LS Road Test: Lexus LS 600 hL Video

[Sayyaaf]

Guys what will happen if loading capacity exceeded?

 

[Mr. M]

Guys what will happen if loading capacity exceeded?

The car would droop down as the suspension can't take the weight. Very much like how a car would look like if it's lowered too much.

 

[cawimmer430]

I think four grown ups in a LS600h is to much. If maximum load is 200 kg then in order to carry four people the three persons except the driver must weight less than 66 kg and carry no luggage. Weak. Or, is this a womans car?

True. Four people might be pushing it when we factor in that the average human adult can weigh anything from 75-85 kg or more.

 

[cawimmer430]

This fact still astounds me. How can such an elaborate carmaker with needle-like precision in their work forget something as important as this? I don't see anyone else complaining except German magazines though. Now if this fact were made known to the world, then LS sales are in serious trouble if you ask me.

Very good question, James. I've asked myself that. I don't know. Here's what I can think off, and it might sound weird. I guess Lexus expects that the vast majority of buyers want this car for reasons of status: environmental consciousness or simple status.

"Wow, John Travolta has a Lexus LS600h! This guy cares sooo much about the environment!"

You know, that kind of crap.

200 kg is extremely pathetic for such a large car. When one exceeds the max. permissible weight a car is allowed to have, the results are disastrous. The handling worsens and the braking distance increases drastically. I've actually experienced critically overweight cars on the Autobahn on two occassions. One of them was in our E320 when we came back from an England roadtrip. The car was overloaded with luggage, food etc. You immediately notice the decrease in handling qualities, braking stoppage power and the suspension also feels overloaded. All in all, a safe car can feel unsafe simply because it is overloaded with extra weight.

When you look at the whole picture, the LS460 is hands-down the better deal. And if you're shopping in this class, fuel costs are the last things on your mind. Get an LS460. End of story.

 

[cawimmer430]

Are you absolutely sure the load capacity includes the passengers? Perhaps it means that the max load in the trunk is 200 kg? That would make more sense...

200 kg load capacity refers to the total load capacity. That's passengers and luggage capacity combined.

Example,

Parents: Tom and Mary (85 kg and 75 kg respectively = 160 kg)

Forget the kids and forget the luggage. 40 kg of max. permissible added weight left.

 

[cawimmer430]

Guys what will happen if loading capacity exceeded?

See my response to Mirage77.

 

[bmer]

200 kg load capacity refers to the total load capacity. That's passengers and luggage capacity combined.

Example,

Parents: Tom and Mary (85 kg and 75 kg respectively = 160 kg)

Forget the kids and forget the luggage. 40 kg of max. permissible added weight left.

But that sounds very hard to believe, a big luxury sedan that is registered to 4(?) but can only take four persons, 50 kg each. I don't think so...

 

[Mr. M]

Very good question, James. I've asked myself that. I don't know. Here's what I can think off, and it might sound weird. I guess Lexus expects that the vast majority of buyers want this car for reasons of status: environmental consciousness or simple status.

"Wow, John Travolta has a Lexus LS600h! This guy cares sooo much about the environment!"

You know, that kind of crap.

200 kg is extremely pathetic for such a large car. When one exceeds the max. permissible weight a car is allowed to have, the results are disastrous. The handling worsens and the braking distance increases drastically. I've actually experienced critically overweight cars on the Autobahn on two occassions. One of them was in our E320 when we came back from an England roadtrip. The car was overloaded with luggage, food etc. You immediately notice the decrease in handling qualities, braking stoppage power and the suspension also feels overloaded. All in all, a safe car can feel unsafe simply because it is overloaded with extra weight.

When you look at the whole picture, the LS460 is hands-down the better deal. And if you're shopping in this class, fuel costs are the last things on your mind. Get an LS460. End of story.

Environmental consciousness and simple status it may be Christian, but remember that the LS460 also has the same load capacity problem (as far as I can remember). You posted reviews of the LS460 having the same problems.

I trust your translation and your honesty Christian... But I find this load capacity thing to be BS. Like I mentioned before, maybe it's only a problem German magazines find with the LS. I haven't seen any other article besides German articles talking about load capacity.

 

[cawimmer430]

But that sounds very hard to believe, a big luxury sedan that is registered to 4(?) but can only take four persons, 50 kg each. I don't think so...

I can give you the number of Auto Motor und Sport and you can gladly call them.

I don't think Lexus was thinking properly here. The Hybrid GS450h partially suffers from the same problem. Reduced luggage compartment space and a considerably reduced load capacity (not sure how much though).

 

[cawimmer430]

Environmental consciousness and simple status it may be Christian, but remember that the LS460 also has the same load capacity problem (as far as I can remember). You posted reviews of the LS460 having the same problems.

The LS460 has a maximum load capacity of 400 kg, which is barely acceptable in this class when compared to its competitors. Even a heavier Mercedes-Benz S600 can still take onboard 480 kg of extra weight (more than a standard LS460 even!!!).

I guess the S450 also competes with the LS460, this car can take onboard 605 kg, same for the S550. The LS get's PWNED here.

I trust your translation and your honesty Christian... But I find this load capacity thing to be BS. Like I mentioned before, maybe it's only a problem German magazines find with the LS. I haven't seen any other article besides German articles talking about load capacity.

Travelling or going on vacation in your luxury car is not unheard of in Europe. In America, I can't picture a family taking their Lexus LS460 or LS600h on a vacational roadtrip. In Europe, going on vacation with your S320 CDI or S350 or A8 3.0 TDI etc. is not unheard off. Load capacity is therefore important as the car has to transport the occupants and the luggage, if any. This is the reason why German or European magazines like to examine cars from a practicality standpoint - and the LS600h is pretty impractical in that regard.

I've hardly seen American reviews complain about this problem. The focus always seems to be on performance, especially 0-60 and the 1/4 mile time. I suppose it has something to do with the culture.

And hey, Lexus makes mistakes too. This seems to be a big one.

 

[Merc1]

Acceleration is delivered smoothly and progressively, and the car really moves along from standstill when required. The engine note is quite satisfying under hard acceleration, and disappears otherwise. In everyday driving, the hybrid powertrain is all but (although not completely) transparent to the driver. The transmission has none of the drone of lesser CVTs, and seems perfectly suited to the car. Interior appointments are luxurious and plentiful. Numerous touches speak to the attention to detail that is built into the car: even the hangers in the rear seat area are gently damped as they extend to receive your jacket or coat.

Trunk space is compromised however by the presence of the batteries at the rear of the car. You can still fit a couple of sets of golf clubs, though.

All that being said, the overall presence and presentation of the Lexus LS 600hL still requires, if you will, an exclamation point.

While the LS 600hL is a technological triumph (I counted over 130 buttons and switches in the cockpit alone, to control all manner of features and amenities), and truly pushes the safety and power train envelopes, the je ne sais quoi factor is yet to fully resolve, at least for me. Crudely put, it just doesn't blow you away when you get into the car. Should it? I think so. It needs a bit more soul, a bit more identity. There's no doubt the design follows recent BMW directions, and while it is certainly one sleek automobile, it reminds one of the big 7 Series.

However... the cows. The leather used in the interior of the LS 600hL is sourced from a German company that raises cattle in fields that are enclosed by wooden fences. Metal fences, used by most other suppliers, will nick and score the animal's hide. Wooden fences ensure a hide without blemishes. And only that is good enough for the LS600hL.

Should you be in the market, the LS 600hL can be ordered now, but several have been pre-ordered, so don't delay. The 2008 Lexus LS 600hL officially goes on sale this summer.

CanadianDriver: First Drive - 2008 Lexus LS 600hL

M

 

[PanterroR]

A new flagship with seemingly more microchips than cc’s, the LS 600h L achieves V-12 performance with a V-8 hybrid powertrain.


By Thos L. Bryant
June 2007

The press information handed out to the journalists who came to Arizona to drive the Lexus LS 600h L billed it as “The Ultimate Lexus.” Frankly, I doubt it, because the history of Lexus since the introduction of the first LS in 1989 has shown that this company has no interest in standing pat. Onward and upward seems to be the Lexus mantra, but for right now the LS 600h L is certainly the star. As Bob Carter, Lexus Group V.P. and General Manager, stated, this car is “the truest expression of luxury and efficiency of any vehicle we have created. Equally important, the LS hybrid stands as the icon for the Lexus brand.” Carter went on to say that the 600h L's combination of all-wheel drive and the 8-speed automatic CVT transmission with the V-8 engine and electric motor “results in power and performance on par with modern 12-cylinder engines.”

Powerful words that neatly categorize a powerful car built to challenge the world's best in the large luxury sedan category: Audi, BMW and Mercedes-Benz. With a hybrid? You bet. The LS 600h L (in North America we get only the 4.8-in.-longer L version) is fitted with a 5.0-liter V-8 that puts out 389 bhp and 385 lb.-ft. of torque; then adds the electric motor of Lexus Hybrid Drive, which bumps total horsepower to 438 (compared to 450 for the Audi A8 L W-12, 438 for the BMW 760i and 510 for the Mercedes-Benz S600).

While the Lexus won't be quite as quick as the 12-cylinder German cars, it does perform briskly and will do 0-60 in 5.5 seconds according to the company. And it will provide EPA 2008 fuel economy figures of 20 mpg city, 22 mpg highway and 21 mpg overall.

Beyond the drivetrain, there is an abundance of technology built into the LS 600h L including the Advanced Pre-Collision System, which with a chime and flashing light alerts the driver of an obstacle ahead, retracts the seatbelts and prepares the brakes with increased force available for possible impact.

Then there is the Vehicle Dynamics Integrated Management (VDIM) system found on all new LS models, which includes Electric Power Steering, Vehicle Stability Control, Electronic Control Brakes, Anti-lock Brakes System and Electronic Brake-force Distribution. There is also an air-suspension system and Variable Gear Ratio Steering to enhance responsiveness. One can only wonder how many electronic impulses are running through this car when it's on the road.

The driving character of the LS 600h L is very much what you would expect: lots of accelerative power, more than ample passing ability, very smooth “shifts” within the CVT (artificially induced to give that feeling), remarkably low noise level, superb ride quality and very good handling characteristics for a large, 5050-lb. car that measures 202.8 in. long.

The bulk of our test driving was done at Toyota's proving ground outside of Phoenix where we were allowed to try a variety of driving conditions, from abrupt lane-change maneuvers to a 120-mph acceleration run, plus a twisty road course. The 600h L performed admirably in all of these conditions, and more important for me, I was allowed to drive one back into the city to our hotel, so I had a good dose of highway, suburban and city-streets driving.

This is a luxury car, first and foremost, but don't let that deter you from trying it out for hard running. The acceleration is remarkably smooth and linear, with abundant power just a throttle tip away. Conversations can take place without any raising of voices at 80 mph or more, and the suspension compliance is first-class. With a wheelbase of 121.7 in., the 600h L fits nicely between the BMW 7 Series (117.7) and the Mercedes-Benz S-Class (124.6 in.). Its one shortcoming compared to those cars is the size of its trunk, which gives up noticeable space to the battery pack.

After a day of driving the LS 600h L, I thought of the statement of Moritaka Yoshida, chief engineer of the car, earlier that morning: This car “is the product of a completely revised production system that merges state-of-the-art technology with the skills of highly experienced master craftsmen.” And the results speak for themselves.


Link: ROADandTRACK.com --- First Drives - 2008 Lexus LS 600h L (6/2007)

 

[Merc1]

They do contradict themselves by saying in the title that the LS600hL "achieves V-12 performance", but then say that it won't be as quick as the V12 cars. One thing is for sure, it won't ever match the current S600's performance, no matter who tests it and a 5.5 sec 0-60 time is a V8 performance, not V12.

M

 

[Mr. M]

This LS600h is all about being refined and quiet, a hush-mobile. Succeeds on that count but all that V12 power doesn't really translate to anything that's even remotely a competitor to the German V12s, except maybe in price.

The LS460 already offers what it does albeit maybe at a less refined way due to its 8-speed auto box instead of CVT. I wonder why Lexus didn't fit its LS600h with the 8-speeder, especially since its so lauded? The CVT is a killjoy IMO.

 

[Bruce]

They do contradict themselves by saying in the title that the LS600hL "achieves V-12 performance", but then say that it won't be as quick as the V12 cars. One thing is for sure, it won't ever match the current S600's performance, no matter who tests it and a 5.5 sec 0-60 time is a V8 performance, not V12.

M

I don't believe you can outright say that. As far as I recall there have been 12 cylinder vehicles which in the past have had performance figures around the 5+ second 0-60 mark.

Anyhow, I understand what you are getting at. The LS600h will never match the S600 (which is understandable) but what's even worse is that it appears to be having trouble breaking the 6 second barrier.

The Lexus marketing department should stop advertisting the LS600h as a bloody performance car - because it's not. Toyota's marketing department has always pissed me off, constantly contradicting themselves and whatnot. It's not a new issue either, they've been playing these "games" for 25+ years.

 

[bmer]

The LS460 already offers what it does albeit maybe at a less refined way due to its 8-speed auto box instead of CVT. I wonder why Lexus didn't fit its LS600h with the 8-speeder, especially since its so lauded?

I think that's because the electric motors can't be connected to regular automatic transmission..

 

[wltsm]

I personally think hybrids are a waste of time, this car still has a 21mpg figure, with is well awful. Sure, it's better than the other V12 cars, but still isn't great.

And considering this car will get a free entry to the London congestion zone, when tiny superminis which can get 70mpg will not, well I don't understand it.

I think people like hybrids because they think it's doing something for the environment, but infact it only words at low speeds, and the rest of the time, it's adding a load of weight to the car, and also the processes to manufacture the battery in the first place, aren't evironmentally friendly at all!

 

[Merc1]

I don't believe you can outright say that. As far as I recall there have been 12 cylinder vehicles which in the past have had performance figures around the 5+ second 0-60 mark.

Anyhow, I understand what you are getting at. The LS600h will never match the S600 (which is understandable) but what's even worse is that it appears to be having trouble breaking the 6 second barrier.

The Lexus marketing department should stop advertisting the LS600h as a bloody performance car - because it's not. Toyota's marketing department has always pissed me off, constantly contradicting themselves and whatnot. It's not a new issue either, they've been playing these "games" for 25+ years.

It applies, really. Most if not all the V8s in this segment can get to 60 mph in nearly the same time, while most of the V12s are faster, especially the S600. In the past maybe the LS600hL would have matched a V12, but not now.

M

 

[Bruce]

It applies, really. Most if not all the V8s in this segment can get to 60 mph in nearly the same time, while most of the V12s are faster, especially the S600. In the past maybe the LS600hL would have matched a V12, but not now.

M

You're point is understandable. Although my point being the 760i isn't exactly a blistering performer, nor is the A8 W12. As far as I'm aware neither of those surpass that 0-60 mph mark of 5.0 seconds (and neither really surpass they're base V8 models).

But I do think it's clear that in this arena of 12 cylinder executive saloons, the S600 stands alone.

 

[PanterroR]

It applies, really. Most if not all the V8s in this segment can get to 60 mph in nearly the same time, while most of the V12s are faster, especially the S600. In the past maybe the LS600hL would have matched a V12, but not now.

M

Not defending Lexus, but did you forget that the S600 is a V12 BiTurbo car? I don't have any better explanation fort it's amazing 0-60 time...