Hot! Mercedes-Benz, What's Next?

[klugscheisser87]

I literally can’t name any modern car brand that has this mediocre looking lineup.
Even Audi and Nissan are saving themselfs from that comparsion.

 

[Design FIRST]

Excuse my drifting off onto a somewhat geopolitical/geoeconomic tanget:

The POTUS' catagorical rejection of the hazards pertaining to CO2 emissions and global warming in general could quite possibly equate to the U.S. handing over the keys to Chinese automotive manufacturers. As China remains committed to confronting global warming, is home to some of the most innovative minds when it comes to automotive software/battery techology, is an attractive, highly efficient manufacturing base and is arguably a far,far more dependable trade partner than the U.S. has recently been, we may see German and other EU manufacturers being drawn even closer to China. And perhaps India.

M-B's present fanfare regarding new il6 and V8 ICEs may herald a party that is not only myopic and shortlived, but may come with the price of a massive hangover.

Just a thought.

 

[Swissbob]

I disagree the V8 i6 hype won’t be short lived.

The world domination of EVs is however doomed, eventually EVs are here to stay as are ICE, in that case I agree with akio toyoda.

I feel, that people start to vote and to choose parties and cars, who promise the freedom of choice.

Mercedes Benz and Porsche overestimated the EV hype, now they pay the price for it.

In countries without ridiculous taxes on ICE, the ICE will still own a big chunk of the cake.

 

[AbsoluteUnit]

Excuse my drifting off onto a somewhat geopolitical/geoeconomic tanget:

The POTUS' catagorical rejection of the hazards pertaining to CO2 emissions and global warming in general could quite possibly equate to the U.S. handing over the keys to Chinese automotive manufacturers. As China remains committed to confronting global warming, is home to some of the most innovative minds when it comes to automotive software/battery techology, is an attractive, highly efficient manufacturing base and is arguably a far,far more dependable trade partner than the U.S. has recently been, we may see German and other EU manufacturers being drawn even closer to China. And perhaps India.

M-B's present fanfare regarding new il6 and V8 ICEs may herald a party that is not only myopic and shortlived, but may come with the price of a massive hangover.

Just a thought.

A few months ago, everyone was complaining about Mercedes' myopic stance on being EV first and engine downsizing. So what is it?

It's so easy for us to sit here and talk mad shit about product planning with the benefit of hindsight. These kinds of decisions are made years in advance and are essentially bets.

On the one hand, making going all-in on EVs is bad, because they depreciate and don't sell well. On the other hand, going back to ICE is bad and myopic.

The currently stance for Mercedes is to bring back their I6 and V8s for products that it makes sense for them to exist in. Meanwhile they're also continuing developing and even bringing forward EV offerings. So in essence they're hedging their bets

This is more or less the same thing that BMW is doing, but here it's bad because why?

 

[klier]

I literally can’t name any modern car brand that has this mediocre looking lineup.
Even Audi and Nissan are saving themselfs from that comparsion.

Yea it's bafflingly bad.

Thank God we have the last 20 pages of people talking about powerful V8 and I6 engines......which will be non factors for the largest markets on the planet (EU and China). Black Series and Mythos and whatnot are just utterly meaningless in the grander scheme of things, and MB focusing on this only highlights how lost they are.

MB is thoroughly f#cked up, and this marketing campaign they've started only highlights their weak position.

M-B's present fanfare regarding new il6 and V8 ICEs may herald a party that is not only myopic and shortlived, but may come with the price of a massive hangover.

And we have a winner...

Ola is a 100% certified idiot.

 

[Swissbob]

Decisions were made 3 years in advance, that’s exactly how it’s done.

GW got the worst feedback on the EQS/EQE the company has ever seen, but was powerful enough to push them through all boundaries.

I guess that’s why he had to pay the price.

 

[klier]

A few months ago, everyone was complaining about Mercedes' myopic stance on being EV first and engine downsizing. So what is it?

Ola is a brain dead idiot, that's what it is. From the one extreme right onto the opposite extreme.

And then they question why the company is in such bad shape.

f#cking LOL

 

[Matski]

M-B's present fanfare regarding new il6 and V8 ICEs may herald a party that is not only myopic and shortlived, but may come with the price of a massive hangover.

Just a thought.

Whatever most people's opinions are on how the world around us operates, I'd suggest most of them actually don't care to take any personal responsibility in any buying decision - so long as they can buy what they want, they don't care. Human's have a tendency to have their heads up their arses like that.

 

[Swissbob]

A few months ago, everyone was complaining about Mercedes' myopic stance on being EV first and engine downsizing. So what is it?

It's so easy for us to sit here and talk mad shit about product planning with the benefit of hindsight. These kinds of decisions are made years in advance and are essentially bets.

On the one hand, making going all-in on EVs is bad, because they depreciate and don't sell well. On the other hand, going back to ICE is bad and myopic.

The currently stance for Mercedes is to bring back their I6 and V8s for products that it makes sense for them to exist in. Meanwhile they're also continuing developing and even bringing forward EV offerings. So in essence they're hedging their bets

This is more or less the same thing that BMW is doing, but here it's bad because why?

We have EV warriors and ICE warriors in this thread, one of them will be always unhappy.

I always liked the strategy of BMW and I like the new strategy of MB as well.

BTW Stellantis

Jetzt enthüllt: Stellantis entwickelt neuen Dieselmotor für Konzern-Pkw

Stellantis steht kurz vor der Einführung eines neuen Euro-7-Dieselmotors. Jetzt werden erste Eckdaten bekannt. Auch ein neuer Performance-Benziner für Abarth ist in der Planung.

www-auto--motor--und--sport-de.translate.goog

New 1.6L EU7 Diesel engine, and a new Petrol engine for the 500 Abarth.

 

[klier]

Decisions were made 3 years in advance, that’s exactly how it’s done.

So?
It's not even true, this whole Black Series story is a quick reaction to other baffling decisions (the 4 pot) to make the company look better for the 0.01% who are in the market for such a car.

It's all meaningless. What they need are proper good volume sellers.

 

[Matski]

GW got the worst feedback on the EQS/EQE the company has ever seen, but was powerful enough to push them through all boundaries.

That the EQS and EQE look shit is nothing to do with how pro-active Mercedes were about the impending law stopping them from selling combustion engines. G-Wag's job was to oversee the design of the cars, not to plan the product strategy.

 

[klier]

Whatever most people's opinions are on how the world around us operates, I'd suggest most of them actually don't care to take any personal responsibility in any buying decision - so long as they can buy what they want, they don't care. Human's have a tendency to have their heads up their arses like that.

What they want are 250k Euro specials.

What they can buy/lease are frugal PHEVs or BEVs with good quality and great design.....and MB has none of that.

 

[klier]

New 1.6L EU7 Diesel engine, and a new Petrol engine for the 500 Abarth.

Stellantis probably is just as high on Nitrous Oxide as MB is.
Developing a diesel engine for the < 10% who still buy a diesel engined car.....great business all around!

Mercedes (and Stellantis apparently) is the only one who thinks Diesel is still a thing. It's not. It's been killed by diesel gate and BEV/gasoline PHEV.

 

[Design FIRST]

A few months ago, everyone was complaining about Mercedes' myopic stance on being EV first and engine downsizing. So what is it?

Define "everyone".

On the other hand, going back to ICE is bad and myopic.

The suspicion that it may be myopic will be "bad" in the context of suspicion becoming reality.

The currently stance for Mercedes is to bring back their I6 and V8s for products that it makes sense for them to exist in.

We shall see whether significant expenditures in the development of new ICE powerplants "make sense". Here, the jury remains out. Consider ongoing developments in BEV/REEV technology that begin to seriously erode the attraction of ICEs. Not only in terms of charging, range, infrastructure and cost, but also in terms of ongoing innovation regarding audiotactility and sensory appeal. AMG.EA is an example. The Porsche Cayenne-e is reportedly another. And this will be an ongoing process that is going to attract more and more younger consumers.

Meanwhile they're also continuing developing and even bringing forward EV offerings. So in essence they're hedging their bets

Correct. But the promotion is IMHO flawed. It somehow oddly evokes the image of a work-horse merchant's mindset just prior to the mass proliferation of the automobile. "I'll pump the horses up with stimulants and steroids. That'll stop this automobile nonsense !". Not that M-B is the sole culprit as stating this would be unfair. The issue has become tribal and highly politicized. In the automotive media, in automotive discussion forums...

This is simply my opinion. And like an anus, everybody has one.

 

[Swissbob]

Stellantis probably is just as high on Nitrous Oxide as MB is.
Developing a diesel engine for the < 10% who still buy a diesel engined car.....great business all around!

Mercedes (and Stellantis apparently) is the only one who thinks Diesel is still a thing. It's not. It's been killed by diesel gate and BEV/gasoline PHEV.

BMW and Audi also develop new Diesel Engines.

The V6 TDI is back in the Q5 and A6.

Outside of Norway and the Netherlands, Diesel is still a thing.

Especially If you use HVO100 which is in Italy sometimes cheaper than diesel.

 

[Swissbob]

What they want are 250k Euro specials.

What they can buy/lease are frugal PHEVs or BEVs with good quality and great design.....and MB has none of that.

CLA? GLC?

 

[Design FIRST]

That the EQS and EQE look shit is nothing to do with how pro-active Mercedes were about the impending law stopping them from selling combustion engines. G-Wag's job was to oversee the design of the cars, not to plan the product strategy.

I would venture to state that the EQE and EQS sedans would have been far more commercially successful were their exterior designs not so...alienating. The statement that M-B as a corporation and Gorden Wagener as director of design attempted to make was poorly packaged.

 

[Design FIRST]

BMW and Audi also develop new Diesel Engines.

The V6 TDI is back in the Q5 and A6.

Outside of Norway and the Netherlands, Diesel is still a thing.

Especially If you use HVO100 which is in Italy sometimes cheaper than diesel.

Prior to Dieselgate, nearly every second new vehicle registered in Germany was diesel engine powered. In 2025, it was every eighth.

 

[Matski]

Developing a diesel engine for the < 10% who still buy a diesel engined car.....great business all around!

In fairness it might only be ~10% of the market, but for some brands it's still a much larger percentage of their sales as the people that do want diesel will go to the brands that sell them. 25% of VW & Skoda sales in Germany are diesel, 20% of Mercedes' German sales, 33% of Ford's, 38% of Citroen's (77% of DS's) and 60% of Fiat's in Germany. The trend here possibly being that people buying commercial vehicles still lean towards diesel.

 

[Design FIRST]

The trend here possibly being that people buying commercial vehicles still lean towards diesel.

True.