4 Series (G22) [Official] BMW i4 (G26)

[dalab]

There are few here.

Meanwhile, couldn't help but notice this "premium" fit and finish on the i4 -

??
Please, indicate what you mean (with a circle or something), the only thing I see there is a perfect fit of pieces in a very close and enlarged photo, or do we need a microscope to see what you say?

Yes, it is premium, from the MINI to the Rolls, going through the entire BMW line, that is what the brand is about, that is the brand, if you drive Ferraris and think that everything else is garbage, it is a very personal and erroneous consideration of see the world.

I don’t think this car will fare too badly here. It won’t sell in Model 3 numbers but I don’t think they’re expecting it to.

I think it will do very well and they will sell each one that they manufacture, with "sold out" status as it has been, people were waiting for an option and that is what is happening now the i4 is the offer that the demand expected, obviously they will not sell the same as the Tesla 3 at the beginning, but as soon as they can fill the orders, I don't see why not, is Tesla against..........

They may point to an estimate of EV sales, (and as always being cautious with the figure), but they are betting hard that this number has no ceiling:

Friday, January 21, 2022 at 10:15
The only German manufacturer:
BMW advertises at the Super Bowl

BMW schaltet Werbung beim Super Bowl

BMW kehrt zurück auf die größte Werbebühne der Welt. Erstmals seit 2015 schalten die Münchener als aktuell noch einziger deutscher Hersteller einen Werbespot beim Super Bowl. Über den Inhalt ist bisher nichts bekannt.

www.automobilwoche.de

 

[Cashmere]

Conclusion From CAR Magazine on i4 M50 vs Tesla Model 3 performance

“The BMW feels better built. Not a surprise. But this is a surprise: the Tesla's more fun than the BMW. It's not only preposterously fast in a straight line (in a way that pins you to the oddly shaped headrest) but the lack of bodyroll and the quick steering make it a laugh in corners. The i4 has better steering feel than the Model 3, keeping you more in touch with what's going on. But it's a shame the i4 doesn't seem keen on you being involved.For a BMW, it's a bit inert; safe and unspectacular.

Which one? Tough call; the i4 is lovely to drive on the road, and soothing to live with. It's an easier car to adapt to. The Tesla is a true disruptor. It's more divisive and its screen-is-all interface fixes some things that weren't broken. But the Model 3 is the bigger step forward for car-kind and the more desirable product overall.“

 

[SKY]

Hardly a surprising result. One car is designed from ground as an EV, the other is a retrofited ICE.

 

[Lupusmajor]

Indeed. Take a magnifying glass to any mass manufacturer, you see blemishes galore.


BMW competes with Kia!

No, jokes aside, besides the price tag, what is premium about the i4? Honest question, not being rhetorical. And I completely agree that BMW makes many "premium" vehicles. But I don't think this is one of them. It is a hack. A decent one at that. But not a well engineered vehicle at the sharp end of it's class

Indeed. Take a magnifying glass to any mass manufacturer, you see blemishes galore.


BMW competes with Kia!

No, jokes aside, besides the price tag, what is premium about the i4? Honest question, not being rhetorical. And I completely agree that BMW makes many "premium" vehicles. But I don't think this is one of them. It is a hack. A decent one at that. But not a well engineered vehicle at the sharp end of it's class.

Exactly. The same goes for all premium car manufacturers (BMW, PORSCHE, MERCEDES,...). In the electric age of motoring, premium brands will no longer be as important as they are now. They will lose some of their prestige.

I don't see the point in paying more money for a "premium" BEV, if I can buy a Hyundai, Kia, ... for less money. And they are also great BEV cars. And I think the difference between premium and non-premium manufacturers will narrow considerably in the future.

People will also start to look at cars differently. The car will no longer have the same meaning as it does today. So I think the “premium” assumption will fall away in the future.

 

[Matski]

One car is designed from ground as an EV, the other is a retrofited ICE.

Given how much is made of the benefits of dedicated platforms, I'd have expected it to be an utter bloodbath against the poster car for the BEV revolution... instead...

Tough call; the i4 is lovely to drive on the road, and soothing to live with. It's an easier car to adapt to.

I mean, I get it... the Model 3 picks up points for what it represents, as much as what it is... which I can very much relate to, but for all that is made about the need for BEV specific underpinnings, surely this should not be a "tough call".

 

[SKY]

Given how much is made of the benefits of dedicated platforms, I'd have expected it to be an utter bloodbath against the poster car for the BEV revolution... instead...

I mean, I get it... the Model 3 picks up points for what it represents, as much as what it is... which I can very much relate to, but for all that is made about the need for BEV specific underpinnings, surely this should not be a "tough call".

Well, taking into account the Model 3 is going to reach the 4 year old mark this year, I would say the disadvantages of placing a battery on an ICE car are clear.

Difficult to find an EV that is a great EV and is properly finished.

 

[Sunny]

Almost certainly.

In fairness though, despite the negative opinion that anything not built on a dedicated platform gets around these parts, road testers and journos seem to be giving it generally favourable scores. The Autocar review above covers the base Taycan, a car they've scored at 5/5, they scored the i4 eDrive 40 at 4.5/5... which kinda makes sense given the 40% uplift in price for the Porsche. A quick aggregate of scores for the i4 from a few pages of Google results equates to ~8.7/10... it's a perfectly valid choice for buyers that aren't unwavering, dyed in the wool brand loyalists, as well as those that are.

Autocar gave ipace a 4.5 too -

And not just Autocar, this is the list of all the comparisons and awards the ipace won -


Meant jack, given the abject failure the ipace is. Not saying i4 will suffer the same fate, but I wouldn't take much solace in it either. IMO - outside the hard data some of them have, they are next to useless to indicate success in the market.

...between iX, i4 and Mini Electric... maybe 20/60/20 mix (?), so perhaps 20,000 units for i4?

While the sample size is small, what little data is there so far seem to indicate iX will outsell i4 - BMW sold 6x as many iX in Germany as i4 in the last quarter they have both been on sale (~1200 vs ~200). In Norway, iX seems to handsomely outsell the i4 - in Dec BMW sold ~700 iX. I don't know how many i4 they sold, but it is a number < 180 -


So I wouldn't be surprised if iX is the bigger seller for BMW than i4.

I'd have expected it to be an utter bloodbath against the poster car for the BEV revolution... instead...

I think the bloodbath will be in sales.

 

[Sunny]

Exactly. The same goes for all premium car manufacturers (BMW, PORSCHE, MERCEDES,...). In the electric age of motoring, premium brands will no longer be as important as they are now. They will lose some of their prestige.

I don't see the point in paying more money for a "premium" BEV, if I can buy a Hyundai, Kia, ... for less money. And they are also great BEV cars. And I think the difference between premium and non-premium manufacturers will narrow considerably in the future.

People will also start to look at cars differently. The car will no longer have the same meaning as it does today. So I think the “premium” assumption will fall away in the future.

Indeed. We take these these brands for premium as a given. But it was built over time mostly on engineering excellence (and some marketing fluff). Minus that excellence, you can bet the "premiumness" will wane off.

 

[Matski]

Well, taking into account the Model 3 is going to reach the 4 year old mark this year, I would say the disadvantages of placing a battery on an ICE car are clear.

Taking into account how much we hear, and have heard about how great Tesla's battery tech, construction techniques, motors, and software is... and given CLAR+ utilises a 7 year old platform as a base... I'm surprised the disadvantages have fitting a battery to an ICE car don't provide a wider gulf in the general competencies of the cars in question... and I'm not saying there aren't disadvantages.

Meant jack, given the abject failure the ipace is. Not saying i4 will suffer the same fate, but I wouldn't take much solace in it either. IMO - outside the hard data some of them have, they are next to useless to indicate success in the market.

I don't take that much solace in car reviews, that's why I don't post them as frequently as some do, if ever. iPace seems to demonstrate that the notion a good car built on a dedicated platform is a must to produce a good EV, is unfounded... which is really what I'm pushing back against here.

So I wouldn't be surprised if iX is the bigger seller for BMW than i4.

Could be, I've assumed the lower entry price for the i4 would help it beat the iX... but that may well not be the case, in the US market at least.

I think the bloodbath will be in sales.

Most likely. I'm sure the numbers will be posted by those that find solace in good sales figures... all hail the Fiat Egea, Panda, Cronos and Strada, the Peugeot 208, the VW Golf, the Toyota Avanza and Yaris, the Vauxhall Corsa, the Lada Vesta, the Seat Arona, the Ford F-Series, the Suzuki Vitara, and the Nissan Sylphy... for truly, these are the greatest cars of our time.

 

[Sunny]

I'm surprised the disadvantages have fitting a battery to an ICE car don't provide a wider gulf in the general competencies of the cars in question...

But there is a big gulf. Model 3 is 35+% more efficient, has 20+ % more range and takes 35% less time to charge than i4. Just cause you chose to ignore those big disadvantages, doesn't mean it is not there.

Most likely. I'm sure the numbers will be posted by those that find solace in good sales figures... all hail the Fiat Egea, Panda, Cronos and Strada, the Peugeot 208, the VW Golf, the Toyota Avanza and Yaris, the Vauxhall Corsa, the Lada Vesta, the Seat Arona, the Ford F-Series, the Suzuki Vitara, and the Nissan Sylphy... for truly, these are the greatest cars of our time.

Wow, that is one dumb strawman. No one is comparing a F-series or yaris or a panda to an i4 here. Model 3 and i4 are similar enough that there is a broad overlap in the market they appeal to. If one still ends up selling a fraction of the other, it is a fail.

 

[klier]

So much fun to read all this.

Continue please, lads. BMW fans and MB fans have become vocal haters of their respective brands....... a sign of the future perhaps (which I don't believe) .

But there is a big gulf. Model 3 is 35+% more efficient, has 20+ % more range and takes 35% less time to charge than i4. Just cause you chose to ignore those big disadvantages, doesn't mean it is not there.

But the i4 has 35+ % more driving fun, 20+ % more equipment and 35+ % better quality materials So it might even out in the end
And sales cannot be compared one on one, imho. The i4 competes with like a dozen other BMWs too, and also competes with ICE options, where the Model 3 is all alone in it's class.

 

[dalab]

The figures of the iX / i4 are correct, and they start in the case of the i4 more or less at the end of November, but they are not yet a valid sample because the iX began to be manufactured earlier and has greater availability.

 

[Sunny]

But the i4 has 35+ % more driving fun, 20+ % more equipment and 35+ % better quality materials So it might even out in the end

You forgot to mention the amazing retro Yahoo map from 2000.

 

[Deleted member 57437]

Exactly. The same goes for all premium car manufacturers (BMW, PORSCHE, MERCEDES,...). In the electric age of motoring, premium brands will no longer be as important as they are now. They will lose some of their prestige.

I don't see the point in paying more money for a "premium" BEV, if I can buy a Hyundai, Kia, ... for less money. And they are also great BEV cars. And I think the difference between premium and non-premium manufacturers will narrow considerably in the future.

People will also start to look at cars differently. The car will no longer have the same meaning as it does today. So I think the “premium” assumption will fall away in the future.

Bingo.

Personally, I could only suggest an "in-seat" interior inspection of automobiles such as the KIA EV6, Hyundai IONIQ 5 or Polestar 2. While these are not inexpensive automobiles per se, a direct comparision featuring the usual M-B/BMW/Audi suspects leave these products appearing in a very favourable light. The perceived elevated panache of the "traditional premium brands" begins to erode quickly. This phenomenon will gain momentum when Chinese brands such as NIO, Lynk and Zeekr begin to infiltrate the EU and North American markets. And it pains me to admit it, but my "non-car" 6 year old KIA Sportage is, in terms of durability, assembly quality/ fittings and dependability, the most competent automobile that I've ever owned (having owned 7 Audis, 7 BMWs' and one M-B, among some other brands, over the years).
Of course, it's not for dash-strokers nor does it offer a particularly spirited driving experience (boring), but in the sum of its' attributes, one of my better automotive choices. And the newer models appear to have become all the more better.

 

[Mick Briesgau]

I must say, that as far as BEV is concerned, I‘m somehow more interested in BEV typical aspects like range, loading time and availability of manufacturer own loading facilities, than perceived or real premium aspects.
Looking at ICE, I can’t imagine myself buying non- European (German). Looking at BEV, I can imagine myself buying American or Korean, but can’t imagine myself buying much too expensive Germans. With perhaps one exemption, being Porsche.

 

[Deleted member 57437]

Looking at BEV, I can imagine myself buying American or Korean, but can’t imagine myself buying much too expensive Germans. With perhaps one exemption, being Porsche.

I catch your drift, Mick.

Should I ever get around to seriously looking for a replacement vehicle and actually find that elusive "super attractive" (for my needs) leasing offer, I reckon that I'd be quite inclined to give VAG (save Porsche, which is unfortunately absolutely unrealistic in my particular world), BMW and M-B a pass. Unless, of course, they would extend an absolutely irresistable offer. The Koreans, Teslas' Model Y (made in Grünheide or China), Polestar/Volvo or a Chinese brand such as NIO or Lynk could be very tempting.

 

[Mick Briesgau]

I catch your drift, Mick.

Should I ever get around to seriously looking for a replacement vehicle and actually find that elusive "super attractive" (for my needs) leasing offer, I reckon that I'd be quite inclined to give VAG (save Porsche, which is unfortunately absolutely unrealistic in my particular world), BMW and M-B a pass. Unless, of course, they would extend an absolutely irresistable offer. The Koreans, Teslas' Model Y (made in Grünheide or China), Polestar/Volvo or a Chinese brand such as NIO or Lynk could be very tempting.

Forgot about Volvo/Polestar. They seem to offer some quite attractive cars indeed, in near future.
You’re mentioning lease. If I ever go electric, I probably won’t buy, but lease as well. BMW i4 leases start at about € 600 in the Netherlands.

 

[SKY]

So much fun to read all this.

Continue please, lads. BMW fans and MB fans have become vocal haters of their respective brands....... a sign of the future perhaps (which I don't believe) .

Honestly, I see it the other way around, hard to attribute logic to those who still praise every single thing BMW and MB do these days, when both brands are far from its most interesting days.

MB is creating an entirely new EV range that sucks on every account (design, quality...), and its ICE line up is also featuring the worst interior fit & finish in a couple of decades, with the entire range looking laughably similar and several models looking quite dull.

BMW is still to launch a credible EV line up, is releasing weird looking cars at an increasing pace (4er, iX, XM, G70 7er) and even some of the aspects I use to like the most about the brand, its interior design, is becoming weird and generic.

Yet, you still read here some hardcore fans talking about sales figures (as if they owned a significant amount of shares or something), or simply refusing to critisize a single thing about the brand they seem to have tattooed on a cheeck of their a$$.

 

[SKY]

Forgot about Volvo/Polestar. They seem to offer some quite attractive cars indeed, in near future.
You’re mentioning lease. If I ever go electric, I probably won’t buy, but lease as well. BMW i4 leases start at about € 600 in the Netherlands.

Volvo/Polestar is one of few brand creating EVs that I look as my potential next car together with Porsche.

 

[Deleted member 57437]

Volvo/Polestar is one of few brand creating EVs that I look as my potential next car together with Porsche.

The Polestar 5 (production Precept) promises to be a very exciting automobile. And as far as Porsche is concerned, I can only exclaim...TAYCAN !! However, these are cars that occupy a very lofty segment. Porsche will not offer a product that would be financially viable for me **sob**. But Volvo/Polestar...it could actually happen (killer lease deal on a Polestar 2 or Volvo XC40e/C40 Recharge, for example). I'm still fawning over the Polestar 2 after having had the opportunity to look at it more closely a few weeks ago.