate_tensile_strength
http://www.carbonrev.com/technology.php
http://www.dymag.com/?q=technology

Looking at the photo you have posted the center hub was sheared off from the spokes, you can look at the clean and almost uniform breakage at the points of failure. Without knowing the details of the accident, I cannot be 100% certain of the cause of such failure.