4 Series (G22) [Official] BMW i4 (G26)

[Steven21]

The i4 will probably also come with the latest and greatest infotainment package. What do you think of that ?
In my (old) cars the radio is always turned off. So I think I do not need the latest infotainment. But often it is not possible anymore to deselect it. In my eyes another opportunity for throwing away money...
Of course I have pads and computers, so I will not be lost without the cars navigation. And all children have nowadays their own equipment. But since Tesla is so successful, all manufacturers try to show their “entertainment” capabilities in cars. For me simply a waste of resources. (Doubling or even tripling the IT equipment that is around anyway. I have my “popular” apps - probably like everyone - and do not want to use another version in the car.)
Sounds a bit strange, but I would like this car, but if possible without infotainment and with a smaller motor (but same battery pack size).

 

[agem]

The best I managed to do, It's really hard to turn white color into darker colors.

Dark blue metallic ? Midnight blue ?

With some nicer wheels it would look quite decent I think.

 

[klier]

I am sure the brand cachet will carry over from ICE for a period of time. But if it is not backed up by superior products, it will dissipate rather quickly. I could give examples, but it would be beating a very dead horse now.

You can't give any examples because they don't exist. Or are you going to drag Kodak back into this?

 

[Sunny]

You can't give any examples because they don't exist. Or are you going to drag Kodak back into this?

Or the coach builders that tried to make cars, or Typewriter companies that tried to make PCs or Nokia or Blackberry that tried to make smartphones...

Do you really think people will continue buying stuff from someone even if it is crap or even mediocre cause of their past greatness? Will you? Even the current car industry - Jaguar, - will you buy one of the mediocre Jaguars cause they used to make great cars once?

 

[Kiany]

Or the coach builders that tried to make cars, or Typewriter companies that tried to make PCs or Nokia or Blackberry that tried to make smartphones...

Do you really think people will continue buying stuff from someone even if it is crap or even mediocre cause of their past greatness? Will you? Even the current car industry - Jaguar, - will you buy one of the mediocre Jaguars cause they used to make great cars once?

It's not the same. The electric car is inferior to ICE in terms of comfort of use This is not a habit, this is reality.

 

[Sunny]

It's not the same.

How is it not the same - most early versions of disruptive products were inferior in some ways to what existed before - early cars were inferior to horses. Early digital cameras were inferior to film ones...

The electric car is inferior to ICE in terms of comfort of use This is not a habit, this is reality.

Yes they currently have some limitations, people who those limitations don't apply to find them far more comfortable to use.

I frankly don't know what any of this has to do with the point I was making - companies can't sell crap based on past glory. if you think otherwise, good for you.

 

[PanterroR]

companies can't sell crap based on past glory

Was waiting to finally agreee with you on something outside BPHDFVEGEFEGEDGVVVVV/threads...

 

[JPATT93]

I understand coupe styling but I wish the rear quarter truck boot lid area was more elongated. Then I could say it has perfect proportions.

This is the problem I have with the current 4gc.

 

[Steven21]

You regard the electric motor as an ICEngine. But it's not. A 530 ps elmotor has the same efficiency or even a better one than a 200 ps elmotor. So cruising at 100 km requires the same or less energy with the more powerful motor, than the smaller one (but the recuperation is much, much better). Concidering the price: the production cost of the Tesla's 300 ps PMSRMotor has been reviewed to be 600 USD. Do you thing making it less powerful would make a change of the price of the car?

Sorry, why should I mix up ICE and electro ?
In tests the EQC and the e-tron SUVs (and in future tests certainly also the e tron GT ) have been found to be very inefficient electro cars. Why is this so ? Probably because they are very heavy and also because their motors are oversized. All the efficient electro cars have less weight and smaller motors, is this just by chance ? I think it is simply because of physics.
You may have a different opinion, but I get the impression physics is not your main business. This is not alone about the efficiency of an engine (which is a curve and not a single number, by the way) but about the whole car and how it is driven. If an efficient engine is mainly used at a bad point of the curve (far from the optimum that you quietly assume), then this also results in an inefficient car. This is true for all engines (ice or electro), they need to be used at the optimum settings, or they are in the end inefficient.
Regarding efficiency the price is completely unimportant (the battery costs much more anyway). And recuperation is just a way to minimize losses (at best it can recover 85% of the energy that has been “invested” (wasted) before.)

 

[CrunchSlaughtered]

Sorry, why should I mix up ICE and electro ?
In tests the EQC and the e-tron SUVs (and in future tests certainly also the e tron GT ) have been found to be very inefficient electro cars. Why is this so ? Probably because they are very heavy and also because their motors are oversized. All the efficient electro cars have less weight and smaller motors, is this just by chance ? I think it is simply because of physics.
You may have a different opinion, but I get the impression physics is not your main business. This is not alone about the efficiency of an engine (which is a curve and not a single number, by the way) but about the whole car and how it is driven. If an efficient engine is mainly used at a bad point of the curve (far from the optimum that you quietly assume), then this also results in an inefficient car. This is true for all engines (ice or electro), they need to be used at the optimum settings, or they are in the end inefficient.
Regarding efficiency the price is completely unimportant (the battery costs much more anyway). And recuperation is just a way to minimize losses (at best it can recover 85% of the energy that has been “invested” (wasted) before.)

Obviously thinking is not your business

 

[Steven21]

Obviously thinking is not your business

Obviously you just switched from thinking to insulting.
Is this clever ? Do you really think your reply is acceptable ? I find it on a very low level.
Try to look in the web for “efficiency curve of electric engines”. Maybe then you can learn a little about physics.

Admin, is this style acceptable ? Personal attack, or not ?

 

[CrunchSlaughtered]

Obviously you just switched from thinking to insulting.
Is this clever ? Do you really think your reply is acceptable ? I find it on a very low level.
Try to look in the web for “efficiency curve of electric engines”. Maybe then you can learn a little about physics.

Admin, is this style acceptable ? Personal attack, or not ?

Go and analyse this (you were the first one to insult)
From the official Porsche web site
Base RWD Taycan 408 ps EU weight 2205 kg battery 93,4 kWh (the optional one to be a fair comparison) Electricity consumption 28,7 kWh/100 km
Taycan Turbo 680 ps EU weight 2380 kg battery 93,4 kWh Electricity consumption 28,0 kWh/100 km

 

[klier]

I don't know who this lady is. Never seen this channel either. But it came on my stream and I watched it, and I have to say that every word coming out of her mouth is spot on. Quite amazing:

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Jaguar, - will you buy one of the mediocre Jaguars cause they used to make great cars once?

Jaguar isn't a proper example, as they don't pour billions and billions into R&D like BMW and MB. So my point stands, there are no examples in the car industry. You can't compare a car to a cheap disposable Nokia or camera. A car isn't a cheap electronic consumable, it's the sum of thousands and thousands of parts from many suppliers, all working in a harmonious way. For most people, a car is the most expensive thing they'll ever buy outside of a house.

 

[J.E]

I don't know who this lady is. Never seen this channel either. But it came on my stream and I watched it, and I have to say that every word coming out of her mouth is spot on. Quite amazing:

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She says the i4 is a sedan and she's wrong. The i4 is a hatchback. As for BMW... It's time to face the music for supporting "Ban the ICE". Don't worry @klier BMW has more money than God, they'll be fine.

 

[SCOTT27]

The i4 has a phased launch. With separate M launch.

 

[Deleted member 1071]

I don't know who this lady is. Never seen this channel either. But it came on my stream and I watched it, and I have to say that every word coming out of her mouth is spot on. Quite amazing:

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I've seen several of her videos. A very good presenter indeed. And yes-she's very much spot-on in this particular clip.

 

[klier]

She says the i4 is a sedan and she's wrong. The i4 is a hatchback.

Fair enough, but you have to admit she looks more uninformed than she really is. I was pleasantly surprised as it was objective, critical and quite factual.

 

[David Brent]

The i4 has a phased launch. With separate M launch.

"Phased"? I've seen glaciers progress at a quicker pace.

 

[Matski]

Fair enough, but you have to admit she looks more uninformed than she really is. I was pleasantly surprised as it was objective, critical and quite factual.

I've watched a few videos she's done for that channel, indeed, refreshingly objective.

 

[Sunny]

Jaguar isn't a proper example, as they don't pour billions and billions into R&D like BMW and MB.

Really, where are the billions BMW is spending on R&D in BEVs? Spending billions to buy battery cells off the shelves don't really count as R&D in my book. Neither is coming up with a jacked up ICE vehicle with a battery screwed on count as investment in EV.

But maybe I am just unaware and they really are spending billions in battery tech and electric drivetrain R&D... in which case, I am sure, the investment will bear fruit soon and BMW will come up with brilliant, competitive EVs and in that case my point does not really apply, which again for probably the 4th time is - a company is not going to survive long on past glory, unless current products are competitive. To elaborate more - if BMW does make competitive EVs, the point doesn't really apply to them. But if the hope is - "We are BMW, we can get away with mediocre products cause of our past glory", I think they are in for a rude awakening.

For most people, a car is the most expensive thing they'll ever buy outside of a house.

Even more reason, people will want the best and not just one with some past glory attached to it?