Vs Autocar: S5 vs. 335i

[RICHBOY]

The 335i just ruined the S5 fun.
I think BMW inadvertently drove a knife into Audi A4 game plan with the 335i.
Price wise is more of a 3.2 litre V6 A4 competitor however it is generation ahead in the performance department. It is practically an S4/S5 competitor in the performance department.
Moral of the story is that Audi needs to find a way to make the S4/S5 cheaper to be truly competitive with the 335i.

Nice sound bite but it takes a little more than fun for me to but up the kind of cash these vehicles cost. And if you notice it seems to be the same post revised when discussing the 335i, it's fun to drive! I get it! But what about the interior? What about it looking like a revised 6-Series, not to say that's a bad thing but still, and lets be honest the noose has certainly tightened up on the 3-Series now hasn't it? I'm thinking it's because of the all new A/S5 and the fact that more people are starting to figure out it makes more sense comparing the CLK to the 3-Series and not the C-Class.

 

[Deutsch]

Well there's most definitely a mass production, turbocharged Audi engine in the pipe line for widespread use across the Audi model line up. However I'm not sure of the impact it will have compared to the N54 Bi Turbo thats snapped up awards and rave reviews left and right, and has established a solid reputation, if not a benchmark for the engine development across the industry. The 2.0T has more than taken care of the low end of the VWAG model empire, now it's time for them to kick things up a notch and bring something to the middle performance segment. Will be interesting to see what developments transpire between now and later.

 

[Mr. M]

We just received A5 prices here. An A5 3.2 Quattro costs as much as a 335i - go figure. The A5 just doesn't seem to be a 3er competitor - a "4er" competitor is more appropriate, if there will ever be one... The A5 after all has a transplanted A6 interior.

 

[chonkoa]

Nice sound bite but it takes a little more than fun for me to but up the kind of cash these vehicles cost. And if you notice it seems to be the same post revised when discussing the 335i, it's fun to drive! I get it! But what about the interior? What about it looking like a revised 6-Series, not to say that's a bad thing but still, and lets be honest the noose has certainly tightened up on the 3-Series now hasn't it? I'm thinking it's because of the all new A/S5 and the fact that more people are starting to figure out it makes more sense comparing the CLK to the 3-Series and not the C-Class.

I would rather say the 335 has tightened the noose around the Audi A4/S4/S5 and MB C-Class and CLK Class.

From a Price perspective in the US
Audi A4 3.2 litre Quattro=$37,640
BMW 335i=$38,900
MB C350 =$38,600

From the performance bracket perspective with Price
Audi S4=$48,700. I am sure the S5 will cost a bit more.
MB CLK 550=$54,900
BMW E92 335i= $40,800.

So, from a price-performance matrix, I see the 335i as a clear winner

 

[Mr. M]

So, from a price-performance matrix, I see the 335i as a clear winner

I thought we agreed on power-to-price ratio.

 

[chonkoa]

I thought we agreed on power-to-price ratio.

I forgot.

 

[Deutsch]

Something else quite interesting: I'm normally hard on cars when the manufacture states in the press release that the car is a "sports car" but falls short in the real world with a lack of true sporting intent. With that said, Audi has completely hit the mark with the A5, I was mislead by my own presumptuous thinking that this was intended to be a "sports car" but never once, anywhere in any of Audi's PR material do they call the A5 a "sports car" - as I've discovered this evening. It was meant to be a GT people, and these hardcore supercar/sports car freaks(primarily the British Automotive media) have been incredibly unfair in grading the A5/S5 against such standards. The A5/S5 was meant to be any easy going machine, not a high strung athlete.

 

[Mr. M]

Something else quite interesting: I'm normally hard on cars when the manufacture states in the press release that the car is a "sports car" but falls short in the real world with a lack of true sporting intent. With that said, Audi has completely hit the mark with the A5, I was mislead by my own presumptuous thinking that this was intended to be a "sports car" but never once, anywhere in any of Audi's PR material do they call the A5 a "sports car" - as I've discovered this evening. It was meant to be a GT people, and these hardcore supercar/sports car freaks(primarily the British Automotive media) have been incredibly unfair in grading the A5/S5 against such standards. The A5/S5 was meant to be any easy going machine, not a high strung athlete.

That is true. I guess people are to eager to see whether the MLP worked out well. But in the A5's application its sporting abilities won't show well - wait for the next A4, now that's a better yardstick...

 

[Zafiro]

We just received A5 prices here. An A5 3.2 Quattro costs as much as a 335i - go figure.

Same here in Sweden. I dont see the S5 as a true 335i competitior if there ever come a 335si then maybe we will have a S5 competitior.

 

[bimmerdreng]

I must say that the 335i is the best good looking car of thoose. I dont like the A5 not even the interior, but the 3s interior is not nice to. They should make the interior like the 6 series.

 

[RICHBOY]

I'm willing to bet between the A/S5 and the new C-Class 3-Series sales won't be to the level of previous years. I'm sensing a rough time for BMW in this segment. I know of five 3-Series owners who will be trading in their cars for either a S5 or a C-class, and 2 of them are hardcore Bimmer fans! I'm not saying that the C-Class or A/S5 are going to topple the 3-Series but sales will most certainly suffer!

 

[Deleted member 25]

that's normal, what's new here ?

 

[EnI]

I'm willing to bet between the A/S5 and the new C-Class 3-Series sales won't be to the level of previous years. I'm sensing a rough time for BMW in this segment. I know of five 3-Series owners who will be trading in their cars for either a S5 or a C-class, and 2 of them are hardcore Bimmer fans! I'm not saying that the C-Class or A/S5 are going to topple the 3-Series but sales will most certainly suffer!

Yeah, just like everybody predicted apocalyptic drop in 3er sales when new Lexus IS was introduce, or later when new Infiniti G was introduced.

I can predict some migration going on yet not is such massive numbers as somebody like to speculate.

3er is the benchmark in the segment - it can't be so easily defeated. Just like eg. MB S-class in its segment.

E90 3er is already best selling 3er ever! It entered in a 3rd year of its lifecycle, so some drop in production / sales is normal - especially just before the LCI.

 

[Zafiro]

! I'm not saying that the C-Class or A/S5 are going to topple the 3-Series but sales will most certainly suffer!

when a new car is introduced it often steal sales, at least temporary. So nothing unusual if it happens.

 

[RICHBOY]

Yeah, just like everybody predicted apocalyptic drop in 3er sales when new Lexus IS was introduce, or later when new Infiniti G was introduced.

I can predict some migration going on yet not is such massive numbers as somebody like to speculate.

3er is the benchmark in the segment - it can't be so easily defeated. Just like eg. MB S-class in its segment.

E90 3er is already best selling 3er ever! It entered in a 3rd year of its lifecycle, so some drop in production / sales is normal - especially just before the LCI.

I didn't expect the IS or the G35 to affect the 3-Series sales as others did. Maybe because I'm not overly impressed with them, but the new C-Class and A/S5 are to amazing vehicles inside and out imho. The previous C-Class looked to elegant to appeal to sports car enthusiast, but that's not the case now is it? Audi's S5 will certainly draw a signifigant amount of 3-Series drivers away from BMW and into Audi's. Of course you and I don't know how it's gonna play out, so etc.... I'm only speaking from what I know from the people in my circle.

 

[EnI]

I didn't expect the IS or the G35 to affect the 3-Series sales as others did. Maybe because I'm not overly impressed with them, but the new C-Class and A/S5 are to amazing vehicles inside and out imho. The previous C-Class looked to elegant to appeal to sports car enthusiast, but that's not the case now is it? Audi's S5 will certainly draw a signifigant amount of 3-Series drivers away from BMW and into Audi's. Of course you and I don't know how it's gonna play out, so etc.... I'm only speaking from what I know from the people in my circle.

Mind that top-end models like S5 are low-volume sellers, also wearing significantly higher price. I don't expect S5 will still too much sales from 335i coupe. While M3 will be in completely different league - performance & price wise.

Regarding 335i & C350 Sport: they do not represent majority of 3er / C-class sales. The majority of sales comes from entry models: 328i & C280. And here I do not expect many migration.

But ... of course there will be some migration. It would be abnormal if there were no migration at all. Yet I'm sure the numbers will be insignificant.

 

[RICHBOY]

Mind that top-end models like S5 are low-volume sellers, also wearing significantly higher price. I don't expect S5 will still too much sales from 335i coupe. While M3 will be in completely different league - performance & price wise.

Regarding 335i & C350 Sport: they do not represent majority of 3er / C-class sales. The majority of sales comes from entry models: 328i & C280. And here I do not expect many migration.

But ... of course there will be some migration. It would be abnormal if there were no migration at all. Yet I'm sure the numbers will be insignificant.

Only time will tell!

 

[RICHBOY]

S5 vs 335i test in Greece
Greek magazine 4wheels ( the biggest) this month compares these cars.S5 is the winner of the test.
Performance:S5 335i
0-60km/h 2,5 2,8 secs
0-100 5,3 (85,1m) 5,5 (89,7m)
0-160 12,2 12,6
0-400m 13,5/168 km/h 13,8/168 km/h
0-1000m 24,5/218 km/h 24,9/217 km/h
Brakes:120km/h-0
53,3m 55,4m

S5 dominates the 335i at high speeds as well as low!

 

[PanterroR]

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[Merc1]

I don't see how this is a surprise (the speed part) since the S5 is running a more powerful V8.

M