SLS (C197) Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG (spy shots & info)

[martinbo]

People. Don't shoot the messenger. This is a public internet car forum, attended by enthusiasts for enthusiasts. If BMW have the foresight to, in a German car forum, to create brand hype using a clever way of revealing not-too-much information then so be it. It's quite possible that Mercedes Benz has a different approach - or none at all - regarding the propogation of product and strategy information on internet forums.

The fact is, BMW, as far as I'm concerned, provide their BMW enthusiasts with more information more of the time. So really, let's be mature about it and you choose to use it or don't use it.

The SLR is a classic example of a supercar splitting opinion right down the middle and for that reason it is a great success. It has its supporters and its detractors. It is in every way a spectacular looking car - no question. But, on the other side of the fence sits a fair and justifiable amount of criticism that the SLR for all its sticker value did not live up to expectations in the dynamics department.

What I've said is not supposition or conjecture; the two above facts are wholly and completely substantiated.

The SLR: brilliant to many Mercedes lovers, criticised by just above every other influential opinion in modern print.

The SLS, very plainly, is a decisive and clinically-engineered retort to the negative criticism levelled by the SLR's detractors - once and for all. And, I'm certain, it shan't disappoint.

And, please, let's leave the intolerable personal criticism out of this.

 

[klier]

Funny how BMW fans are ripping the SLR apart when BMW hasn't come up with anything, I mean anything close to it.

I'd take a heavy roadster over any SUV any day.

Funny how BMW fans don't care about SLR but do like the Zonda, LP640/670, Enzo, Carrera GT, etc.

Edit; and I think most BMW fans like what we've seen from the SLS on a technical level too.

I mean, how can a sane non-MB-fanboy like a car like the SL65 Black Series with 670 hp that's slower on the Top Gear track than a standard F430 or old Mucie (not the LP640 but the first slow one). Cars like the SL65 BS and SLR have a big mouth but can't back it up. I hate that.

 

[Centurion]

I don't own this board but Scott is a member like any (although he has his own section) of us which mean he is entitled to say whatever he wants.

The difference is that Scott is not a private member, he's a commercial member on BMW payroll which makes him a special character as all his posts can almost be classified as a newsletter as they are purely about BMW, what they are doing and how great they are. And no, I wouldn't want a Mercedes or Porsche guy tainting the forum either as there are plenty of strictly Porsche and Mercedes forum I can visit if I wanted to.

Scott can have his channel but the daft comments made in other sections are daft and of poor character. Really, every single post he has ever made is 100% in BMW's favour. I have no problem with Eni as he's a traditional member in the sense that he engages in discussions and don't write posts in the same monotonic and robotic spirit as Scott who is purely commercial.

 

[klier]

Uhm...I think you do have a point there. But it's a very small one

 

[Zafiro]

The difference is that Scott is not a private member, he's a commercial member on BMW payroll which makes him a special character as all his posts can almost be classified as a newsletter as they are purely about BMW, what they are doing and how great they are. And no, I wouldn't want a Mercedes or Porsche guy tainting the forum either as there are plenty of strictly Porsche and Mercedes forum I can visit if I wanted to.

Doesnt matter what he is, we are all alike. President Obama, me, Elton John, Tiger Woods, Bob Lutz, they can all express their opinion about cars. This is a board about cars and we can say whatever we want as long as its not personal. Scott mention Jenson/Brawn and something went wrong, its so sad and funny at the same time to see people getting offended by this. People need to act like adults and move on, its really that simple. Gosh, I cant believe we are arguing about this To me this is purely retarded.

Only thing I can agree on , this is not a BMW vs MB thread, its a thread about SLS. This thread went overboard a couple of pages ago, unfortuanly Moderators seem to be on vacation, including me.

 

[martinbo]

What's wrong with a BMW representative giving their opinion on a car? If BMW thinks a particular competitor brand's car is rubbish, then I for one would want to know about it. Why wouldn't one? So what if they say it's crapola?

I would (and do) find that rather interesting. And I love seeing where they're layering that marketing babble on thick and fast. Do I want them to stop? Hell no - it's one of the very catalysts for discussion on this forum. Do I think they're "fascists?" Oh, for the sweet love of mercy - spare me from the infantile - this is a car forum.

They're only cars. Get over it people.

 

[GBOY]

LUW is just against people who are paid to misinform the public as he sees it. An exception could be made for that IMO. BMW CMs can inform and promote BMW products all they want .. no problems there but I agree with Centurion on deliberate misinformation if that's in fact, the case.

 

[Shining Star]

Why don't we try to get back to the SLS...

 

[Zafiro]

Why don't we try to get back to the SLS...

I agree 110%. I'm thinking if delete every post from now that do not concern SLS. I'm going to have a talk with other Moderators the see what they think.

 

[HighestOfHigh]

Ok here is my opinion about this conversation and the SLS VS SLS.

It doesn’t matter what anyone on this board says nor does it matter what is in print about the SLR. The SLR is an amazing car for what it is and what it did for Mercedes-Benz as a company. The design is very exotic and extreme. Mercedes-Benz did what Audi and BMW couldn’t do during that time period. Whether it couldn’t handle like a Lambo or accelerate like a Ferrari Enzo is debatable. For what the car is, it should be respected.

I think the problem is how certain BMW fans have come in a SLS tread to take the time out to be disrespectful to a Mercedes-Benz sports car that BMW doesn’t even have the balls to build. And yes, I understand that some Benz fans have let their excitement for the SLS allow them to disregard the SLR. On the other hand what everyone needs to understand is that these are two different types of cars. The SLR was for an audience of the $400k crowd, where the SLS will be more of a $250k range. That automatically makes them serve different purposes.

I can understand how a Mercedes-Benz fan could be irritated by people constantly saying “Benz failed with the SLR”, “It’s a Failure” or “It had nothing on the Enzo and Porsche”. That is complete BS and it is extremely annoying. It’s one thing to say “oh I didn’t like the design” or “I didn’t feel that it drove as well as the Enzo”.

And matter of fact, how many of you who are being so disrespectful to the SLR have actually driven it? Seriously?

Yes, everyone is entitled to their opinion. Of course I am the only one who usually gets banned for it. On the other hand if you come in here and call a Mercedes-Benz car a failure, you should expect to get criticism for it. I am sure that if I went in a BMW thread and called the 3 series a failure some of you would have a stroke.

My thing is be respectful. I understand that there are big expectations for the SLS and its performance numbers. But some of you can be more respectful towards the SLR then you have been. Yes, we may allow it for the R-class. On the other hand to call the SLR…a failure like it was nothing for Mercedes. Then yes, you will meet some resistance.


Now back to the SLS....

I'm really looking forward to seeing how the SLS LED lights will look.

 

[Shining Star]

Thank you HOH...now we can get back to the gullwing..

Anyway...I'm really looking foward to seeing how the front design looks...from what I see the front will hopefully be very radical.

 

[Tarek]

Interesting twist is goin on here.

 

[martinbo]

HoH - great post. I have no qualms with your point-of-view on the matter of SLS vs. SLR and whether or not the SLR deserves credit.

What is out of order is to launch a personal tirade against a member based on conjecture and personal contempt. And I for one find it unacceptable and totally irrelevant to the discussion around the SLS. The claim around fascist instructions? Slander. Totally infantile and unacceptable. And all because a BMW contributor posted a one-liner around the rumoured possible leveraging off Brawn-Mercedes recent F1 success.

This is quite different to saying that the SLS (in the eyes of BMW fans) looks to be a far better supercar than the much-criticised (by most of the influential motoring writers in the world) SLR.

All that BMW fans in this thread are saying is that:
a) The SLR is documented in popular discussion and writing by people more qualified than internet forum frequenters as being a car that did not meet expectations as a bonafide supercar. It is widely regarded as flawed.
b) The SLS on the other hand appears to be a far more technically focused product and thus will be a better supercar than the SLR.

In the light of this comparison there is very little "disrespect" at play. Especially given that we're comparing cars from the same stable.

This has nothing to do with whether you've driven the SLR or not. 99% of us here would not be in an informed position regarding the car even if we had driven it. That's why we rely on motoring scribes who do have the experience and are paid the salary to give us an informed point of view. Interestingly - it's glaringly apparent that this criticism did not fall on deaf ears - Mercedes Benz' reaction is more telling than 30 pages of internet forum debate.

 

[HighestOfHigh]

This has nothing to do with whether you've driven the SLR or not. 99% of us here would not be in an informed position regarding the car even if we had driven it. That's why we rely on motoring scribes who do have the experience and are paid the salary to give us an informed point of view.

See that is my issue. I NEVER depend on what other people say. I remember the time I keep bashing the 3 series and everyones response would be "Have you driven it". So what is the difference with the SLR. You can not depend on someone else opinion. It's like going to the dealership and letting your wife test drive the car and the car is suppose to be for you. I have to know the car myself and get a feel for it. Of course I haven't driven the SLR myself, but I still appreciate what it did for Mercedes-Benz as a brand.

Interestingly - it's glaringly apparent that this criticism did not fall on deaf ears - Mercedes Benz' reaction is more telling than 30 pages of internet forum debate.

That is expected. Of course they would improve upon driving dynamics and my take a difference approach. The SLR was the SLR and the SLS should be different considering it serves another purpose. Mercedes-Benz will always learn from it's previous models.

Thing is if you don't like the model, that is fine. Everyone is entitled to just that. BUT when you call a car a "failure", that is a completely different story and the SLR is far from that.

What is out of order is to launch a personal tirade against a member based on conjecture and personal contempt. And I for one find it unacceptable and totally irrelevant to the discussion around the SLS. The claim around fascist instructions? Slander. Totally infantile and unacceptable. And all because a BMW contributor posted a one-liner around the rumoured possible leveraging off Brawn-Mercedes recent F1 success.

Well I can't speak for that particular member, but I can understand his point. It might not have been that one line, it could have been just building up. Even though this is an online forum, when people keep typing the same thing and you see it as disrespectful you might not say nothing right then and there. Later on you just reach your breaking point and that could have been what happened.

I know.....I have been there plenty of times.
.................................................................................................................................

Thank you HOH...now we can get back to the gullwing..

Anyway...I'm really looking foward to seeing how the front design looks...from what I see the front will hopefully be very radical.

Yes, the front will be interesting. I really concerned at how the grill will look. Of course I know everyones biggest concern is where the door handles will be.

I think I would prefer the "regular" fog lights then the LED ones as far as this car is concerned, but I do believe we will get the LED ones.

 

[Shining Star]

Oh yes, the door handle discussion...

I am a little worried that the grille will look too wide and dominate the front fascia. As for the fogs, MB has covered them up on the camo very well...it's hard to tell if they will be LED or regular.

 

[HighestOfHigh]

Oh yes, the door handle discussion...

I am a little worried that the grille will look too wide and dominate the front fascia. As for the fogs, MB has covered them up on the camo very well...it's hard to tell if they will be LED or regular.

Yea, it will be interesting to see how they will pull off the grill. I wonder who they will consider competitiors to this model.

 

[coolraoul]

I think one main competitor of the SLS could be the R8. Another will surely be the R8. One also shouldn't forget the R8. Just like the R8, too. And finally, the R8 is in the eye of the SLS.

Of course, 911, Skyline, 'Vette even will be aimed at, but IMO the SLS is designed to beat the R8. Same "sporty, but not too much" approach, similar 140.000€ pricetag (for the V10 R8), etc...

 

[HighestOfHigh]

i think one main competitor of the sls could be the r8. Another will surely be the r8. One also shouldn't forget the r8. Just like the r8, too. And finally, the r8 is in the eye of the sls. :d

of course, 911, skyline, 'vette even will be aimed at, but imo the sls is designed to beat the r8. Same "sporty, but not too much" approach, similar 140.000€ pricetag (for the v10 r8), etc...

LOL !!!!

I would like to see it tested against the GT-R though.

 

[Shining Star]

Yep...this car is aimed straight at the R8, but is named SLS gullwing to bring some heritage.

 

[Mr Robert]

I NEVER depend on what other people say. I remember the time I keep bashing the 3 series and everyones response would be "Have you driven it". So what is the difference with the SLR.

They are two very different cases. The BMW and the SLR got very different receptions. That is a start. Going against the general opinion in whichever question calls for more in terms of justification of said view. Furthermore, everyone in the civilized world can have a drive in the 3-series if they want, so it is very easy to have a try and say what you think. Hence, the question is called for. The same availability can't really be had with the SLR. It is almost impossible for the average Joe to have a try, even harder to get to have a try by which you can pass a judgement. Therefore, we will have to rely on the opionion of those who have had a chance to take the SLR for a proper spin.

Yes, the front will be interesting. I really concerned at how the grill will look. Of course I know everyones biggest concern is where the door handles will be.

I think I would prefer the "regular" fog lights then the LED ones as far as this car is concerned, but I do believe we will get the LED ones.

I think I love this front. Sleek and by the looks, very retro...