SL-Class New from Mercedes-AMG: SL55 AMG

[bum-man]

Wow the monster lives!!!

I have a question for those who have driven the car.

In comparision to the DSG or SMG from Audi and BMW how does Mb's tanny feel? Is it fast when it shifts? Because they say "for a true F1 feel" and that makes me wonder how true?

LOL! No, it maybe the fastest torque converter automatic in the world, but it won't be able to hold a candle to DSG or SMG III. It also has been said that Merc is working on a dual clutch gearbox of their own to rectify this.

 

[martinbo]

It's an excuse nothing more, for what reason I don't know. They announced the new V8 for the R and M classes respectively, so their reasoning kind of sucks.

So what's your take on all of this? C'mon, I know that you've got some insight into this... and, will they turbocharge that AMG watchamacallit (I can't remember the engine code) V8?

 

[Zafiro]

Ok I try this thread instead. I know someoen has an answer for me

How does this 7G and the paddles works. Is it possible to change gear from let's say fifth to third whenever you want and also can you change gear at any speed you like?

 

[martinbo]

What are you on about you Swedish lunatic?

We're discussing the AMG engine philosophy behind the FI V8 and the NA V8.

But ja, ok, to answer your question:

1. Yes, within the correct speed parameters, one can press the downshift button twice from fifth and the electronics will select third gear accordingly...
2. If the road speed is too high for the geared speed, then the software will not permit the selection of, let's say, third gear.

Why do you ask?

 

[Vivaki]

Wow the monster lives!!!

I have a question for those who have driven the car.

In comparision to the DSG or SMG from Audi and BMW how does Mb's tanny feel? Is it fast when it shifts? Because they say "for a true F1 feel" and that makes me wonder how true?

Not driven the car but I read in AE's and Autocar's first drive of the facelift SL and they mentioned that if you opt for the optional sports manual mode for the 7G (Which adds the paddle shifts) the shifts are 30% faster in manual mode than auto mode.

 

[martinbo]

Not driven the car but I read in AE's and Autocar's first drive of the facelift SL and they mentioned that if you opt for the optional sports manual mode for the 7G (Which adds the paddle shifts) the shifts are 30% faster in manual mode than auto mode.

That's obviously for non-AMG model SL's eh Vivaki?

 

[Vivaki]

That's obviously for non-AMG model SL's eh Vivaki?

Thats correct. Its optional on the SL350 and the SL500.

There not extensive test drives. Just a short first drive just to give em a taste of the SL.

Link to AE drive: Sl first drive
Link to AC drive: Sl first drive

 

[martinbo]

Thats correct. Its optional on the SL350 and the SL500.

Link to AE drive: Sl first drive
Link to AC drive: Autocar first drive

Thanks dude.

 

[Merc1]

Then explain to me why they're going to introduce the '63 engine in the E and CLS classes which: a) are no lightweights in their own rights
b) will suffer from exactly the same performance deficits you describe above

Irrespective of ultimate vehicle mass, the cars performance is directly attributable to the KW/ton and Nm/ton ratios. So by the same notion that you put forward above, a CLS will also have a lower torque to weight ratio in exactly the same manner that an SL will.

These statements by Merc's "boss", I've read them but remain unconvinced that they're in any way official.

You're welcome to rub my nose in it when you're proven right of course!

Well the big difference between the CLS/E is that they're getting a big hp jump, from 476 to 515hp combined with the 7G-Tronic. The SL/CL/S would only be getting roughly a 10hp increase and less torque, big difference. Pluse the CLS/E are lighter than the SL/CL/S just enough for it to make a diffference in the CLS/E. Mercedes isn't introducing the new 6.2L V8 in the SL for this very reason. I'll bet my last dollar that a turbocharged version of the new AMG V8 will show up either at the end of this year or early next year. It may even be a 6L version of the 6.2L to make it more durable for turbocharging. We know Mercedes has no problem building a car for one year with one motor and switching it, just like they did with the CLS55 AMG. It came here in Jan 2005 as a 2006 model and the 2007 model will be the CLS63. Of course they couldn't just stop building the SL55 just because the SL63 isn't ready so they just updated the 5.5L SC V8 for another year's duty. There is just no way Mercedes is going to introduce a S63 with 515hp/465lb-ft torque when the current S55 has 500hp and 516lb-ft of torque. There has to be either an enlarged version of the new V8 on the way or a turbocharged version. You'll see and I won't rub it in too bad when I'm proven right...lol!

M

 

[Zafiro]

What are you on about you Swedish lunatic?

We're discussing the AMG engine philosophy behind the FI V8 and the NA V8.

But ja, ok, to answer your question:

1. Yes, within the correct speed parameters, one can press the downshift button twice from fifth and the electronics will select third gear accordingly...
2. If the road speed is too high for the geared speed, then the software will not permit the selection of, let's say, third gear.

Why do you ask?

Martinbo, Im entitled to ask what I want and I want to know about 7G and the paddles. If someone is on something, its you. Hostility is flying in the air from your side and I dont like it. So to answer your question, no Im not on anything. Geezz dude.

I ask cause I want to know the differences with this and SMG/DSG. Yes its not a seqventiell gearbox I know that but what are the differences. Is it the speed to change gears? Cuase to me it looks like you can do the same things like you can with SMG.

 

[bum-man]

Hmm…To be honest I’m actually kind of confused and don’t really understand much that is going on. I can only guess they have something else in store for the SL, perhaps in a year or so? I’m certain that if something special does indeed arrive it will not be the rumored turboed V8 (M157); which was later rumored to be canned due to the high costs of the new design.

Here’s what I’m hoping. If you take a look at the M5 I think it is pretty clear how much of an impact a transmission can make. Of course Mercs’ new 7G-Tronic is a fine transmission in a S550, but if you want to get the best out of your AMG performance engine you’re going to need a performance transmission to compliment it rather then bottleneck it. A modern clutched semi-manual is the one and only way to go these days, and they are not the clunky jerky things they used to be. So I only hope this is what’s holding Merc up with the SL.

Just curious, anyone have any weight numbers on the M5’s SMG and Speedshift 7G-tronic? I’ve always been told manuals were considerably lighter then autos.

 

[Snake Vargas]

Martinbo, Im entitled to ask what I want and I want to know about 7G and the paddles. If someone is on something, its you. Hostility is flying in the air from your side and I dont like it. So to answer your question, no Im not on anything. Geezz dude.

I ask cause I want to know the differences with this and SMG/DSG. Yes its not a seqventiell gearbox I know that but what are the differences. Is it the speed to change gears? Cuase to me it looks like you can do the same things like you can with SMG.

I'm getting the vibe that Martin was being friendly - strange as it may seem. If at least in Australia, you might refer to your enemy as "a bad sort", but you might call your good friend a "bloody bastard"

The internet loses most nonverbal language, meaning that things you would otherwise have seen in body language, like winking or a smile, or in the actual tone of voice, are lost. Emoticons are only a partially effective solution..

Anyhow, I believe the 7G-Tronic is a normal torque convertor automatic that happens to have seven gears. You can control its gears simply as with any other modern auto - by using the paddles to tell a computer what to do, which will process your commands etc. etc.; whereas the SMG is a true sequential manual gearbox, with (roboticised) clutch. I guess you still have to go through a computer to control the gears though.

Bum-man, I thought that manual trannies would be lighter because of them having fewer components, mainly. The BMW SMG is hydraulically actuated, IIRC? So there's added weight compared to conventional manuals, already. Apparently the ZF and Aisin 6-speed autos are lighter and smaller than existing 5-speed autos due to the gearset they use, which has less gears; but I don't imagine it would be easy to find information on the gearboxes alone for those cars.

 

[Merc1]

Anyhow, I believe the 7G-Tronic is a normal torque convertor automatic that happens to have seven gears. You can control its gears simply as with any other modern auto - by using the paddles to tell a computer what to do, which will process your commands etc. etc.; whereas the SMG is a true sequential manual gearbox, with (roboticised) clutch. I guess you still have to go through a computer to control the gears though.

This is correct. Mercedes doesn't yet have a true SMG/DSG type gearbox.

The 7G-Tronic is just the best automatic tranny going IMO, but it is just that an automatic.

M

 

[Zafiro]

I'm getting the vibe that Martin was being friendly - strange as it may seem. If at least in Australia, you might refer to your enemy as "a bad sort", but you might call your good friend a "bloody bastard"

The internet loses most nonverbal language, meaning that things you would otherwise have seen in body language, like winking or a smile, or in the actual tone of voice, are lost. Emoticons are only a partially effective solution..

Martin always put a smiley if he isnt serious. I didnt see one this time, so it sounded very harsh to me. Sometimes I have trouble to understand when he means business or not. Martin and me usually get along with each other but I didnt feel it this time. This sounded very serious to me. If he dont tell me otherwise, then I unfortunaly feeling some bad vibes here.

 

[PanterroR]

Martin always put a smiley if he isnt serious. I didnt see one this time, so it sounded very harsh to me. Sometimes I have trouble to understand when he means business or not. Martin and me usually get along with each other but I didnt feel it this time. This sounded very serious to me. If he dont tell me otherwise, then I unfortunaly feeling some bad vibes here.

He'll tell you otherwise, be sure, but in "Mr. Boruvka's way"...

 

[Zafiro]

He'll tell you otherwise, be sure, but in "Mr. Boruvka's way"...

you mean, with words my dictionary cant translate

 

[PanterroR]

you mean, with words my dictionary cant translate

Lol, no, he didn't mean harsh and he'll explain you that in his own way.

 

[sunnyman12]

I'll answer my own question...they are retarded...however this car still looks stellar and IMO the best Mercedes made