Mercedes Vision EQXX

[Deleted member 57437]

The EQXX exterior dimensions should be interesting. We'll know by the evening of January 3rd.

 

[GTA45E]

The Vision EQXX looks like it might be a CLS successor in some form.
It has the 4-door coupe shape, zooming into the photo the rear looks like it has a boot lid like the CLS, instead of a liftback like the EQS EQE models.

History has it 90-95% of the time a Vision concept from Mercedes usually foretell ideas that will hit a production model.

The video at 1:38 foretells that this EQXX is a Vision for a 4-door limo luxury product, not just science proof.

 

[Deleted member 57437]

Exciting images at 1:29 and 3:52.

 

[klier]

History has it 90-95% of the time a Vision concept from Mercedes usually foretell ideas that will hit a production model.

That's very broad because for the most part these Vision cars have no connection with the real world whatsoever at all. If anything, they makes the final production car "based on the Vision" look like a complete retard.

But that doesn't change the fact that this upcoming Vision looks really really nice so far.

 

[GTA45E]

That's very broad because for the most part these Vision cars have no connection with the real world whatsoever at all. If anything, they makes the final production car "based on the Vision" look like a complete retard.

But that doesn't change the fact that this upcoming Vision looks really really nice so far.

When it comes to Vision concepts from Mercedes nothing is ever that "black and white". Vision models are mere abstract forms with production model ideas thrown into them.
You just have to know where to look for the connections when the production models come to light.

For example, The Vision Maybach Ultimate Luxury basically looked like crap on the outside IMO. it is not related to any production model, however, its interior was a clear showcase for the current GLS, GLE models.

On the opposite end of the spectrum, the Maybach 6 has absolutely nothing about its interior that is connected to any production MB. The exterior has connections with the new SL and Mercedes Maybach S models.

 

[Pagani]

Also can say this vision is everything the EQS should have been. One of the designers said something about not accepting any compromise that resulted in a “shit looking” design. Clearly that person was not involved in the EQS.

Lots is riding on the EQXX, if only to see whether there is hope on a second generation EQ based car.

 

[HighestOfHigh]

Also can say this vision is everything the EQS should have been. One of the designers said something about not accepting any compromise that resulted in a “shit looking” design. Clearly that person was not involved in the EQS.

Lots is riding on the EQXX, if only to see whether there is hope on a second generation EQ based car.

The EQS is exactly what it should be without taking from the S-class. You really think they created a new concept to please cry babies for the looks of the EQS??? Wow…

 

[Merc1]

I don't see how a lot is riding on the EQXX if it isn't a preview of a car intended for production as a whole.

M

 

[klier]

When it comes to Vision concepts from Mercedes nothing is ever that "black and white". Vision models are mere abstract forms with production model ideas thrown into them.
You just have to know where to look for the connections when the production models come to light.

For example, The Vision Maybach Ultimate Luxury basically looked like crap on the outside IMO. it is not related to any production model, however, its interior was a clear showcase for the current GLS, GLE models.

On the opposite end of the spectrum, the Mayback 6 has absolutely nothing about its interior that is connected to any production MB. The exterior has connections with the new SL and Mercedes Maybach S models.

All fair, but this is theory and it doesn't work in real life. These Vision cars from both BMW and MB should disappear altogether. They wet our appetite and then pour a bottle of water over it.

 

[Deleted member 57437]

 

[Ozy]

Finally a black concept car from Mercedes…

 

[GTA45E]

All fair, but this is theory and it doesn't work in real life. These Vision cars from both BMW and MB should disappear altogether. They wet our appetite and then pour a bottle of water over it.

The concept models are the best way to push future ideas to the marketplace. By now you should know your favorite company and how it operates.
The concept models are a gray area that should be somewhat predictable by now. The problem is you might be expecting a little too much of what is seen, then get upset
when the production models break cover because they don't have the appeal of those fancy concepts.

(I will let you in on a secret, put yourself in the designer room with virtual empathic intelligence. Study what your favorite car company is doing in the design room if it's only by youtube videos. This will help you gain some insight by placing yourself there and help turn would-be expectations down to a minimum. This would also greatly help in sifting through what is possible for production model compared to what actually came from the abstract world.
Playing this game turns down the feelings of overblown expectation.)

 

[Merc1]

For the second time in the last 40 years, Mercedes has been rocked by a change and/or a competitor in the market. This whole EV thing has shaken them so badly that they can't design a good looking EV. Porsche, Audi, Lucid and others do it with ease, but the car company that made some of the best looking cars of all time, can't. Amazing. They've been knocked off balance very badly.

M

 

[Deleted member 57437]

The concept models are the best way to push future ideas to the marketplace. By now you should know your favorite company and how it operates.
The concept models are a gray area that should be somewhat predictable by now. The problem is you might be expecting a little too much of what is seen, then get upset
when the production models break cover because they don't have the appeal of those fancy concepts.

(I will let you in on a secret, put yourself in the designer room with virtual empathic intelligence. Study what your favorite car company is doing in the design room if it's only by youtube videos. This will help you gain some insight by placing yourself there and help turn would-be expectations down to a minimum. This would also greatly help in sifting through what is possible for production model compared to what actually came from the abstract world.
Playing this game turns down the feelings of overblown expectation.)

I can appreciate the degree of transparency that Polestar is presenting with it's From Concept To Car video series and the insights regarding the development of the Polestar 5 (aka production Precept) sedan. I'd love to see similar presentation formats by other manufacturers as well.

 

[klier]

For the second time in the last 40 years, Mercedes has been rocked by a change and/or a competitor in the market. This whole EV thing has shaken them so badly that they can't design a good looking EV. Porsche, Audi, Lucid and others do it with ease, but the car company that made some of the best looking cars of all time, can't. Amazing. They've been knocked off balance very badly.

M

All Germans are, except Porsche with the Taycan. And yes the Audi equivalent is a sad piece of rebadging, not worth even mentioning.
Let's hope they recover because otherwise the German car industry will end up like the French one.......or much worse..........the United Kingdom's

All these decades of development, patents, engineers and whatever else, they can throw 90% in the bin and start over. The Germans are still numb about it and are in disbelief.

 

[klier]

100k employees and 80% is redundant in a couple of years.

All dealerships a stone around the neck in a pond, as internet orders will take over, straight from the factory.

Major, major problems ahead. Tesla, Lucid and Rivian can't stop laughing. They're always ahead per default. They're lean.

 

[CrunchSlaughtered]

100k employees and 80% is redundant in a couple of years.

All dealerships a stone around the neck in a pond, as internet orders will take over, straight from the factory.

Major, major problems ahead. Tesla, Lucid and Rivian can't stop laughing. They're always ahead per default. They're lean.

Their biggest problems are their major assets-the factories. They stay in their books with billions value, but in reality they are worth almost nothing. You can not be competitive if you produce a car for 30 hours and your competitor does it for 10 hours. This means all the machines are outdated, but new technologies and mashines need new buidings. So to be competitive, they need to scrap all their production equipment and demolish all the buildings. So the real value of these assets is: the value of the lend plot minus the cost of demolition. And then the numbers in their balance sheets will look alwful. But the depth in VAGs perspective is 220 bln and against it stays the inflated value of the outdated factories.
That's why a company like Lucid is worth more than the established manufacturers.

 

[Mr. Mercedes]

Laughable hyperbole.

The Germans are not going anywhere.

 

[CrunchSlaughtered]

Laughable hyperbole.

The Germans are not going anywhere.

Laughable? Have you seen the market capitalization of the US start ups and the German manufacturers?
I'll share with you some personal experience. Maybe you've heart of Komatsu. The working equipment of an excavator consists of a boom, an arm and a bucket. The joint of the boom and the arm is the element that is stressed the most. What they did was to replace the welded construction on the boom with a casting. Of one single element. The result was 40% less weight, more wear resistance, less fatigue of the material, 100% repeatabity, perfect quality, enormous durability, because you can optimise the construction and don't have the unpredictable heat deformations coused by the welding. The 60 kg less weight allowed them to increase the bucket capacity with 3% or 40 l earth. An excavator of this class makes about 5 000 000 cycles in its lifetime, which results in 200 000 cub .m eart. With 1,5 Euro pro cubic this equals to 300 000 Euro more for the owner of the excavator as revenues, just from one detail, or two times the price of the excavator. Now imagine replacing a component that consists of 172 welded parts with just one casting. The initial investment in the casting technology is enourmous but with bigger production numbers it pays off fast. But for this is needed huge amout of money, for which you need big market capitalization in order to access them.

 

[klier]

Their biggest problems are their major assets-the factories. They stay in their books with billions value, but in reality they are worth almost nothing. You can not be competitive if you produce a car for 30 hours and your competitor does it for 10 hours. This means all the machines are outdated, but new technologies and mashines need new buidings. So to be competitive, they need to scrap all their production equipment and demolish all the buildings. So the real value of these assets is: the value of the lend plot minus the cost of demolition. And then the numbers in their balance sheets will look alwful. But the depth in VAGs perspective is 220 bln and against it stays the inflated value of the outdated factories.
That's why a company like Lucid is worth more than the established manufacturers.

I don't think the factories are a problem at all, but a huge asset. You need to somehow make millions of cars after all, and I rather not see them make cars in tents like Tesla. You need to read the latest Zipse interview, because nothing of of what you say seems true. BMW's Munich plant (only car plant in the world in the middle of a Metropolitan area) is not going anywhere, and will be fully electric if needed in 2026. With ICE development possible where needed. Same will likely be true for all the other plants.

I wrote my previous post here before reading that interview, and it's quite enlightening. BMW is actually hiring in 2022, not laying people off.

Laughable? Have you seen the market capitalization of the US start ups and the German manufacturers?
I'll share with you some personal experience. Maybe you've heart of Komatsu. The working equipment of an excavator consists of a boom, an arm and a bucket. The joint of the boom and the arm is the element that is stressed the most. What they did was to replace the welded construction on the boom with a casting. Of one single element. The result was 40% less weight, more wear resistance, less fatigue of the material, 100% repeatabity, perfect quality, enormous durability, because you can optimise the construction and don't have the unpredictable heat deformations coused by the welding. The 60 kg less weight allowed them to increase the bucket capacity with 3% or 40 l earth. An excavator of this class makes about 5 000 000 cycles in its lifetime, which results in 200 000 cub .m eart. With 1,5 Euro pro cubic this equals to 300 000 Euro more for the owner of the excavator as revenues, just from one detail, or two times the price of the excavator. Now imagine replacing a component that consists of 172 welded parts with just one casting. The initial investment in the casting technology is enourmous but with bigger production numbers it pays off fast. But for this is needed huge amout of money, for which you need big market capitalization in order to access them.

@Sunny is also really good with these analogies, but he usually compares the big German brands to Nokia and Polaroid.

None of these work.