Vs Audi A7 vs. BMW 5-series vs. MB E-Class design discussion

[donkeykong]

My bad lol, you're right. I should have remembered since I was staring and drooling at that cool "Supercharged" emblem on the sides.

I think that's why I liked the torquey power delivery so much. Nothing against Turbo's, but I find S/C's really fly off the line.

No sweat...I'm glad to hear the A7 is agile makes me reconsider wanting to buy the RS5,and getting an S7 instead. Both cars look great,it should come to no surprise I prefer the look of Audi's these days,but the edge is slight with these two. I think the E looks better in person than in pics wonder if the same can be said for the A7.

 

[K-A]

Same can definitely be said about the A7 IMO. The E really needs to be seen in person to "get the design and lines-play", and I'm sure the CLS will be the same way. The A7 is a bit different in that it looks the same in person in terms of the actual character and lines, but the whole profile, and rear portion, and size/proportions tie together better in person. Also, the interior is far better and more down-to-earth in person than it is in pics IMO.

Thanks for the comments guys. I was afraid that it would make my car look "dull", like the F10 owner said he thought it did his, and I think that the E definitely looks interesting next to the A7, even with a traditional 3-Box (which is what works mostly toward my tastes anyway).

As far as agility, it felt so good. But remember, I'm coming out of an E-Class, however, the 212 has a pretty agile chassis for a Benz Sedan, so the A7 feeling so tossable and "Go-Kart"-like to me, says a lot about it.

That low-weight/high-strength Aluminum Space Frame is something you can really feel while you're driving. The F10, for example, feels great, but you do feel a lot of engineering put in by BMW to try and make you "not feel" that hefty weight, that does in fact exist nonetheless.

 

[K-A]

It's funny, in that pic of me taking a picture of both cars door lines right next to each other from low, the A7 looks A LOT like the Bentley GT. The door lines, the wheels, and greenhouse all look like it from that particular angle IMO.

 

[Deleted member 1071]

I must compliment your sense of taste, K-A.

While I am not -generally speaking- a great fan of the W212s' styling, I will certainly say that your car is very tasteful. The white color, nice alloy rims-a very attractive example of what is possible in making a car with questionable design elements look very good.

Speaking of which-that A7 pictured is another very attractive example !

Thanks for sharing your A7 experience, K-A.

 

[K-A]

Thank you very much Jimmy! Regardless of whether we agree on every design, I respect your care and passion, and taste in car design.

 

[Deleted member 1071]

Seeing these two automobiles side-by-side enables one to see how certain design themes from the past have been quoted.

The M-B appears very teutonic in spirit. Rigid, save the sculpturing of the rear fender area which quotes the post WWII W120 180D-220SE "Ponton" sedans.

The Audi exudes a more than subtle "Mediterranean" appeal, mimicking various Italian GT cars of the late 1960s'/early 1970s'. The FIAT Dino coupes or the Maserati Indy immediately come to mind.

Actually, seeing the two cars together has me understanding and appreciating their designs even more.

 

[K-A]

Seeing these two automobiles side-by-side enables one to see how certain design themes from the past have been quoted.

The M-B appears very teutonic in spirit. Rigid, save the sculpturing of the rear fender area which quotes the post WWII W120 180D-220SE "Ponton" sedans.

The Audi exudes a more than subtle "Mediterranean" appeal, mimicking various Italian GT cars of the late 1960s'/early 1970s'. The FIAT Dino coupes or the Maserati Indy immediately come to mind.

Actually, seeing the two cars together has me understanding and appreciating their designs even more.

VERY much agreed. This is why I love side-by-sides.

The Benz celebrates Mercedes-Sedans, and the Audi brings this Italian flair into the picture. Actually, just reminiscing moments ago about the A7, I without notice even, put it in this Italian light.

I loved getting back in my Benz, because I felt the "BENZ" in it, the rigidity, the uprightness, yet the slickness, and that doesn't diminish the glorious interior of the Audi at all (again, felt like an Exotic in some senses, Lamborghini's blood line is in there somewhere), and it made me appreciate that the current crop of Benz/Audi/BMW are really molding these modern day cars to at least celebrate their pasts in tasteful ways. Audi less so, as they're still finding and building their heritage.

I wish I had all these cars in my own garage.

BTW, the A7 as it sat was going for $74K MSRP, and it seemed about fully loaded, although I think I heard fully fully loaded it should hit around $80K?

Not a bad price for what I'm assume is intended to be a relatively low-volume form>function Sedan? However, if you're going for the numbers/stat game, the motor will be drastically underpowered compared to offerings from competitors. Not that HP is a big deal breaker or maker for me anyway.

 

[K-A]

Oh, and the interior smelled nice and rich, like a typical Audi smell, but with a higher concentration of Leather over plastic, if I remember correctly. I can't say it enough, but the Audi has traces of Lamborghini circa 1970's-ish in its design and character, and some current corporate Lambo bloodline, along with a little bit of Bentley GT in some rare angles.

Also, notice how tightly the wheels fit in the wheel well, barely any gap. The E-Class is also great in this regard. BMW's F10 can take a note, as it has a HUGE gap in the wells, and the wheels look like chicken legs trying to carry a large chariot. I don't like when cars need 20's to look proper, as getting above 18"'ers starts to deter ride very much. The E-Class IMO does very well with balancing a design to look appropriate with 18" wheels.

 

[coolraoul]

I saw the A7 in person and it looks really good. Rear is less "sad" than in pics, and the proportions are very nice. Overall, a very attractive car, low and wide.

At the rear though, because of the rear spoiler, it's quite a shutline-jam.

Interior was quite disappointing though (shutlines sometimes a bit irregular, some materials looked a bit shiny). However, that comment is to be taken with a pinch of salt, as i could only see the interior through the window, not actually have a seat.

I also saw the CLS. Proportions are stunning, interior absolutely epic.

However, the meeting point of the sidelines (before the rear wheel-arch) looks a bit fussy, the light reflects here in a quite ungainly manner.

Besides this little detail, and the fact that the rear chrome-bar stops abruptly without even meeting the rear lights, it's a truly stunning car.

Concerning 5er vs E-Class... I think a basic 5er looks better than a basic E-Class (especially when the E has that slightly too high rear amplified by tiny wheels, and those horrid plastic double-fogs).
However, a nicely specced E will look better, more modern and interesting than a loaded 5er, especially the front of the 5er is rather weak and unintrusive. While the E's weakpoint is more the rear, but it has grown on me.

Concerning the interior, the 5er is plusher, a bit more upscale, but the dash is too high and massive. While the E's double screencap doesn't necessarily look good, but allows a more airy interior. i'd give the edge to the 5er here though.

 

[K-A]

I agree that the A7's rear shutline mess is just something that really hurts an otherwise nice car.

I also agree that the CLS's side lines are the weak link of that car, along with the rear chrome strip, although I have yet to see it in person.

I think both the basic 5'er and basic E look like they're missing something, but I think that the Elegance/Avantgarde E is more interesting to look at to me than the basic 5'er, as the E has some subtle touches that the Sport doesn't have, such as chrome running around the bumpers, and a more classic 4-slat "Luxury" grille, as opposed to the Sport-Luxury 3-slat grille. With the M-Pack and AMG Pack both come more alive, but I'm not a big fan of the over-angular, Darth Vader helmet look of the F10's front bumper so much.

I agree with the 5'ers interior having a plusher and more soothing materials and design than the E, but the E has a more airy/comforting/logical/secure environment and ambiance to me. I can't really say who's I like more. I will say, I get more of a satisfaction when feeling around the 5's interior, and I get more of a satisfaction from "living"/driving in the E.

 

[Human]

These pics were posted by a Member of a BMW Forum (who was upset in that he thought his car appeared a little "bland" next to the A7):

That A7's but is but ugly!

 

[Zafiro]

A7 looks a lot better in person, although easily mistaken for a A5 sportback.

A basic E-class looks kinda goofy specially with 17" wheels.
- I don't like the rear, I think its the rearlights, they look to simple.
- 3/4 view from the rear, wheel arches, no no
- Profile, its something with the profile that doesnt look harmonious.
- I like the front, looks hungry (but didnt lexus look like this a few years back )
- AMG package is needed for the E-class.
- Interior is nice, no complaints from me.


A basic 5-series.
- The rear is better executed than E-class. Looks beefy and muscular.
- Profile, more stylish.
- Front, not as intresting as E-class and not as hungry but still looks elegant.
- Unlike E-class a basic 5er looks better than with M-package.
- I like the interior, more modern and fresh than the interior in E-class but
its a tie.

While I think E-class looks more intresting, it doesnt mean its better looking car than a 5-series. 5er E60 is also a more intresting car to look at than the F10 but does it look better?

Hopefully 5-series will be available with Full-LED lights, its going to make a huge impact on the car.

 

[braaf]

and having a less advanced overall construction (Audi's aluminum space frame is pretty incredible)

KA forgive me but I'm intrigued by your comment. Is it your opinion or did I miss something.

Cos as far as I know the 5er shell is quite a good one. If it wasn't for it's weight gain over e60 (bearing in mind the entire front of the e60 was aluminium) then it would have been rather special.

 

[HighestOfHigh]

To me the rear of the car now looks much better than it did with the red tails. Also, that chrome bar looks more out of place with red tails, as there's too many contrasting colors. darkening the tails gives the car a 3-color theme: White, Black & Chrome. To me, the car as it sits now, has a rear end makes me feel very happy when I'm walking up to it.

I agree. Saw a white E-class with the darken rear lights just like your car and it did look nice.

As far as the A7, E and 5 are concern. The design on the 5 seems more "likeable" than the other two. Everything just seems to fit better. I do like the A7 after seeing it on the road, but it does have some odd factors that go against it in the rear. E-class...I just prefer to see the car more "round" then what it is. Bold design, but not the best design IMO..But it stands out the most amoung the three.

 

[coolraoul]

Just to clarify things, as far as I know, the A7 doesn't feature Audi's Aluminium Space Frame.

Only cars to have it are the A8 (all three geenerations) and the A2.

 

[klier]

A7 is really, really, REALLY ugly. And that pic next to the F10 makes it look even worse. Damn.

Also, in real life. HATE it.

To me the rear of the car now looks much better than it did with the red tails.

Obviously it's your car and you can do whatever you please, but I agree with Sunny big time. The smoked tail lights look cheap and aftermarket (which I am sure they are) and ruin an otherwise perfect car.

PLEASE change them back!!

 

[HighestOfHigh]

A7 is really, really, REALLY ugly. And that pic next to the F10 makes it look even worse. Damn.

Also, in real life. HATE it.

Lol..I actually think it looks pretty good in real life. Far better that the photos.

 

[klier]

An Audi is an Audi and they always look exactly the same in pics as the do in real life....I seriously don't get the people who are suddenly saying that the A7 looks better in real life than it does in pics. It doesn't; it looks as good (or bad) in real life as it does in pics, like all other Audis except the R8...... R8 looks much better in 3D.

 

[K-A]

KA forgive me but I'm intrigued by your comment. Is it your opinion or did I miss something.

Cos as far as I know the 5er shell is quite a good one. If it wasn't for it's weight gain over e60 (bearing in mind the entire front of the e60 was aluminium) then it would have been rather special.

The 5'ers shell is absolutely a good one, but I feel like Audi is of a more advanced construction. More lightweight, maybe more expensive (??), and the 5'er has this weird weak point in the roof, that shows up in Side Impact Tests where the top and windshield cave inward.... I'd assume the Audi's overall shell is more thorough.

I agree. Saw a white E-class with the darken rear lights just like your car and it did look nice.

As far as the A7, E and 5 are concern. The design on the 5 seems more "likeable" than the other two. Everything just seems to fit better. I do like the A7 after seeing it on the road, but it does have some odd factors that go against it in the rear. E-class...I just prefer to see the car more "round" then what it is. Bold design, but not the best design IMO..But it stands out the most amoung the three.

I know what you mean, and I agree. The E I've found is something that you either "get", or you "don't". It's a little polarizing, but at the same time, traditional enough to please the masses who don't hold such strong opinions about cars. I agree about the tails. Unfortunately I found that the E needed some *slight* favor in the rear to make it look perfect, so the tails and AMG Spoiler made it night and day to me. The front is the car is a masterpiece, best in the business IMO, so any mods just downgrade it to me.

Just to clarify things, as far as I know, the A7 doesn't feature Audi's Aluminium Space Frame.

Only cars to have it are the A8 (all three geenerations) and the A2.

Interesting. Just goes to show how much Salesman know. Lol.

Obviously it's your car and you can do whatever you please, but I agree with Sunny big time. The smoked tail lights look cheap and aftermarket (which I am sure they are) and ruin an otherwise perfect car.

PLEASE change them back!!

Lol. I'm very critical of people who do cheesy and "cheap looking" mods on their Premium Cars, so I respect your statements. They were just a necessity to please me for my own personal W212. My W211 had them too actually. They're really lighter and not as "cheap-solid black" looking as in pics.

 

[donkeykong]

A7 is really, really, REALLY ugly. And that pic next to the F10 makes it look even worse. Damn.

Also, in real life. HATE it.

HAHA! HOH,just cue in your catch phrase one more time.