The iDrive: actually a Benz idea after all?

[Sunny]

Well, kudos to Merc for coming up with the idea and kudos to BMW for having the balls to put it in a production car. I frankly think, it would have probably been relegated to the dustbin, like many other ideas we see in concept cars if a major manufacturer didn't take the risk of first putting it in a production car.

 

[Merc1]

Wow.

Never thought I'd see the day when such a spin would be needed about who and what and Idrive.

Gee whiz. Now we don't care who had what first and who came up with what first, yet all we heard was the MB copied BMW. Find some hard facts from back in the day and look at the backtracking.

**********************Hilarious**********************************

Yes BMW gets the credit for being an innovator (usually MB's duty) by bringing idrive to the market first, but it was full of bugs and in the U.S. many BMW owners absolutely hated it. The 2002 7-Series was the most unreliable car BMW had produced in years because of hatred of and glitches with idrive when it came to filling out those ever important surveys.

Mercedes was likely still working on their system in 2002 when the 7-debuted, but when the 7 came out with all the problems Mercedes had the luxury of making last minute changes before the W221 hit the floor. No way around that either.

I just think it really shows who is who around here now that we see evidence that Mercedes was at the very least thinking about an idrive like controller, but now it doesn't matter. Any other time we're quick to point out what BMW has done first (sporty SUV, X5), but one debunked it didn't matter anyway.

Some of the main MB detractors over idrive haven't weighed in yet (and probably won't). Really telling.

If those damn F series concepts werent so ugly styling wise I would have looked at their interiors back then and remember this, but alas I didn't due to them being such a turn off stylistically.

We will never know who had the idea first, but that copying nonsense appears to be BS at this point, at the very least.

M

 

[CorpusCallosum]

Like said many times:

the idea & solution for central controller & central display was produced by Siemens VDO (their ergonomics department) quite a while ago! And they offered the solution to German car makers. And as you can see all of them have it now. Some implemented it earlier, some later.


Usually the electronic stuff is either:

a) open solution available to everyone
b) exclusive solution (eg. a partner (car maker) has a right to exclusively use the solution exclusively for a certain period of time).

Eg. Central Command system is an open solution, while some other systems (eg. MB's ABC) have been / were exclusive.

READ!!!! Neither BMW nor Mercedes Benz came up with the idea of command or iDrive. And with all honesty, ideas mean nothing until they are put to the test and BMW was the first release this kind of user control. A concept car is a concept car. A production car is a production car. There are huge difference between the two the most obvious been the scale at which they are produced. Mercedes pu a screen and a knob in one car. BMW put the screen, the rotary knob and built the software and put all of that into a production moel car!!!

I do however agree with Merc1. The copying story is now debunk. Lets move on from it. I'm sure the idea had been around for decades but the technology wasn't there to allow it!!! Either way, I'm just happy all three of the german brands don't have touch screens like the Japanese vehiles. I dislike touch screens very much!!!!

 

[PanterroR]

Marcus, i still don't care who was the 1st, never did and never will.

However, i do care about the new twin turbocharging technology, new xDrive, new trannys, DPC and such things... Not about who has the best nav screen, nicer knob and who's idea was that.

You can or you don't have to believe it, but i'm just being honest.

 

[Merc1]

Yes your comment was one of I had in mind when posting, but you aren't the worst offender here, they've yet to post anything here.

Oh and I do believe you.

M

 

[PanterroR]

I knew my comment was on your mind, that's why i've replied to you.

And i don't think you remember me praising BMW for being th 1st with iDrive. I was only and i always will, defend it when bunch of people bitch about it like it's some weird and hard technology that surpasses power and range of human understanding.

If you know how to post a thread or a reply at GCF, then iDrive should be nothing for you, simple as that.

 

[YoUhimhER]

begun.... the fanboy war has.

sorry couldn't help it.

 

[Merc1]

I'm not so sure that it is that simple, but I don't own a BMW so I can't really say. When driving certain BMW's I never fooled with it enough to have any feelings about it one way or another. Note: Some people can't post a thread here if they aren't in the least net savvy or older and I speak from a U.S. point of view. This was a mighty complication for some so I don't think it is really accurate to think that everyone should be able to just get in a BMW and know how to work idrive just like that.

A lot of you here don't know this, but Buick of brands had a similarly irking system back in the 80's, but without the knob. It was the CRT. It was panned and hated just as much as idrive and thus GM withdrew the idea a few years later. All this system was an all in one touch screen, similar to what most non-German (and even some VWs) have today. The problem with the CRT is that much like idrive it wasn't quite ready for Joe Consumer which is the harshest testing regimen any new product can go through.

M

 

[PanterroR]

Youhimher, your post has been deleted, 'cause it's irrelevant to the topic and ruins the thread. If you want to discuss, sure, go on, but please spare us of such stuff. Thank you.

Marcus, of course i don't expect anyone to get in the car for the 1st time and know everything. I didn't know myself when i 1st sat in 5er back in 2002. It does take some time of course, but not years! And today, it's even simplier and more user friendly.

 

[Merc1]

True it shouldn't take years, but I really think that having to read thick manual(s) to learn how to opearate a car is too much. I say this about all the high-end machines from MB, BMW, Lexus and Audi. I couldn't believe all the books that one of these cars come with now (CL550).

Ok you delete a post because I could have sworn I saw Yoda.

M

 

[PanterroR]

Would you believe me that i've never opened it? And i got it with my old 530d and my current 535d.

No, i don't think i'm special, but i've never needed it to know how to use iDrive.

Few days i was getting used to it and never had any problems.

 

[PanterroR]

Ok you delete a post because I could have sworn I saw Yoda.

M

Yes i did and i won't allow it since you and me are having healthy discussion and i don't want this thread to go in toilette...

 

[Merc1]

I believe it. A lot of true car enthusiasts never read anything, they just get in and drive off, pushing buttons as needed. I won't read anything until forced by some circumstance.

M

 

[warot]

That picture only tells half the story. What kind of system did they have in the computer? I'm really curious if that was an even working component, or if it was just for show?

Also keep in mind that these are usually thought off my companies like Siemens and Bosch... I won't get into this argument of who came with what first.

 

[coolraoul]

I believe it. A lot of true car enthusiasts never read anything, they just get in and drive off, pushing buttons as needed. I won't read anything until forced by some circumstance.

M

Same for me.
And to tell the truth, I pushed the knob of the e65 (pre-FL) I testdrove, and it was not that terrific. Sure not always simple, sometimes illogic and a bit tricky, but not rubbish as some stated. I mean, even if it is not the easiest system, once you used it a bit you know how it works.

I would say that it was quite easy, except for some functions that you just CAN'T FIND. I was not able to store a radio, to shut the GPS off, and I finally found an horrible little black button on the dash to turn the radio off.

Other than these few things, it was pleasant to go through it (the car stopped of course).

I also tested the S and C-Class controller, and that was really easy and pleasant. Never tried the MMI or iDrive II.

 

[Wolfgang]

Came across some Mercedes F200 Imagination sketches from 1995, which previewed the CL-Class (C215).
Thought they may fit, as I saw some F200 Imagination discussion. Credit to NetCarShow.com

Anthony Lo 1995

Uwe Haller 25 August 1996

Christopher Rhoades December 1995

 

[LaArtist]

Oh nice bring back from the dead..

Ile just say this..

MB invented most of everything of significance in the car industry.. haha

errrbody knows that..

But hey its no shame in following..just as long as you do it with your own spin on it..and not like the Chinese

 

[HUTSUTAo]

I always thought BMW invented the iDrive concpet, and benz copied it for the W221.
But it is not true, in fact the first to feature a rotary knob to control all functions in the car was a Mercedes-Benz (two concept-cars in 1995 and 1996, the Vario Research Car and the F200).

I think BMW came with that idea only with the 1999 Z9...

Here are extracts from Benz press release and a pic I found in a forum...

The 1995 Mercedes-Benz Vario Research Car:

"Mercedes-Benz engineers had also incorporated a new-style operating and control system into the dashboard of the Vario Research Car which harnessed the wonders of the latest microelectronics to make life easier for the motorist. All key operating information appeared in the form of symbols and text messages on two colour displays integrated into the cockpit and into the top section of the centre console. Easily understood coloured symbols were used to display important information about maintaining the applicable speed limit or a safe distance from the vehicle in front."

1995 Mercedes-Benz Vario Research Car's interior shown below. Notice the knob in the center console, in front of the armrest, and the high screen...



Mercedes F200, 1996

"The remaining display segments within the fields of vision of both driver and co-driver can be programmed at will. The required information can be called up by means of a rotary control: interior climate, navigation, TV, video, video games, PC, on-board computer, radio, CD player, telephone and a "help" function. The interior temperature on the driver's and front passenger's sides, out-side temperature and time of day are permanently displayed. The central display segment shows the area immediately behind the car, filmed by the rear video camera, when the F 200 Imagination is reversing.

The controls for heating, electric windows, swing-out-and-up doors, automatic transmission, lights, hazard warning lights, seat heating and stereo unit are arranged on a panel in front of the display where it is within easy reach of both driver and front passenger. This high-quality stainless steel panel provides a visual link with the stainless steel trim of the bodywork. The switches for the electric seat adjustment with memory function and for footrest adjustment are located in the door trim. A bracket for the mobile phone is mounted to the front stowage compartment in the dashboard. Placing the phone into its bracket activates the hands-off system as well as a new speech recognition system which makes manual handling of the car phone largely superfluous."


From what I know the first BMW to show that feature was the 1999 Z9 Concept and the "Intuitive Interaction Concept", so seems it is not Mercedes who copied...BMW only ddevelopped it faster (in a hurry?), with the result we know in the e65 7er...

I did not knew that, and I'm wondering why Benz did not advertize it?

mercedes has and will always be the leader in innovation.

 

[Zafiro]

But still I-Drive get more praise in Media than Commando does. Being first isnt always the best.

 

[LaArtist]

^umm what?