Phantom Phantom Roadtest

[Deleted member 25]

It's not enough to tell that Maybach have tree models, because in that case Rolls will have 2.

 

[Deleted member 182]

They said they wanted to sell 1000 vehicles a year, just like Rolls. They have 2 models to do so, recently 3 but now Rolls also kinda has 2 with the long version.
Still they fail with just a little more than 300, against 800 Rolls. How is that relative?

*sigh* That is so relative. Of course RR is doing better since they have 800/1000 and on the other hand Maybach has 300/1000. You can directly compare these figures. But if Maybach's ratio were 300/320, that would be a whole another story.

I didn't have no frekin' idea how much they are selling, what are RR's sales expectations or whatnot when I made my comment. The idea was to show how you can't say that RR is better than Maybach since they sell 2,6 times more cars. Are McDonald's burgers better than Wendy's since they sell more?

 

[audi_rudy]

sure you cant say it is better butat the moment the rolls is more of what the upper crust want as of a product right now.

 

[Deleted member 182]

sure you cant say it is better butat the moment the rolls is more of what the upper crust want as of a product right now.

You're right.

I did a little background surveillance on this and found this on the net: Why So Few Maybach Sales? Tough, I have to disagree with this article, that in my opinion, Maybach does not look like Lincoln Town Car and Bentley is not beatiful.

 

[Merc1]

I agree with that article to a degree. Hopefully the 57S will do much better. If not all may be lost with Maybach. It should have just been the Maybach by Mercedes anyway, not a seperate division. Then the tiny volumes would have been seen as a success.

M

 

[SDNR]

If we compare the sales figures of the old Phantom V and VI and the Mercedes 600 (W100) - we can see that these low volumes really should not be so surprising.

Rolls-Royce Phantom V (1959-1968) - they built 516 cars over it's 9 year production life.

Rolls-Royce Phantom VI (1968-1991) in 23 years only 374 cars were built.

Mercedes-Benz 600 (1963-1981) in 18 years 2677 were built.

When you look at these figures, the current Phantom and Maybach sales don't look so bad.

It must be noted that the Rolls-Royce Phantom VI was considerably more expensive than the current Phantom - and Rolls-Royce had several other models on offer - as did Mercedes of course - including the S class.

 

[sif]

Without having read the article, the only reason the Maybach is not selling is that it is perceived by a large group of the prospective owners as an S-class plus. The people who buy these cars do not want to look like regional managers (like they would in hoi-polloi S-class), they want to be seen in something much more exclusive - a Rolls is perfect as it resembles nothing else on the market, unlike the Maybach (especially from the front and rear).

The draw of the Maybach was the luxury (obviously) and the tech. The new s-class takes away the tech advantage and according to many people who have used both cras the rolls does the whole exclusive, luxury thing better (the power in reserve gauge is a perfect example - like the opposite of the HP counter in the Veyron).

Also brand awareness comes into it - Rolls needs no introduction, whereas you say Maybach to your average person and they wil probably reply with 'Huh?'. Thats not to say that I think the maybach is a bad car - in many respects it is brilliant, but MB slighly messed up the execution a little bit IMO.

 

[SDNR]

I personally don't think the Maybach brand has an image problem - most potential Maybach buyers couldn't care less if the "great unwashed" masses don't know what a Maybach is - I doubt your average billionaire would buy a Maybach to impress the guys at the local KFC drive-thru - afterall a Maybach is still just a car - if people like this want to impress, they do it with a Bombardier jet or Lürssen mega-yacht

The real problem with the Maybach is that it just insn't very exciting - it's very impressive - it's interior is very comfortable but lacks a true sense of style - no problems with the quality - it's first class. I just hope the next generation Maybachs are more beautiful.

 

[Yaz]

It can’t get more 21st century luxury than the Maybach. It seem as though the Phantom is the way to show off these days while the Maybach chauffeurs businessmen and professionals from what I see on the streets of New York.
Now I don’t really hate the Phantom. I like the front, but I’ve never been a big fan of the back and the interior.

So give me the Maybach over the Phantom any day. At least it’s a true German car

Check out these videos. If this isn’t luxury to the fullest, I don’t know what is.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2855927358339192605&q=Maybach

http://us.video.aol.com/video.index...stID=&movieID=&player=real&partnerLaunchAtt=1

Jay Leno & the Maybach:
http://rds.yahoo.com/TID=V010_109/S...msn.ca/as/Autoshow2003/asx/JayMaybach_700.asx

First Maybach arrives in New York. Ugh - I'm still upset till this day I didn't get to see this. I wish I knew of this event, I would have gone to see it (If I knew what a Maybach was then ):
http://rds.yahoo.com/TID=V010_109/S...*-http://p-pohl.com/moving_images/maybach.mov (41MB)

This is a nice one:
http://www.zdf.de/ZDFmediathek/inhalt/18/0,4070,2243474-5,00.html

 

[warot]

It can’t get more 21st century luxury than the Maybach. It seem as though the Phantom is the way to show off these days while the Maybach chauffeurs businessmen and professionals from what I see on the streets of New York.
Now I don’t really hate the Phantom. I like the front, but I’ve never been a big fan of the back and the interior.

So give me the Maybach over the Phantom any day. At least it’s a true German car

Check out these videos. If this isn’t luxury to the fullest, I don’t know what is.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2855927358339192605&q=Maybach

http://us.video.aol.com/video.index...stID=&movieID=&player=real&partnerLaunchAtt=1

Jay Leno & the Maybach:
http://rds.yahoo.com/TID=V010_109/S...msn.ca/as/Autoshow2003/asx/JayMaybach_700.asx

First Maybach arrives in New York. Ugh - I'm still upset till this day I didn't get to see this. I wish I knew of this event, I would have gone to see it (If I knew what a Maybach was then ):
http://rds.yahoo.com/TID=V010_109/S...*-http://p-pohl.com/moving_images/maybach.mov (41MB)

This is a nice one:
http://www.zdf.de/ZDFmediathek/inhalt/18/0,4070,2243474-5,00.html

The Phantom is a way to show off? Isn't that what a car that costs hundreds of thousands of dollars do? Think about it... every car in that range is a car that you can tell is expensive. Yea you can tell that the Maybach is expensive, but honestly, I personally think it's pretty underwhelming when it's comes to a super-luxurious sedan

 

[SDNR]

I don't agree that everyone who buys these types of cars is just wanting to "show off" - of course that is the reason some people buy them - but most people who own really beautiful cars are car enthusiasts of one sort or another.

Often people who own such prestigious cars also have several other vehicles - during a normal weekday they might drive around in a small VW Golf or Mini - that is not uncommon - why would you go into central London or Paris in a Rolls-Royce Phantom (unless you had a chauffeur) - where the hell would you get a parking space?

 

[Yaz]

The Phantom is a way to show off? Isn't that what a car that costs hundreds of thousands of dollars do? Think about it... every car in that range is a car that you can tell is expensive. Yea you can tell that the Maybach is expensive, but honestly, I personally think it's pretty underwhelming when it's comes to a super-luxurious sedan

Somewhat true, but I was saying that I've never seen a Phantom (on the streets of New York) with businessmen riding in the backseat. Actually, I've seen a couple Phantoms driven by the owners (or people who look like the owners ) and I’ve seen younger people in Phantoms (and got a chance to talk to one owner once ), but not the case with the Maybach.

It's always the Maybach's that are on 5th and Park Avenues with people in business suits being driven around town (or it must be my luck )

As you know, the Phantom has more presence and gets more attention than the Maybach when it passes by. Not everyone will notice the Maybach 'cause it looks like another Mercedes in some people's eyes. The Phantom is what you pull up to a nightclub in over the weekend.

Just my observations

 

[SDNR]

Somewhat true, but I was saying that I've never seen a Phantom (on the streets of New York) with businessmen riding in the backseat....

.....The Phantom is what you pull up to a nightclub in over the weekend.

Just my observations

Well I would say your observations would be very much the case Yaz - although the Maybach was originally intended to be a "celebratory vehicle" like the Phantom, it is far more business-like. The Rolls-Royce just might have too much of a "playtime" image to be taken seriously as a "corporate taxi" - the Maybach fits that role so much more comfortably - the Phantom is more at home on the Champs Elysée than Wall Street.

 

[Merc1]

http://www.zdf.de/ZDFmediathek/inha...43474-5,00.html

This really was a nice video, regarding the interior details. Wish I knew what they were saying. I'm convinced that if the Maybach had a more distinctive look and maybe more name awareness it would easily outsell the Rolls. The Rolls interior while nice seems to be lacking in features compared to the Maybach.

M

 

[RikfromBelgium]

I'm wondering, what does the Maybach have that the Rolls doesn't. Not denying it, it's a genuine question.

 

[Top Secret]

I'm wondering, what does the Maybach have that the Rolls doesn't. Not denying it, it's a genuine question.

Reclining seats. At least in the 62.

 

[SDNR]

That video really just reinforces my whole attitude to both of these vehicles.

The Maybach is certainly impressive - but in spite of all of it's "features", the Rolls-Royce is so much more alluring.

I do agree with you Merc1 - if the Maybach was a bit better looking, it would sell better - but I personally would still rather have the Rolls-Royce. Somehow it just has more integrity - more aristocratic charm. Reclining seats and silver champagne flutes are just so far removed from what Rolls-Royce is all about.

The Maybach is very much designed for the nouveau-riche and although the nouveau-riche will also buy the Phantom, it still retains the traditional formality of the "Establishment"- and that is the big difference - the Maybach makes you feel like you're the richest man in the world, while the Phantom makes you feel like you're a king.

What I'm trying to express is that the Phantom uses emotion, aestheticism and connotation to seduce it's occupants while the Maybach uses massaging reclining seats, DVD screens, and electrochromatic glass.

The Maybach offers it's occupants probably the most comfortable way to travel on land by catering to nearly every physical requirement imaginable - the Rolls-Royce offers an "experience" that goes far beyond anything physical - it's about style, emotion, and the joy of motoring.

 

[Merc1]

I understand perfectly what you're saying Roberto. The RR is just more "special" if you will. I agree with that. That is the reason why Maybach has to load up on the features/toys/conviences because the design doesn't provoke the same feelings as the Roller does. Until Maybach really connects with their past (not sure how they can do that with a modern car design), they'll always be second fiddle to Henry Royce. Even the name "Rolls-Royce" just provokes great images of royalty and just the oldest-world aristocrat you can possibly think of. Maybach sounds like something big and impressive, but not magical.

M

 

[SDNR]

I understand perfectly what you're saying Roberto. The RR is just more "special" if you will. I agree with that. That is the reason why Maybach has to load up on the features/toys/conviences because the design doesn't provoke the same feelings as the Roller does. Until Maybach really connects with their past (not sure how they can do that with a modern car design), they'll always be second fiddle to Henry Royce. Even the name "Rolls-Royce" just provokes great images of royalty and just the oldest-world aristocrat you can possibly think of. Maybach sounds like something big and impressive, but not magical.

M

Exactly Merc1 - the Phantom appeals to to ones imagination - Perhaps artistic and creative people will be more drawn to it. The Maybach is a more academic, more intellectual choice - technically minded people with an appreciation for fine engineering and technical wizardry will most likely prefer the Maybach. The only thing is, buying a car in this price range tends to be a purchase ruled more by emotion than pure logic.......and with that in mind, is it any wonder the Phantom is selling better.

 

[martinbo]

Ah, yet again one of my favourite automotive debates - albeit one that I usually refrain from participating in - resurrected with undiminished enthusiasm.

You want my left field opinion? The Maybach fails in the character war with the Phantom because, simply, it's just too Teutonic. Whilst the Germans can do luxury with consumate ease, they simply fall flat when it comes to intangible concepts like opulence and ostentatiousness. Stuff, it seems, that got cast aside after WWII.

The RR might be German in its engineering but its image and character are infused with olde school aristocratic English excess and charm. It's the genuine, old money item: a car for royalty, nobility and 5th generation family empires. Herein the Phantom succeeds and the Maybach fails. The Maybach's luxury is indisputible but the execution thereof just isn't in good taste. It lacks decorum, period.