7 Series (G11/G12) [Spy shots] BMW 7er (G11) Spy Pics & Info

[Carmaker1]

Some statements need to be addressed here ...

• The Quandts & their influence on design

I have no info of any kind the Quandts are involved in design process ... Since they are not.

But Dr. Reitzle was (BMW R&D ex-chief). Before he left BMW he tried to change the front & the rear (grille, headlights, tail lamps) of the E65 (mind the bloated trunk has to be as such due to aerodynamic reasons - due to high roof ... either that or longer tail or an external wing -which is not a great feature on a large luxury sedan, don't you think?). But Dr. Reitzle had left BMW before he could make changes, so the design stayed intact.
And if you look at F01 ... sure they made the proportions better (more R&D money & time was available - which was not the case in E65 case - due to Rover troubles) ... but the F01 still follows the large bulky & bloated appearance (due to larger cabin) of the E65 - and not eg. reintroducing the E38-like slimmer body.

Design ... mind the designer only put "a dress on a body" ... they DO NOT create proportions. The core dimensions are set BY ENGINEERS ... and the designers can only operate within those given parameters. Sure the designers push the engineers to provide best technical solutions that result in best possible design. Yet in E65 case there WERE NO ENOUGH TIME & RESOURCES to fine tune the body - since many human force (engineers) & money were spent on Rover cars (Rover 75, new RangeRover, new MINI etc).

Well I've not been entirely privy to what your relationship with BMW is, but I do consider you along with SCOTT27 to very knowledgeable about their future products, which is of great interest to me. I have to say though, I didn't pull that Quandt influence theory out of thin air like it seems to be said in your comment. I will only post information that appears to be valid, so if my sources were wrong I apologize for being misleading. In the meantime, I searched for where I found such commentary and remembered that it came from an AutoBild article from March 2000. I've found another link to it, which has also been quoted on an old website here.

Even when he was nearly fully blind Herbert Quandt insisted on an unwritten privilege: The design acceptance of new BMW models, if needed by pure feeling of the shape of the design. Also the heirs of the charismatic tycoon take lively personal part in the fate of BMW. When the new CEO, Joachim Milberg, lead the principal shareholders through the design studios shortly after his assumption of office at the end of February 1999, the group stopped in front of the successor of the 7-Series, which shall come onto market in summer 2001. The opinion of the delegation from ((the German town of)) Bad Homburg: A representative car, but not necessarily a perfect BMW. Above all the high front of the car and the squared rear let the flagship look bulky and fussy.
The critics fell on fertile ground. In the second half of the year 1999 the model with the project number E65 was revised in record time. The result: Front and rear now look elegant and sporty, the 7-Series presents itself optically again more like a driver's car than a chauffeured limousine.

There WAS NO slimmer E65 somewhere the sitting in the studio ...

I never stated that there was a slimmer E65 hiding in the studio, in fact quite the opposite. I referred to there being changes made by the second half of 1999 to the very model that went into production in the autumn of 2001.

 

[EnI]

The story is a BS, I'm very sorry ... The design studio is not open to shareholders, incl. the Quandts. Even more: the only board member that has access to the design studio itself is the R&D director.But there are the design clinics ... And I'm sure invited outsiders (incl. Quandts) have access to the hall where the design clinic process is going on. But the design clinics are more or less about details - and more about the features. Sure some revisions are still possible all until FEP ... But there are more likely induced by engineering & technical issues than by design criticism.

The critics fell on fertile ground. In the second half of the year 1999 the model with the project number E65 was revised in record time. The result: Front and rear now look elegant and sporty, the 7-Series presents itself optically again more like a driver's car than a chauffeured limousine.

Really? The pre-LCI E65 7er features elegant & sporty front & rear? LOL. One can hardly make bulkier design than the pre-LCI E65's design.

And they made it bulkier - due to technical issues: they had to raise the roof height since more space for airbags & other safety requirements was needed ... And with higher roof all the aerodynamics was destroyed - and revisions in the rear were made to provide enough drag: to save fine proportions tail could not get longer ... so the only way was to raise it: either with a wing or with more massive boot lid. And they opted for the latest. So in the end the car's look wasn't really ... cough ... pretty. Therefore Dr. Reitzle insisted in corrections - but he left too soon too enforce the changes.
And the late technical-enforced revisions was a consequence of bad R&D process -as said before: due to limited resources (human & financial) in the Rover-fiasco era. Due the same reason the iDrive system wasn't optimal & tested properly (and then fine tuned before production version) ... the electronic systems weren't optimized for production etc.

And the finaly version of pre-LCI E65 being a driver's car? Hardly. Comparatively pre-LCI E65 will go into BMW history as one of the worst driver's cars ever made by BMW - compared to other BMW products.

Btw, just check the initial E65 7er sketches by AvH ...

They clearly showcase you the revision process was the opposite of the one described in AutoBild: not from bulkier to sleeker BUT from sleek to bulkier!

 

[rollo]

Looks like they are including a retro pre-Bangle aspect to this redesign if these illustrations are accurate. Love it.

 

[Carmaker1]

The story is a BS, I'm very sorry ... The design studio is not open to shareholders, incl. the Quandts. Even more: the only board member that has access to the design studio itself is the R&D director.But there are the design clinics ... And I'm sure invited outsiders (incl. Quandts) have access to the hall where the design clinic process is going on. But the design clinics are more or less about details - and more about the features. Sure some revisions are still possible all until FEP ... But there are more likely induced by engineering & technical issues than by design criticism.







Really? The pre-LCI E65 7er features elegant & sporty front & rear? LOL. One can hardly make bulkier design than the pre-LCI E65's design.

And they made it bulkier - due to technical issues: they had to raise the roof height since more space for airbags & other safety requirements was needed ... And with higher roof all the aerodynamics was destroyed - and revisions in the rear were made to provide enough drag: to save fine proportions tail could not get longer ... so the only way was to raise it: either with a wing or with more massive boot lid. And they opted for the latest. So in the end the car's look wasn't really ... cough ... pretty. Therefore Dr. Reitzle insisted in corrections - but he left too soon too enforce the changes.
And the late technical-enforced revisions was a consequence of bad R&D process -as said before: due to limited resources (human & financial) in the Rover-fiasco era. Due the same reason the iDrive system wasn't optimal & tested properly (and then fine tuned before production version) ... the electronic systems weren't optimized for production etc.

And the finaly version of pre-LCI E65 being a driver's car? Hardly. Comparatively pre-LCI E65 will go into BMW history as one of the worst driver's cars ever made by BMW - compared to other BMW products.

Btw, just check the initial E65 7er sketches by AvH ...

They clearly showcase you the revision process was the opposite of the one described in AutoBild: not from bulkier to sleeker BUT from sleek to bulkier!

Thanks for clearing that up! When I first read about that a year or two ago it didn't make sense to me considering how the bulkiness of it was complained about so much at launch. For it to have been much more bulkier than this would've been a terrible eyesore and not marketable at all!

 

[Mr. Mercedes]

Looks like they are including a retro pre-Bangle aspect to this redesign if these illustrations are accurate. Love it.

Rurella, If you're referring to the ones in Eni's post, those are actually the first E65 sketches.

 

[rollo]

Rurella, If you're referring to the ones in Eni's post, those are actually the first E65 sketches.

I was and thank you for the clarification, I stand corrected.

 

[Ham8]

http://www.gmotors.co.uk/news/next-generation-bmw-7-series-g11-prototype-spied-for-the-first-time/
I dont think this is prototype, looks like mule

 

[Mark]

http://www.germancarforum.com/spied-2015-bmw-7-series

 

[HUTSUTAo]

will the v12 still be available?

 

[bombardier01]

Very nice evolution from the F01 but is it only my eyes that this new 7er seems more compact & smaller than F01? Btw this is LWB version, right?

 

[Merc1]

Looks like a giant 3-Series and yes much smaller than before, but that is a good styling trick/illusion.

M

 

[Levi68]

So beautiful. Love the new 7 Series.







But really, this is just so funny. Mercedes simply has a disadvantage with the S Class, it comes in the wrong time. It cannot fully profit from its life-cycle as the 3 and 5 Series do. The BMW always happens to be fresher.

 

[SKY]

SCOTT, could you give us some hints?

 

[SCOTT27]

SCOTT, could you give us some hints?

It's evolutionary but strikingly futuristic especially the front and rear , the lights are slimmer thanks to LED technology.
But if you look at one of the shots from the rear , you can see the larger multimedia screen in the dash.

The render shows you an idea of the front of the car but it is not wholly accurate in regards to the carry over grille . As the actual grille is larger and wider.

 

[Carmaker1]

FINALLY!!!! I thought I was losing my mind waiting for these to show up. I'm shocked how it's not even a mule, but an actual production design prototype. I think we'll see something 21 months from now, like we did with the F01/02. BTW, does anyone see how much lower it seemingly sits than the F01/02? Maybe it's the angle.

http://www.gmotors.co.uk/news/next-generation-bmw-7-series-g11-prototype-spied-for-the-first-time/
I dont think this is prototype, looks like mule

Actually, this would be a final design prototype. Putting slang aside, in calling all test cars that are cobbled together with foreign body panels "mules", all test vehicles are really prototypes. I believe they do vary between "mule prototypes"(stage 1), final design prototypes(stage 2), and FEP/pilot production models(stage 3). To date it seems that the only G11 mules seen in spy pics are possibly the white F01 seen above, or might have been testing much earlier alongside F01 facelift prototypes and not noticed.

 

[Smithee]

The proportions do not look as good as the S Class. The S class looks majestic and aggressive at the same time, the 7er looks like an upsized 3 series.

 

[DblPen]

you can not be serious comparing full camoed car with almost revealed one

 

[Levi68]

Well, the S Class looks good only with camo. Without camo there is a freaking ugly line that ruins the whole harmony of the car.

 

[Human]

will the v12 still be available?

BMW Group produces the V12 TT for Rolls-Royce, so IMO yes (and why not, it's there!)

 

[PanterroR]

Blah! Not convinced at all...

Hope i'm wrong though...