Do Maybach actually need a cheaper model?

[LaArtist]

A-class have been with us some years now..and it sells like hell.. and i dont see it stealing so much away from the brand as it might seemed when they made it...
these things are necessary its all about how the brand markets itself..
BMW had to get in the game to with the 1er and audi have A3 and even A2..
Big manufacturers need these cars.. they are low budget.. low cost.. and they can slap a star,couple of rings.. or a propeller on them ..and ask obscene prices for them.. and they still sell.. cause from a counsumer point of view.. its like wow a cheap MB when in fact it isnt really cheap you dont get alot for your cash
So imo well done..

 

[EnI]

A-class have been with us some years now..and it sells like hell.. and i dont see it stealing so much away from the brand as it might seemed when they made it...
these things are necessary its all about how the brand markets itself..
BMW had to get in the game to with the 1er and audi have A3 and even A2..
Big manufacturers need these cars.. they are low budget.. low cost.. and they can slap a star,couple of rings.. or a propeller on them ..and ask obscene prices for them.. and they still sell.. cause from a counsumer point of view.. its like wow a cheap MB when in fact it isnt really cheap you dont get alot for your cash
So imo well done..

I agree manufacturers need to expand the model lines. But they can do it BMW way: sticking to core brand values and selling a lot, or MB way: produce a car without core values that sells.

Now think: which brand will retain more of its value / respect in the long run? The one being consistent all the time, or the one that expanded beyond its core values and lost its identity.

It's doesn't matter the size of the car, or even the price. The core brand values matter.

Btw, what are MB or Maybach core brand values anyway?

BMW and Porsche are lucky in that respect. Both companies are owned majorly by one family. It's like having family business. You care a lot and believe in your products & brands. And stand for them. That brings dynamic and motivated corporate culture.
MB, Audi, Lexus don't have such a luck. There the corporate culture is more clinical.

 

[LaArtist]

The BMW way?? what way is that?? they freakin produce motorcycles..haha
Belive me when you have such a strong brand name as BMW or MB.. you know that BMW stand for sport.. and MB for class luxury and comfort..
It doesent change by diffrent products.. you just need to make your smallest modell the most sporty in the segment.. like BMW did with the 1er..
And in MB´s case A class most comfortable classy car in its segment.. so the core values are there.. but you need to look at it with diffrent glasses.. compare apples to apples..

PS
if you dont know MB or MM core values you need to brush up on your car history

 

[EnI]

The BMW way?? what way is that?? they freakin produce motorcycles..haha

And the MB do vans and trucks!
I'm sure they are "the most confortable in their segment".

PS
if you dont know MB or MM core values you need to brush up on your car history

It was a rethorical question. Because I see the core MB brand values neglected & diluted lately.

Btw, A-class classy? It's more trendy and fun than classy. CLS is more trendy and sporty than classy. That's the problem: classy&confortable&stylish and trendy&sporty&fun are on different poles. Then you are classy-trendy-confortable-stylish-sporty-fun: everything for everyone. Without a core value - the one that steps out; the one that is special to the brand. And the identity is gone ...

 

[LaArtist]

lol that motorcycle thing was a joke.. haha.. everything about BMW is dead serious isnt it.. haha this is fun

Hell yeah the A class is classy.. like i said step out of the general classy for all cars.. and look at cars in the A class segment.. its by far the classiest..
CLS is a very elegant and classy car you cant deny that..
So no the identity is not gone.. no matter how hard you try

 

[EnI]

lol that motorcycle thing was a joke.. haha.. everything about BMW is dead serious isnt it.. haha this is fun

Hell yeah the A class is classy.. like i said step out of the general classy for all cars.. and look at cars in the A class segment.. its by far the classiest..
CLS is a very elegant and classy car you cant deny that..
So no the identity is not gone.. no matter how hard you try

That with vans and trucks was a joke as well. I forgot to mention the buses anyway.

I didn't deny those cars weren't classy. But they are less classy than trendy lately. Even within segments. The classiness blends - it is still there, but other qualities are becoming stronger and stronger. Repositioning of MB? Could be ...

 

[SDNR]

Btw, what are MB or Maybach core brand values anyway?

Good question Tine - do they still have any?

you know that BMW stand for sport.. and MB for class luxury and comfort..

Well I don't entirely agree with that Artist. If "sport" is BMW's "core value" then they are not as successful as Porsche or Ferrari - and how does that explain the 7 series?

As for Mercedes "core values" being luxury and comfort - well that seems terribly superficial.

When did Mercedes become a "luxury car" as opposed to a "quality car"?

The core values of Mercedes-Benz were always innovation, technology, outstanding quality, and the relentless pursuit of perfection.

Prestige was never Mercedes-Benz's raison d'etre in the past - prestige was incidental - it went without saying

The traditional Mercedes owner was someone who appreciated technical excellence.

Today, it seems the preoccupation with branding and status-symbolism has eclipsed their traditional "core values" - even their technological prowess now serves the prestige "image" of the brand, rather than being the main focus of attention itself - moreover, technology has become a kind of status-symbol in it's own right.

In my opionion, DCX need to re-focus their attention on quality and technological superiority - Mercedes-Benz's reputation was built, not by marketing executives and consultants, but by engineers, designers, and visionaries - it seems the brand is being directed by people who place no real value on Mercedes-Benz's history or traditional "core values", other than as very effective marketing tools.

 

[EnI]

Roberto, I agree with you. But still classiness and prestige are the core values of today's MB. But as you said: they had come from an excellent product with core values in engineering. The clasiness and prestige came as a reward. Could be they CEOs became focused more on that secundary core values instead on primary ones.

I hope MB will find itself again. ASAP.

 

[Mr. M]

Haha Roberto - everything seems superficial to you nowadays.

 

[SDNR]

Haha Roberto - everything seems superficial to you nowadays.

LOL - you guys must think I'm some grumpy old bastard......I'm not really, I think I'm actually quite pleasant most of the time

 

[Merc1]

I have absolutely clueless why MB even revived the stand alone Maybach brand. I guess they paniced when VW got Bentley and BMW got RR.

Mercedes is still the second most luxurious brand in the world just after RR, despite all quality problems. They should have chased RR under Mercedes name.

Standard Mercedes vehicles are known under Mercedes - Benz brand, so Mercedes - Maybach would be logical as well. Current Maybach design would fit into that very well. And sold in Mercedes dealerships - not everyone, but only the more exclusive ones with separate MM room - the sales would be much better. Producing ultra luxury limos, and maybe coupes & cabrios.

Another brand would fit in Mercedes' bag: Mercedes - McLaren. Producing supercars - Ferrari & Lamborghini chasers.

But they rather went into van market with A, B & R-class. Not to mention smart - another "me too" flop.

I suspect is Mercedes hadn't dropped the ball on quality and starting losing money they would have went ahead with the Mclaren project. I too want a stand alone Maybach with seperate designs totally unrelated to MB as far as what you can see/touch or a "Mercedes Maybach" as just a super-deluxe, exclusive Mercedes that is truly exclusive by design (not because of slow sales).

Yeah if they're going to keep the A/B-Classes then there is no need for Smart. I think Smart can be saved, but they need a partner with know-how in cheap production at a profit. A Asian company would be a perfet partner IMO. I'd go with one of the up and coming Chinese or Koreans, they seem to have some know how, but without the sometimes arrogant Japanese companies.

M

 

[Merc1]

Good question Tine - do they still have any?

Well I don't entirely agree with that Artist. If "sport" is BMW's "core value" then they are not as successful as Porsche or Ferrari - and how does that explain the 7 series?

As for Mercedes "core values" being luxury and comfort - well that seems terribly superficial.

When did Mercedes become a "luxury car" as opposed to a "quality car"?

The core values of Mercedes-Benz were always innovation, technology, outstanding quality, and the relentless pursuit of perfection.

Prestige was never Mercedes-Benz's raison d'etre in the past - prestige was incidental - it went without saying

The traditional Mercedes owner was someone who appreciated technical excellence.

Today, it seems the preoccupation with branding and status-symbolism has eclipsed their traditional "core values" - even their technological prowess now serves the prestige "image" of the brand, rather than being the main focus of attention itself - moreover, technology has become a kind of status-symbol in it's own right.

In my opionion, DCX need to re-focus their attention on quality and technological superiority - Mercedes-Benz's reputation was built, not by marketing executives and consultants, but by engineers, designers, and visionaries - it seems the brand is being directed by people who place no real value on Mercedes-Benz's history or traditional "core values", other than as very effective marketing tools.

I grudginly agree with this, but one part really has no place in your post.

"...and the relentless pursuit of perfection..."

That is a LEXUS slogan!!!! You're forgiven, THIS TIME...lol!!!

M

 

[Merc1]

As touched on earlier by Robeto, Mercedes' "core values" were - quality, relibility, durability, safety, comfort, and technical innovation. All their status just came with being the best at these things for so many yeas. They also have a decent motorsports resume too.

I agree Mercedes has dropped the ball on some of these things, but they aren't likely to return to previous heights with so many different models in production. How could you make an A-Class technically superior to other cars in the segment while keeping the price in check? Same thing for the B-Class and most likely for the C-Class too. You see this today where only the S,CL, and SL provided any gee-whiz technology over the last few years - with some of it (SBC) being a mistake in the grand scheme of things. SBC braking could have worked and been a brilliant bullet on Mercedes resume if they were still taking the time to ensure that things were the the right quality, especially something like SBC which deals with brakes - something this isn't allowed to fail very often, if at all.

Get rid of Smart if you aren't serious about fixing it. Swallow the German pride and approach an Asian company that knows how to build a cheap car at a profit. The Smart concept is sound, but BMW's handling of Mini makes Mercedes look way past stoopid. BMW with Mini is branding 101.

Maybach needs to be added as a grand Mercedes or put on hold (facelifting the current car a few times) until a truly unique "Maybach" can be developed.

Drop either the A or B-Class next time around. One of them has to go.

The next A/B needs to be sportier, rwd and build in sedan/coupe/hatchback guise like the 1-Series.

Don't bring another half-ass developed "Techinical innovation" to the market until it passed the most rigoruous testing regime possible.

No more cheapo materials in any MB product - this they seem to have learned their lesson judging by the latest vehicles -S,CLS,SLK etc.

No more SLR type cars until the core models are healthy, make better than average profits and most importantly are of great quality/reliability. Because truthfully Maybach and the SLR were a distraction to take away from the failings of the core brand, and they are very expensives ones at that.

M

 

[SDNR]

I grudginly agree with this, but one part really has no place in your post.

"...and the relentless pursuit of perfection..."

That is a LEXUS slogan!!!! You're forgiven, THIS TIME...lol!!!

M

God, how the hell - isn't that funny - I swear that was completely by accident - LOL - quite subliminal really.

 

[SDNR]

As touched on earlier by Robeto, Mercedes' "core values" were - quality, relibility, durability, safety, comfort, and technical innovation. All their status just came with being the best at these things for so many yeas. They also have a decent motorsports resume too.

I agree Mercedes has dropped the ball on some of these things, but they aren't likely to return to previous heights with so many different models in production. How could you make an A-Class technically superior to other cars in the segment while keeping the price in check? Same thing for the B-Class and most likely for the C-Class too. You see this today where only the S,CL, and SL provided any gee-whiz technology over the last few years - with some of it (SBC) being a mistake in the grand scheme of things. SBC braking could have worked and been a brilliant bullet on Mercedes resume if they were still taking the time to ensure that things were the the right quality, especially something like SBC which deals with brakes - something this isn't allowed to fail very often, if at all.

Get rid of Smart if you aren't serious about fixing it. Swallow the German pride and approach an Asian company that knows how to build a cheap car at a profit. The Smart concept is sound, but BMW's handling of Mini makes Mercedes look way past stoopid. BMW with Mini is branding 101.

Maybach needs to be added as a grand Mercedes or put on hold (facelifting the current car a few times) until a truly unique "Maybach" can be developed.

Drop either the A or B-Class next time around. One of them has to go.

The next A/B needs to be sportier, rwd and build in sedan/coupe/hatchback guise like the 1-Series.

Don't bring another half-ass developed "Techinical innovation" to the market until it passed the most rigoruous testing regime possible.

No more cheapo materials in any MB product - this they seem to have learned their lesson judging by the latest vehicles -S,CLS,SLK etc.

No more SLR type cars until the core models are healthy, make better than average profits and most importantly are of great quality/reliability. Because truthfully Maybach and the SLR were a distraction to take away from the failings of the core brand, and they are very expensives ones at that.

M

Everything you have written in this post is excellent Marcus - really, why are you not on the DCX board - you'd sort them out.....and I hear it pays rather well too

 

[klier]

Everything you have written in this post is excellent Marcus - really, why are you not on the DCX board - you'd sort them out.....and I hear it pays rather well too

Everything but this:

No more cheapo materials in any MB product - this they seem to have learned their lesson judging by the latest vehicles -S,CLS,SLK etc.

Seriously, the CLS is FULL of cheapo stuff that looks good on camera but feels horrible in real life.
The W221 is a different story. That's more like it

 

[Merc1]

Everything you have written in this post is excellent Marcus - really, why are you not on the DCX board - you'd sort them out.....and I hear it pays rather well too

Thanks! I really think I could turn Mercedes around in about 2-3 years if given full control, but we know something like that would never, ever happen!

M

 

[Merc1]

Everything but this:

No more cheapo materials in any MB product - this they seem to have learned their lesson judging by the latest vehicles -S,CLS,SLK etc.

Seriously, the CLS is FULL of cheapo stuff that looks good on camera but feels horrible in real life.
The W221 is a different story. That's more like it

The CLS is full of cheapo stuff? That flies in the face of everything I've seen written about the car and my own experiences with the car.

M

 

[RikfromBelgium]

sorry, same here: uncle has a CLS350:
plastics aren't all that good (ex: the controlls under the seat for the massage function and stuff, really cheap stuff
glue-residue under the wood on the dash

 

[klier]

The CLS is full of cheapo stuff? That flies in the face of everything I've seen written about the car and my own experiences with the car.

M

Yeah, that is what I experienced so far. There is a huge gap between the quality of the CLS and S