News and Rumors about Mercedes-AMG
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Serpens
Torque Titan
The C63 situation occurred under Tobias’ watch. He even seemed proud of it in this interview: https://www.topgear.com/car-news/in...rst-pure-electric-sports-car-will-arrive-2025. He took a gamble on the future and it backfired big time.
What good does a 5 cylinder do? It offers nothing over already existing 4 and 6 cylinder engines.
AbsoluteUnit
Das Beste Enthusiast
Sound.
These kinds of motors just sound special, and I'm sure AMG could make a really nice sounding inline 5 if they wanted to.
Serpens
Torque Titan
Ok, so very limited benefit compared to just using an I6.
AbsoluteUnit
Das Beste Enthusiast
Sure. But they could use the i5 in the A45 in a transverse application, as well as longitudinal for the RWD cars. It'd have a bit more flexibility than an I6, but still way more characterful than an I4.
If AMG had decided to make the M139/L an I5, while the complaints about the current 43/63e-performance cars would still exist, they'd be dampened a lot because at least an I5 sounds like a baby-V10. That and it'd be able to have a bit more power and torque across the power band, rather than being quite so boosty.
The I6 wouldn’t fit transverse, the I5 would, and it’d still sound special.
Perfect summary, thank you very much.
Serpens
Torque Titan
Yet sound wasn’t a complaint from A/CLA45 owners, which AMG internally is well aware of. Cars that always had I4’s since inception aren’t losing sales. Being “boosty” wasn’t a complaint either.
This is why complaints around sound didn’t occur until the M139 spread into the C-class and SL, vehicles that traded on their sound signature and power delivery.
Compared to the Audi RS3 the sound was indeed criticized, at least here in Switzerland.
BTW the M133 sounded much better than the M139.
Even in the Lotus Emira the M139 doesn’t sound very well.
Adding another piston just for the sake of sound quality seems like a weak argument. This is not an idea that would pass in a real-world scenario under the engineering regulations in place. There are many other factors to consider.
The M139 is already a powerful engine. This is the only 4 banger of the German makes that comes with an electric turbo and has one of the highest piston pressure levels in its class. One of the two factors that another piston is not needed in this particular case.
Serpens is correct in saying that this engine is suitable for the A45 and other lower AMG models. The M139 simply does not have the sound or feeling character for the more expensive, upper AMG models like the C, SL and GT class cars. This is where a 6-cylinder is desperately needed. AMG absolutely should invest in a hand-built, closed-deck twin-turbo V6 for its upper-class cars IMO. Hi-performance V6s sound much better than i6 engines when tuned correctly. The Ferrari 296 and Nissan GT-R Nismo are prime examples. No inline 6 can match them for power or sound delivery.
The M139 is already a powerful engine. This is the only 4 banger of the German makes that comes with an electric turbo and has one of the highest piston pressure levels in its class. One of the two factors that another piston is not needed in this particular case.
Serpens is correct in saying that this engine is suitable for the A45 and other lower AMG models. The M139 simply does not have the sound or feeling character for the more expensive, upper AMG models like the C, SL and GT class cars. This is where a 6-cylinder is desperately needed. AMG absolutely should invest in a hand-built, closed-deck twin-turbo V6 for its upper-class cars IMO. Hi-performance V6s sound much better than i6 engines when tuned correctly. The Ferrari 296 and Nissan GT-R Nismo are prime examples. No inline 6 can match them for power or sound delivery.
AbsoluteUnit
Das Beste Enthusiast
I'm not discounting the efficacy of the M139. However, with an extra piston and displacement (i.e a 2.5L I5), it could have been even more powerful or similar power, with a better torque curve, which is not entirely unreasonable.
Though I think maybe that 2L+ tax in China was probably a factor for Mercedes. And of course, the sound from such a motor would be really nice. This of course also opens up the possibility of a V10. But that is just fantasy.
I mean I think that's fair enough.
Though I do really like the smooth sound of a good straight 6 motor. So V6 or I6, either I would trust that AMG would be able to make it sound great. An I6 based on the M139 would probably be fairly straight forward for them to make, if they wanted.
The question is... will they?
^
You're a bit too far into Lala land my friend. When you pull together ideas from fantasy, they must be coherent with what Mercedes-AMG is currently doing or would adopt within reason. (Knowing how the company thinks.) The AMG 4-banger was designed to be paired together as a V8 engine for the top-tier models. If AMG wanted a 5-cylinder, a V10 would have been the order of the day and it would have been geared a bit differently than what we have today. This is not where Mercedes AMG is headed. The design principles of the M133 4-banger, M139 and M177 was to downsize displacement while concentrating horsepower and torque with a cleaner emission footprint.
You're a bit too far into Lala land my friend. When you pull together ideas from fantasy, they must be coherent with what Mercedes-AMG is currently doing or would adopt within reason. (Knowing how the company thinks.) The AMG 4-banger was designed to be paired together as a V8 engine for the top-tier models. If AMG wanted a 5-cylinder, a V10 would have been the order of the day and it would have been geared a bit differently than what we have today. This is not where Mercedes AMG is headed. The design principles of the M133 4-banger, M139 and M177 was to downsize displacement while concentrating horsepower and torque with a cleaner emission footprint.
AbsoluteUnit
Das Beste Enthusiast
Oh what I'd do for an AMG V10.
klier
Premium
Sound has nothing to do with it at all. You can make any I6 sound like that too if you wanted. There literally is nothing whatsoever an I5 has over an I6. Zip zero.
No same person wants a transverse engine to begin with, so there is not point in a 5 pot.
Design FIRST
M-Sport Meister
Simply interjecting briefly..."audiotactile synthesis" (obviously, I had to look the term up 
), is a big thing more recently with manufacturers of BEV vehicles. And the relevant engineers are getting better and better by the day, it seems. Most recent case in point is the AMG GT XX concept.
), is a big thing more recently with manufacturers of BEV vehicles. And the relevant engineers are getting better and better by the day, it seems. Most recent case in point is the AMG GT XX concept.The A Class has a transverse engine layout, however I’d love to see an A-Class with the engine layout of the F20.
Centurion
Apex Apex Predator
High pitched AMG sounds as wrong as a rumbly supercharged Ferrari.
The Pagani AMG V12 are high pitched as well.
Design FIRST
M-Sport Meister
AMG conducting some product promotion on German city streets:
This one in Berlin. And the team has been spotted in Düsseldorf as well.
This one in Berlin. And the team has been spotted in Düsseldorf as well.
AbsoluteUnit
Das Beste Enthusiast
Why not?
The M120 was a screamer even with the AMG touch.
But they could try a rumbly grumbly V10 too, in the same way the M275/9 sound thunderous, rather than screaming.
A V10 just have a unique sound signature, and it's a shame AMG never explored them.
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Mercedes-AMG
Mercedes-AMG GmbH, commonly known as AMG (Aufrecht, Melcher, Großaspach),
is the high-performance subsidiary of Mercedes-Benz AG. AMG independently
hires engineers and contracts with manufacturers to customize Mercedes-Benz
AMG vehicles. The company has its headquarters in Affalterbach,
Baden-Württemberg, Germany.
Official website: Mercedes-AMG
Official website: Mercedes-AMG
