Rumors Future AMG Turbocharging Rumours

[Shift507]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

Well there are even rumours of the 2.0 litre turbo four pot being available in the still upcoming Camaro. As long as we don't end up seeing things as less than 200 horses from a huge V8 engine, I'm fine with it.

 

[Merc1]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

Family_Guy - this 5.0L AMG V8 is still some years off. Most likely it will come with the next generation E-Class, when it gets a facelift and when the next S-Class appears. The current 6.2L V8 will get direct-injection and other tricks before htey downsize and turbocharge it.

M

 

[Tarek]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

Backing the hp wars and then 700hp+ car that is hilarious!

 

[martinbo]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

A five-litre V8 (capable of those numbers) with two turbochargers will drink as much fuel as a 6.2 litre NA V8 at full throttle.

 

[LaArtist]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

^obviously they will work it out so it doesent..

 

[Imhotep Evil]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

A five-litre V8 (capable of those numbers) with two turbochargers will drink as much fuel as a 6.2 litre NA V8 at full throttle.

Improvement in electronics, lubricants, fuel-air mixture (just because it's a newer engine after all) means that it should be more effective when not used at full throttle.

And ofcourse not everyone cruising along on normal streets (with speed limitations) has the pace of <insert magazine former pro driver here> while testing the car on <insert track here>.

 

[martinbo]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

It's a known fact that, due to the very nature of a turbocharged induction, a turbocharged engine is less economical than an equivalent technology (i.e. same number of cams/valves, direct injection, displacement etc) naturally aspirated engine.

The last four cars I have owned have all been turbocharged and they all drank more juice than their equivalent naturally aspirated counterparts.

In fact, it's relevant to note that at full throttle loads at max boost pressure even a light pressure turbo is more thirsty than an equivalent NA engine at the same rpm. Such is the nature of forced induction. You want a bigger bang, then you stuff more air and more fuel into the combustion chamber.

Anyone here who's spent more than just a few minutes behind the wheel of even VW's TFSI (arguably the most frugal turbo'd engines out there) will know: driven on partial throttle loads fuel economy is commendable, push the loud pedal to the floor and fuel consumption rises alarmingly.

Want those 600+ horses? Then you must feed them. Fuel.

 

[bum-man]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

You want a bigger bang, then you stuff more air and more fuel into the combustion chamber.

Exactly!

 

[Zafiro]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

Latest comparison between RS6, E63 and M5. Rs6 had the best fuel consumption despite turbo, AWD and 580hp.

 

[bum-man]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

Of course, it has FSI and has about the same displacement as the M5. I'm sure if you're sedate with the go-pedal on the RS6 it will return better mileage.

 

[GTA45E]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

maitinbo raises very good points but I think we need to look at the bigger picture. What are the clean air and consumption advantages of a 570hp Bi-Turbo 5.0liter V8 compared to a 6.0liter Bi-turbo V8 with the same power over a 3-5 year period.

Smaller displacement engines might be better for the environment during the short ownership of a hi-performance vehicle.

 

[GTA45E]

Re: AMG's secret war chest

"Aren't Mercedes developing more and more powerful cars themselves?

They certainly are. What irks the AMG boys is the fact that Mercedes AG is also preparing a number of sophisticated turbocharged V8s with a displacement of 4.0, 4.6 and 5.5 litres - and power outputs of 355, 435 and 544bhp. The two companies appear to be on a collision course..."




If a 544bhp 5.5liter V8 is in the wings whats going to happen to V12 in the S600, it could break the 600hp mark!!. Either that or Mercedes will discontinue
making V12s and use this new 5.5liter V8 in the future S600. This would greatly cut emissions (and lower status.)

The S500 might get the 435bhp 4.6liter V8. With numbers like these, a 5.0liter
V8 from AMG would fit right in. I really hate to see them downsize displacements..

 

[Pagani]

Re: AMG's secret war chest

I am fearful what we are hearing signals the end of the V12 in Mercedes and AMG cars. Ungodly amounts of power and torque by any other cylinder count does not feel the same...

I could actually stand the omission of the V12 from the AMG lineup--their 700hp/885lb V8 seems way mental to complain for fewer cylinders. But an S600 with a V8 seems a travesty.

Regarding the 885 lbs torque rating of the "premium V8", I wonder how they have solved the issue that they do not currently have a trans that handles it. I wonder if the new 8 speed thhat has been thrown around is something such.

 

[martinbo]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

maitinbo raises very good points but I think we need to look at the bigger picture. What are the clean air and consumption advantages of a 570hp Bi-Turbo 5.0liter V8 compared to a 6.0liter Bi-turbo V8 with the same power over a 3-5 year period.

Smaller displacement engines might be better for the environment during the short ownership of a hi-performance vehicle.

It's not as cut and dried as that GTA...

One has to look at the overall technology employed within an engine coupled with the levels of tune. Mere displacement is just not a good enough indicator in isolation.

For example, a BMW 3.0 turbo six engine is more economical than a Subaru 2.5 litre 4 cylinder engine in the STI because of the latter's higher state of tune and less sophisticated induction technology.

A highly boosted 5.0 litre turbo could be well be less economical than a lightly boosted 6.0 litre turbo putting out the same power.

 

[martinbo]

Re: AMG's secret war chest

Can someone please merge this thread with this one below:

http://www.germancarforum.com/mercedes-benz-lounge/24065-report-5-0l-turbo-replace-current-amg-v8-v12.html

And re-title it "Future AMG Turbocharging Rumours"

Many thanks...

 

[PanterroR]

Done!

 

[martinbo]

Thanks Tyc, requisite appreciation has been dispensed.

 

[PanterroR]

Thanks Tyc, requisite appreciation has been dispensed.

Thanks you too, my friend.

 

[GTA45E]

Re: Report: 5.0L turbo to replace current AMG V8 & V12

It's not as cut and dried as that GTA...

One has to look at the overall technology employed within an engine coupled with the levels of tune. Mere displacement is just not a good enough indicator in isolation.

For example, a BMW 3.0 turbo six engine is more economical than a Subaru 2.5 litre 4 cylinder engine in the STI because of the latter's higher state of tune and less sophisticated induction technology.

A highly boosted 5.0 litre turbo could be well be less economical than a lightly boosted 6.0 litre turbo putting out the same power.

lOl martinbo... We already know the same basic technology will be implemented with the 5.0 as the 6.0 seeing it`s AMG we`re talking about in the devoloping stage (if it`s a newer engine it wont` be a 3-folds difference from the M156). Comparing this company to that company is rather useless in this discussion. The big question is why are thay downsizing and do thay have to. This could be a political move if you will.

 

[E280-24]

there's also an even meatier 700bhp/885lb ft version of this motor to replace the 612bhp V12. The ESP systems of Germany are going to be troubled with alarming frequency...

Sound wonderful

Now that the Audi RS6 got 580hp,what have AMG plan too do with the new E??AMG 600-650hp?