Report AMG pondering RWD performance version of small FWD Benz
- Thread starter HighestOfHigh
- Start date
Wolfgang
Kraftwagen König
^ The more conventional twin-scroll turbo comes first. 
Secret new cars
Mercedes A25 - Merc's new 340bhp hot hatch
By Georg Kacher - CAR Magazine
Mercedes will launch its new A-Class in spring 2012 and CAR can reveal a new go-faster hot hatch A-Class in the pipeline to promote Daimler's radically different new small hatch. The go-faster Mercedes is called A25 by insiders. It's one of a trio of hot hatches being planned by Daimler, which will introduce full-bore AMG versions to Merc's smallest cars for the first time.
Mercedes A25: the hot hatch A-Class
Making a sporty A-Class is no laughing matter this time round. Unlike the tall - and occasionally toppling - A-Class of yore, the new one is a low-slung, more sporting hatchback aimed squarely at the VW Golf. These pictures of the Concept A-Class; give or take some of the wilder conceptual adornments, this is very close to what the new 2012 A-Class will look like.
Its new MFA front-wheel drive architecture is being tuned by the gentlemen of AMG. Until now, only an AMG bodykit has been fitted to the A-Class but Daimler is expanding the reach of its lucrative tuning division.
So how fast is the new Merc A25 AMG?
CAR understands the A25 will be powered by a brand-new 340 bhp 2.0-litre twin-scroll turbo four-cylinder. That's a remarkably high output for an A-Class sized car and will eclipse all other hot hatchbacks to date, such as the Focus RS and Golf R.
Keeping all that power in check is a seven-speed dual-clutch transmission and a standard 4Matic four-wheel drive system employing a Haldex VC unit to stop you frying the front tyres.
A trio of go-faster Merc hot hatches
At the bottom end of the AMG line-up we will soon find three different crackerjacks: A25, the CLC25 coupe and GLC25 baby SUV.
It's not yet clear when the A25 AMG will be launched, but we'd expect it some time after the launch of the regular A-Class.
The B25 AMG is being tested and evaluated, but it will not be signed off for production, sources say.
Mercedes A25 - Merc's new 340bhp hot hatch | Secret New Cars | Car Magazine Online
Secret new cars
Mercedes A25 - Merc's new 340bhp hot hatch
By Georg Kacher - CAR Magazine
Mercedes will launch its new A-Class in spring 2012 and CAR can reveal a new go-faster hot hatch A-Class in the pipeline to promote Daimler's radically different new small hatch. The go-faster Mercedes is called A25 by insiders. It's one of a trio of hot hatches being planned by Daimler, which will introduce full-bore AMG versions to Merc's smallest cars for the first time.
Mercedes A25: the hot hatch A-Class
Making a sporty A-Class is no laughing matter this time round. Unlike the tall - and occasionally toppling - A-Class of yore, the new one is a low-slung, more sporting hatchback aimed squarely at the VW Golf. These pictures of the Concept A-Class; give or take some of the wilder conceptual adornments, this is very close to what the new 2012 A-Class will look like.
Its new MFA front-wheel drive architecture is being tuned by the gentlemen of AMG. Until now, only an AMG bodykit has been fitted to the A-Class but Daimler is expanding the reach of its lucrative tuning division.
So how fast is the new Merc A25 AMG?
CAR understands the A25 will be powered by a brand-new 340 bhp 2.0-litre twin-scroll turbo four-cylinder. That's a remarkably high output for an A-Class sized car and will eclipse all other hot hatchbacks to date, such as the Focus RS and Golf R.
Keeping all that power in check is a seven-speed dual-clutch transmission and a standard 4Matic four-wheel drive system employing a Haldex VC unit to stop you frying the front tyres.
A trio of go-faster Merc hot hatches
At the bottom end of the AMG line-up we will soon find three different crackerjacks: A25, the CLC25 coupe and GLC25 baby SUV.
It's not yet clear when the A25 AMG will be launched, but we'd expect it some time after the launch of the regular A-Class.
The B25 AMG is being tested and evaluated, but it will not be signed off for production, sources say.
Mercedes A25 - Merc's new 340bhp hot hatch | Secret New Cars | Car Magazine Online
mini_cooper4
Autotechnik Ace
Everything sounds good but I doubt the execution will be good enough that it could compete with the 1M.
Wolfgang
Kraftwagen König
The new 7G DCT was released a few days ago. 
New Mercedes Compact Car Design Centered Around DCT
By Tony Lewin, managing editor DCTfacts.com
Mercedes-Benz provided a major stamp of approval for dual clutch transmissions with the launch of its new B-Class mid-sized hatchback at the Frankfurt auto show in September. The standard automatic transmission option for this model is an all-new seven-speed DCT, selected after exhaustive evaluation of many other transmission options. The outgoing B-Class used a push-belt CVT system supplied by Bosch-Van Doorne; the smaller A Class model range used exactly the same mechanical elements as the B-Class, so its replacement, due next year, will have exactly the same read-across of components.
In contrast to the specialized DCT-equipped SLS supercar at the top of the Mercedes-Benz range, the B- and A-Class models will be major sellers around the world. Their sales numbers are likely to help reinforce the rising global acceptance of DCT transmission systems.
Mercedes often boasts of a significant number of innovations when it launches a major new luxury car. Surprisingly, considering the compact dimensions of the new B-Class, Mercedes-Benz R&D director Dr. Thomas Weber is at pains to point out that “. . . no model change in the history of Mercedes-Benz has ever seen so many new developments introduced in one fell swoop."
Headlining the list of innovations – apart, of course, from the all-new architecture and styling – are new gasoline and diesel engines, new six-speed manual and seven-speed dual clutch automatic transmissions, new dual-pinion electromechanical power steering, new suspension systems and a host of electronic innovations headlined by radar-based collision prevention assistance, claimed to be the first in the compact class.
Gearbox Design
With the gasoline and diesel powerplants now sitting more upright in the engine bay (in contrast to the old model, where the motors were steeply reclined), the new gearboxes can now be more conventional in their layout. The six-speed manual and seven-speed DCT are closely related in their design, says Mercedes, both adopting a three-shaft layout for maximum compactness and sharing several components, as well as being made in the same production plant.
Just 345 mm in axial length, the manual has a dry weight of 46 kg and its six ratios span a range of 6.7; clutch action is hydraulic and the gear selectors are cable operated. An integrated magnet on the internal shift shaft is monitored by a Hall sensor to provide the neutral detection required to trigger the engine stop-start and, in the interests of reducing drag torque, the third, fourth and reverse gears on the top shaft do not run in the oil bath. Mercedes also says that this aids gear shifting at low temperatures.
As befits for the premiere of an all-new transmission type within the Mercedes compact car range, the company makes bold claims for the 7G-DCT in the B-Class. “This transmission is extremely compact, extremely variable with regard to adaptation of the engine speed thanks to seven gears,” says the announcement. It “. . . incorporates an electric oil pump for start/stop capability, shifts gear without any interruptions in tractive power and combines the comfort of an automatic with the efficiency of a manual transmission.”
DCT Facts.com -- New Mercedes Compact Car Design Centered Around DCT
Introductory dual clutch transmission info is here:
Mercedes-Benz International - 7G DCT Dual Clutch Transmission - Introduction
New Mercedes Compact Car Design Centered Around DCT
By Tony Lewin, managing editor DCTfacts.com
Mercedes-Benz provided a major stamp of approval for dual clutch transmissions with the launch of its new B-Class mid-sized hatchback at the Frankfurt auto show in September. The standard automatic transmission option for this model is an all-new seven-speed DCT, selected after exhaustive evaluation of many other transmission options. The outgoing B-Class used a push-belt CVT system supplied by Bosch-Van Doorne; the smaller A Class model range used exactly the same mechanical elements as the B-Class, so its replacement, due next year, will have exactly the same read-across of components.
In contrast to the specialized DCT-equipped SLS supercar at the top of the Mercedes-Benz range, the B- and A-Class models will be major sellers around the world. Their sales numbers are likely to help reinforce the rising global acceptance of DCT transmission systems.
Mercedes often boasts of a significant number of innovations when it launches a major new luxury car. Surprisingly, considering the compact dimensions of the new B-Class, Mercedes-Benz R&D director Dr. Thomas Weber is at pains to point out that “. . . no model change in the history of Mercedes-Benz has ever seen so many new developments introduced in one fell swoop."
Headlining the list of innovations – apart, of course, from the all-new architecture and styling – are new gasoline and diesel engines, new six-speed manual and seven-speed dual clutch automatic transmissions, new dual-pinion electromechanical power steering, new suspension systems and a host of electronic innovations headlined by radar-based collision prevention assistance, claimed to be the first in the compact class.
Gearbox Design
With the gasoline and diesel powerplants now sitting more upright in the engine bay (in contrast to the old model, where the motors were steeply reclined), the new gearboxes can now be more conventional in their layout. The six-speed manual and seven-speed DCT are closely related in their design, says Mercedes, both adopting a three-shaft layout for maximum compactness and sharing several components, as well as being made in the same production plant.
Just 345 mm in axial length, the manual has a dry weight of 46 kg and its six ratios span a range of 6.7; clutch action is hydraulic and the gear selectors are cable operated. An integrated magnet on the internal shift shaft is monitored by a Hall sensor to provide the neutral detection required to trigger the engine stop-start and, in the interests of reducing drag torque, the third, fourth and reverse gears on the top shaft do not run in the oil bath. Mercedes also says that this aids gear shifting at low temperatures.
As befits for the premiere of an all-new transmission type within the Mercedes compact car range, the company makes bold claims for the 7G-DCT in the B-Class. “This transmission is extremely compact, extremely variable with regard to adaptation of the engine speed thanks to seven gears,” says the announcement. It “. . . incorporates an electric oil pump for start/stop capability, shifts gear without any interruptions in tractive power and combines the comfort of an automatic with the efficiency of a manual transmission.”
DCT Facts.com -- New Mercedes Compact Car Design Centered Around DCT
Introductory dual clutch transmission info is here:
Mercedes-Benz International - 7G DCT Dual Clutch Transmission - Introduction
-=Hot|Ice=-
High-Rev Hero
That new DCT better make it's way into the next generation C63.
Wunderkind
Chicane Challenger
Probably not as the design of the DCT used in the A and B Class are front wheel drive specific and also cannot handle the torque output of a large capacity engine. Rear wheel driven models will require the DCT found in the SLS but not in the transaxle layout ( as it takes up valuable space that would otherwise be occupied by the fuel tank and the trunk. The angle of the inclination and the height of the rear seats might also be compromised).
The problem with DCT right now is size and weight and cost. I don't see Mercedes utilizing them until there is a discernible reduction in these three factors.
-=Hot|Ice=-
High-Rev Hero
The M3 makes use of a Getrag DCT. If BMW can do it in thenM3, I am sure MBZ can as well for the next gen C63.
Wunderkind
Chicane Challenger
I was only referring to your statement that the type of DCT ( as pictured in the opening post of this thread) to be used in the next A & B Class are not suitable to other rear wheel driven models.
The Getrag DCT is EXACTLY the same as the DCT used in the Mercedes-AMG SLS, minus the bits that are necessary for the transaxle layout.
Wunderkind
Chicane Challenger
Yes, I am certain the 3 door version will be produced. The concept shown last year was a 3 door hatchback.
SKY
Kraftwagen König
Yep, but I hope is a special version, not a 3dr version of the 5 dr.
-=Hot|Ice=-
High-Rev Hero
LaArtist
Wunderkind of Wheels
awd
Wolfgang
Kraftwagen König
AWD is still on for the AMG A-Class. Might be called A45 (instead of A25) AMG to commemorate AMG's 45th birthday in June. Power should be about 354 PS (260 kW).
http://www.worldcarfans.com/112042543786/mercedes-a25-amg-spied-with-minimal-camouflage
http://www.worldcarfans.com/112042543786/mercedes-a25-amg-spied-with-minimal-camouflage
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