Toyota Prius proves a gas guzzler in a race with the BMW 520d

[coolraoul]

Like I said, I am not a blind anti-Prius german-car fan, and considered buying a Prius myself instead of the Golf.

My point is, that the hybrid technology is not the way to go. And the way Toyota is trying to use the hybrid-buzz in his big Lexuse's is nerving me. The Germans did not follow because they did not believe in that tech, and still don't. They follow because they have too. And they try to make diesel-hybrid, to innovate and get interesting mpg.

Sure, the Prius is technically more about CO2 than about mpg. Contrary to what Toyota says, because nobody really cares CO2.

But I don't think it is the solution. The Prius has a not particularly green petrol engine from what I know, has only advantages in the city yet is quite big and not easy to manoeuver due to its aerodynamic shape, so for me...a car that is designed like a family sedan, and has only advantages in stop-and-go city traffic while beeing not really green in all others conditions, but is marketed as the earth's savior...
And after that, they put the technology in the big Lexus, well...

So I don't believe in hybrids. They are not a complete, reasonable solution, because they have advantages in very specific conditions, and only disadvantages due to the weight in all the others conditions.

Concerning the CO2: yes, it's overall a green car, but as it never achieves the claimed mpg, it never achieves the claimed CO2 emissions.

I reckon however Toyota was first to detect the need of eco-friendly cars, while the Germans still were into the hp-war...but the hybrid tech is not the future. For me at least, it's not the way to go. That said, I don't think Prius drivers are fool, and I find this car very interesting. I would say it is more the marketing and buzz around it, and the Lexus' hybrid that bother me.

 

[CorpusCallosum]

I think the internal reading of this thread can go two different ways. That can be either the assertive view that the reviewers are bashing Toyota, or my personal view that they are showing how advanced BMW’s new diesel engines are. Let’s review that statistics first of all:

Vital Statistics

Model BMW 520d SE
Engine 1995cc, four cylinders
Power 177bhp @ 4000rpm
Torque 258 lb ft @ 1750rpm
Transmission Six-speed manual
Official fuel/CO2 55.4mpg / 136g/km
Performance 0-62mph: 8.3sec
Top speed 144mph
Road tax band C (£115)
Price £27,190
Fuel used on test 10.84 gallons (50.3mpg)
Fuel cost £54.19 (diesel)

Model Toyota Prius T Spirit
Engine 1497cc, four cylinders
Electric motor 50kW/67bhp
Power 77bhp @ 5000rpm
Torque 295 lb ft (motor) 85 lb ft (engine)
Transmission CVT automatic
Official fuel/CO2 65.7mpg / 104g/km
Performance 0-62mph: 10.9sec
Top speed 106mph
Road tax band B (£15, alternative fuel)
Price £20,677
Fuel used on test 11.34 gallons (48.1mpg)
Fuel cost £54.64 (petrol)

Firstly the BMW has roughly 500cc more of displacement per cylinder then the Pruis. Both are four cylinders. This will help the BMW achieve better performance but will also hinder economy. The Pruis has more low down talk which should allow the engine to get up to speed faster and more economical. These are just general statistics involving the engines of the car. On paper the Pruis should be more economical.

Another thing to take into account is that the BMW is a large family sedan. It will hold 5 people in supreme comfort. The Pruis is a small car with nowhere near the touring abilities of the BMW. This can be seen as either an advantage or disadvantage.

Obviously, when the BMW is under full load the car will have a higher consumption rating. This applies to the Prius as well.

The fact that the BMW with the extra weight, the stereotype of better performance equals higher consumption and the difference in type of vehicles portrays to me that BMW have done something very special. The fact this car gets better consumption then the Pruis in any conditions is quite amazing.

BMW engineers have done a fantastic job. This was never about Toyota bashing. Without Toyota’s involvement in fuel efficient cars I dare say BMW would never have produced such a fine engine.

 

[warot]

Like I said, I am not a blind anti-Prius german-car fan, and considered buying a Prius myself instead of the Golf.

My point is, that the hybrid technology is not the way to go. And the way Toyota is trying to use the hybrid-buzz in his big Lexuse's is nerving me. The Germans did not follow because they did not believe in that tech, and still don't. They follow because they have too. And they try to make diesel-hybrid, to innovate and get interesting mpg.

Sure, the Prius is technically more about CO2 than about mpg. Contrary to what Toyota says, because nobody really cares CO2.

But I don't think it is the solution. The Prius has a not particularly green petrol engine from what I know, has only advantages in the city yet is quite big and not easy to manoeuver due to its aerodynamic shape, so for me...a car that is designed like a family sedan, and has only advantages in stop-and-go city traffic while beeing not really green in all others conditions, but is marketed as the earth's savior...
And after that, they put the technology in the big Lexus, well...

So I don't believe in hybrids. They are not a complete, reasonable solution, because they have advantages in very specific conditions, and only disadvantages due to the weight in all the others conditions.

Concerning the CO2: yes, it's overall a green car, but as it never achieves the claimed mpg, it never achieves the claimed CO2 emissions.

I reckon however Toyota was first to detect the need of eco-friendly cars, while the Germans still were into the hp-war...but the hybrid tech is not the future. For me at least, it's not the way to go. That said, I don't think Prius drivers are fool, and I find this car very interesting. I would say it is more the marketing and buzz around it, and the Lexus' hybrid that bother me.

It's not a permanent solution, nor was it meant to be. The thing is that the technology is here NOW. For a second, just ignore all the Toyota marketing, because they are full of it. And yes, the Prius doesn't perform as it is claimed, but like bmer said, it's a car that has left an impression in the car industry. It's no hydrogen car, but it's a start.

Even though it is questionable how effective brake regen is on the M3, it has it... and you can't deny it was inspired by the Prius.

 

[coolraoul]

It's not a permanent solution, nor was it meant to be. The thing is that the technology is here NOW. For a second, just ignore all the Toyota marketing, because they are full of it. And yes, the Prius doesn't perform as it is claimed, but like bmer said, it's a car that has left an impression in the car industry. It's no hydrogen car, but it's a start.

Even though it is questionable how effective brake regen is on the M3, it has it... and you can't deny it was inspired by the Prius.

I certainly won't deny all what the Prius did in the auto industry. Even if the start-stop were there way before it, it made it revive; the brake energy recovering is also a great technology that was put in the light by the Prius. It sure is a car that set a trend, that started a move that now has become one of the major concerns in the auto industry (and I'm glad it is because it is a very important concern).

Toyota was the first to really insist on eco-friendly cars, to develop (at high cost) a new technology and to sell it. The hybrid tech has been, from what I know, developped by the Germans for some water-car in the 50's, but Toyota turned it into a viable concept for everydaycars. Kudos to them. It needed courage to do that because back when the Prius I was developped, nobody cared, the environment was the least of the customer's and industrials concerns.

So I won't deny the great technology behind the Prius. I just don't like the way it's marketed and especially how nobody seems to really understand what it is, and I hate the way Toyota uses it in the big Lesuse's, making people think a 2-tons hybrid is a green car. The LS600h achieves worst mpg than the LS460...

So i have nothing against the Prius, but I think it's overrated by many, that it has become a pure marketing product, and that Toyota is making too much noise around it. It's not a revolution. It's a very interesting evolution, a solution worth looking at, but it's not the future and it's not such a groundbreaking super-green car.

 

[bmer]

One of the most important reasons why Toyota chose to base its hybrid on petrol engine is because petrol-engined cars are still the majority all around the world and diesel a small minority in many major markets (eg. U.S. and Japan). Toyota naturally wants to sell it in as many parts of the world as possible.

They also usually present their new innovations in the home market in Japan. As the market share of diesel-powered passenger cars is almost non-existant in Japan (under 1 % if my memory serves me right) it was only logical that Toyota chose to use petrol engine in its hybrid.

It also makes financial sense because diesel engines are usually more expensive than comparable petrol engines. The hybrid technology adds some price for a petrol-hybrid but it remains competitive against a diesel engine in price while a diesel-hybrid is the most expensive solution.

Contrary to what Toyota says, because nobody really cares CO2.

I believe those people do who live in countries where the car's CO2 emissions determines how much taxes and all kinds of fees they have to pay.

And yes, the Prius doesn't perform as it is claimed, but like bmer said, it's a car that has left an impression in the car industry.

I can't take the credit because it wasn't me but Beemer.

The hybrid tech has been, from what I know, developped by the Germans for some water-car in the 50's, but Toyota turned it into a viable concept for everydaycars.

LOL Whatever technology that water-car used I doubt it helped Toyota's engineers in any way when they developed their hybrid technology. Besides I believe Ferdinand Porsche made one of the first hybrids in the beginning of 20th century.

 

[Beemer B773ER]

So I won't deny the great technology behind the Prius.

Well you certaintly tried your best to do that when you openly argued that the electric motor in the Prius is "useless", that it actually detracts from the car's mpg performance, and also accused Toyota of adding an electric motor to the Prius for the sole purpose of legitimately being able to use the term 'hybrid' eventhough the second motor itself had no function or benefit.

I just don't like the way it's marketed and especially how nobody seems to really understand what it is, and I hate the way Toyota uses it in the big Lesuse's, making people think a 2-tons hybrid is a green car. The LS600h achieves worst mpg than the LS460...

My bad Raoul.. I should have picked up on this point earlier. If I had known that the true reason why the idea of a Toyota hybrid gives you a sour taste on your tongue was because of how the company promotes the technology... well.... then I wouldn't have bothered with my lengthy previous post, coz it's nothing new that a car company is trying to create a big buzz about some new innovation of theirs. Marketing is all about image, and the Prius was highly successful in creating the image that hybrid engines were something quiet special, innovative and highly efficient (compared to petrol-engines). It's only natural for Toyota to want to capitalise on the strong, favourable and unique image of their hybrid engine technology and to begin leveraging this positive brand image for other models of the Toyota+Lexus line-up.

So yeh, it's natural to get upset at a particular company's marketing efforts and tactics... but if you're going to go one step further and openly argue that they are stretching the truth, playing with numbers, and deceiving/misleading their customers with marketing mumbo-jumbo, then sorry to say but that's the job of a Marketer.


Just out of curiosity, why did you compare the mpg performance of the LS600h against that of the LS460?
Would it not be wiser (and more fair) if you compared the LS600h L with a more direct competitor... such as the MB S550...

Engine, Transmission & Drivetrain
LS600h L: V8, 5.0L, 438hp, 8-spd CVT, AWD
LS 460 L: V8, 4.6L, 380hp, 8-spd auto, RWD
MB S550: V8, 5.5L, 382hp, 7-spd auto, RWD
Key points: The S550 is the least efficient in terms of hp/L. The LS600h L is the most efficient in terms of hp/L. The LS600h L features AWD which (as discussed in reference to Audi) means increased weight and increased fuel consumption.


Weight and Performance (0-60mph)
LS600h L: 5049 lbs, 5.5 seconds
LS 460 L: 4332 lbs, 5.4 seconds
MB S550: 4465 lbs, 6.14 seconds
Key points: The S550 is the slowest of the three in accelerating to 60mph. The LS600h L nearly matches the acceleration of the LS460 L even though it carries an extra 717 lbs (~16.5% heavier).

The 'Green' Factor (Efficiency)
Mileage (mpg)
LS600h L: City 20, Hwy 22 | Combined 21 mpg
LS 460 L: City 16, Hwy 24 | Combined 19 mpg
MB S550: City 14, Hwy 21 | Combined 16 mpg

CO2 Emission Rating
LS600h L: 8.7 tons per 15,000miles (= 17,400lbs)
LS 460 L: 9.6 tons per 15,000miles (= 19,200lbs)
MB S550: 11.4 tons per 15,000miles (= 22,800lbs)
Key points: The S550 is the least efficient of the three in City driving, Highway driving and therefore Combined mpg. This inefficiency shows that the Benz will also produce the largest amount of CO2 emissions. The LS460 L achieves the highest mpg for Highway driving. The LS600h L has the best City driving mileage, achieving 25% better city mileage than the LS460 L, and a staggering 43% over the S550. Overall, the LS600h L achieves the highest combined mpg of the three, beating the LS460 L by 10.5% eventhough the 600h L is heavier, has a larger capacity engine, more powerful and has a AWD drivetrain. The LS600h L achieves 31% higher Combined mpg as well as 31% less CO2 emissions than the S550 even though the Lexus weighs more, has more power and an AWD system.

So to conclude, the LS600h L beats the S550 in terms of:

• Power efficiency: because it can produce more power with a smaller capacity petrol engine (more from less)
• Acceleration: eventhough it's weight disadvantage is neutralised by its additional horsepower, the 600h L accelerates quicker than the Benz (more from same)
• City driving mileage: the hybrid engine of the LS600h L really comes into its own in city-driving conditions achieving 43% better mpg over the S550(much more from less)
• Highway driving mileage: eventhough the Lexus is heavier - and therefore faces greater drag and requires more power to move its extra weight - it still achieves better highway mileage (more from less with increased resistance )
• Combined mileage: the LS600h L has a clear advantage over both the S500 and the LS460 L in combined mpg (more from less)
• CO2 emissions: After an average year of driving (assumed at 15,000 miles), the LS600h L will end up producing 31% less harmful emissions in comparison to the S550 (less from same)
  [*]In short... the LS600h L is heavier, has more horsepower from a smaller capacity engine, has an AWD system, yet it manages to have quicker acceleration, better city/highway/combined mileage, and lower carbon-dioxide emissions.

So it doesn't matter which way you look at it, the LS600h L comes out the winner. So what exactly is wrong with the hybrid engines that Toyota put in their Lexus line-up?
They may not have the huge jump in efficiency that..say the Prius has over a Corolla...but the Lexus line-up of hybrids are big, heavy cars which weren't created from the onset to be hybrids (even the LS600h L isn't a 100% focus at hybrid efficiency since other non-hybrid variants of the LS have to be produced) ... but when you do compare a Lexus hybrid to a direct competitor which isn't a hybrid or diesel you can clearly see the superiority of hybrid technology. Again, Lexus hybrids' are not meant to provide a huge leap of efficiency in the luxury car market, but rather offer a more cost-and-energy efficient alternative to petrol-only vehicles.


I'm not sure why you would talk down and trash-talk a car company that is providing consumers with greater choice and greater efficiency. I understand if you're criticising how Toyota/Lexus go about marketing these hybrids to consumers, but already banishing 'petrol + electric' hybrid technology to the scrap-bin seems rather hasty considering the slow pace the transport industry (whether it be passenger vehicles, buses, trucks, trains or planes) is progressing up the learning curve of Hybrid/Alternative Fuel engine technology.



- Shameel K.

 

[bensmatt]

Well you certaintly tried your best to do that when you openly argued that the electric motor in the Prius is "useless", that it actually detracts from the car's mpg performance, and also accused Toyota of adding an electric motor to the Prius for the sole purpose of legitimately being able to use the term 'hybrid' eventhough the second motor itself had no function or benefit.



My bad Raoul.. I should have picked up on this point earlier. If I had known that the true reason why the idea of a Toyota hybrid gives you a sour taste on your tongue was because of how the company promotes the technology... well.... then I wouldn't have bothered with my lengthy previous post, coz it's nothing new that a car company is trying to create a big buzz about some new innovation of theirs. Marketing is all about image, and the Prius was highly successful in creating the image that hybrid engines were something quiet special, innovative and highly efficient (compared to petrol-engines). It's only natural for Toyota to want to capitalise on the strong, favourable and unique image of their hybrid engine technology and to begin leveraging this positive brand image for other models of the Toyota+Lexus line-up.

So yeh, it's natural to get upset at a particular company's marketing efforts and tactics... but if you're going to go one step further and openly argue that they are stretching the truth, playing with numbers, and deceiving/misleading their customers with marketing mumbo-jumbo, then sorry to say but that's the job of a Marketer.


Just out of curiosity, why did you compare the mpg performance of the LS600h against that of the LS460?
Would it not be wiser (and more fair) if you compared the LS600h L with a more direct competitor... such as the MB S550...

Engine, Transmission & Drivetrain
LS600h L: V8, 5.0L, 438hp, 8-spd CVT, AWD
LS 460 L: V8, 4.6L, 380hp, 8-spd auto, RWD
MB S550: V8, 5.5L, 382hp, 7-spd auto, RWD
Key points: The S550 is the least efficient in terms of hp/L. The LS600h L is the most efficient in terms of hp/L. The LS600h L features AWD which (as discussed in reference to Audi) means increased weight and increased fuel consumption.


Weight and Performance (0-60mph)
LS600h L: 5049 lbs, 5.5 seconds
LS 460 L: 4332 lbs, 5.4 seconds
MB S550: 4465 lbs, 6.14 seconds
Key points: The S550 is the slowest of the three in accelerating to 60mph. The LS600h L nearly matches the acceleration of the LS460 L even though it carries an extra 717 lbs (~16.5% heavier).

The 'Green' Factor (Efficiency)
Mileage (mpg)
LS600h L: City 20, Hwy 22 | Combined 21 mpg
LS 460 L: City 16, Hwy 24 | Combined 19 mpg
MB S550: City 14, Hwy 21 | Combined 16 mpg

CO2 Emission Rating
LS600h L: 8.7 tons per 15,000miles (= 17,400lbs)
LS 460 L: 9.6 tons per 15,000miles (= 19,200lbs)
MB S550: 11.4 tons per 15,000miles (= 22,800lbs)
Key points: The S550 is the least efficient of the three in City driving, Highway driving and therefore Combined mpg. This inefficiency shows that the Benz will also produce the largest amount of CO2 emissions. The LS460 L achieves the highest mpg for Highway driving. The LS600h L has the best City driving mileage, achieving 25% better city mileage than the LS460 L, and a staggering 43% over the S550. Overall, the LS600h L achieves the highest combined mpg of the three, beating the LS460 L by 10.5% eventhough the 600h L is heavier, has a larger capacity engine, more powerful and has a AWD drivetrain. The LS600h L achieves 31% higher Combined mpg as well as 31% less CO2 emissions than the S550 even though the Lexus weighs more, has more power and an AWD system.

So to conclude, the LS600h L beats the S550 in terms of:

• Power efficiency: because it can produce more power with a smaller capacity petrol engine (more from less)
• Acceleration: eventhough it's weight disadvantage is neutralised by its additional horsepower, the 600h L accelerates quicker than the Benz (more from same)
• City driving mileage: the hybrid engine of the LS600h L really comes into its own in city-driving conditions achieving 43% better mpg over the S550(much more from less)
• Highway driving mileage: eventhough the Lexus is heavier - and therefore faces greater drag and requires more power to move its extra weight - it still achieves better highway mileage (more from less with increased resistance )
• Combined mileage: the LS600h L has a clear advantage over both the S500 and the LS460 L in combined mpg (more from less)
• CO2 emissions: After an average year of driving (assumed at 15,000 miles), the LS600h L will end up producing 31% less harmful emissions in comparison to the S550 (less from same)
• In short... the LS600h L is heavier, has more horsepower from a smaller capacity engine, has an AWD system, yet it manages to have quicker acceleration, better city/highway/combined mileage, and lower carbon-dioxide emissions.

So it doesn't matter which way you look at it, the LS600h L comes out the winner. So what exactly is wrong with the hybrid engines that Toyota put in their Lexus line-up?
They may not have the huge jump in efficiency that..say the Prius has over a Corolla...but the Lexus line-up of hybrids are big, heavy cars which weren't created from the onset to be hybrids (even the LS600h L isn't a 100% focus at hybrid efficiency since other non-hybrid variants of the LS have to be produced) ... but when you do compare a Lexus hybrid to a direct competitor which isn't a hybrid or diesel you can clearly see the superiority of hybrid technology. Again, Lexus hybrids' are not meant to provide a huge leap of efficiency in the luxury car market, but rather offer a more cost-and-energy efficient alternative to petrol-only vehicles.


I'm not sure why you would talk down and trash-talk a car company that is providing consumers with greater choice and greater efficiency. I understand if you're criticising how Toyota/Lexus go about marketing these hybrids to consumers, but already banishing 'petrol + electric' hybrid technology to the scrap-bin seems rather hasty considering the slow pace the transport industry (whether it be passenger vehicles, buses, trucks, trains or planes) is progressing up the learning curve of Hybrid/Alternative Fuel engine technology.



- Shameel K.

1. S class is larger and heavier than LS460L.
2. S550 is disadvantaged in that it does not feature direct injection. Mind you that MB has gasoline direct injection engine since 2002(W203 C200GCI). A plausible reason for that situation is the fact some important MB S class market(e.g. middle east & china ) lacks good availability of high quality gasoline needed for Direct injection to operate reliably. MB can not have two version of the same engine either. Potential customers in middle east and china certainly would not be happy that they are being offered a less advanced & less powerful version of the S-class, like being treated as second class citizens.

Benz sales up 50% in 2007
"Mercedes-Benz said sales of its imported S-Class sedans in China rose by 40 percent to 11,500 units last year. The robust sales made the country the second biggest market for the S-Class after the United States."


Also, I don't know where the S550 0-60 number comes from. MBUSA has it at 5.4 sec.

The LS600h L nearly matches the acceleration of the LS460 L even though it carries an extra 717 lbs (~16.5% heavier).

A lot of extra weight increase(vs. base LS460L) is from the hybrid system itself(battery pack, motors & power electronics module). As we all know, more weight equals poorer handling.

So it doesn't matter which way you look at it, the LS600h L comes out the winner. So what exactly is wrong with the hybrid engines that Toyota put in their Lexus line-up?

From the numbers posted, it seems LS600HL is a failure. It's got slightly slower 0 to 60 time than the base LS460L. It handles poorly due to 375kg of extra weight. It actually consumes more fuel than the base LS460L when driven on highway. True, it is more fuel efficient in city. But if you brake it harder, it returns to a normal car rather fast, because brake regeneration power is limited, larger proportion of energy would have to be dispersed through brake, like a normal car. In any case, the hybrid LS does not justify its significantly higher cost. Even in turns of environmental impact, production of hybrid components(Nickel metal hydride battery and motors with lots of copper winding) are extra to base LS460L. Normally, hybrid cars offset those extra environmental cost during production through less tailpipe CO2 emission, which correlated to less fuel consumption. But in case of LS600HL, its fuel economy gain is slight to none-existent. So, in the end, it is not green at all.


And all above is without even mentioning the standard toyota hybrid disadvantages: poor handling, less space, battery replacement after few years.


And no, the awd argument would not save LS600HL either. Take GS350rwd and GS350awd acceleration and fuel economy data and extrapolate the difference to a hypothetical rwd LS600HL, and the acceleration and fuel economy argument above is still valid. But the real issue is, with a heavy battery pack in the trunk and driven mostly in city, is awd really needed? And furthermore, why isn't a rwd model offered in addition to awd model? I don't know what toyota is thinking, the car is just pointless. In fact, I would argue that LS600HL gives hybrid technology a bad name by applying hybrid technology so poorly. Even a Hybrid Chevy Tahoe, a full size SUV, gets 20mpg city and 20mpg highway, though it is slower(8.2sec 0 – 60mph). But what is remarkable is the SUV has much higher wind resistance(cd 0.27 vs cd 0.34) and weighs almost 500lb more than the LS600HL. Plus GM's SUV uses a push rod engine while the lexus has a direct injection engine with all the gizmo.


Personally, I think diesel and HCCI Hybrid is the way to go for the future. But before that, better hybrid battery technology is required. More energy density for space and weight efficiency, more power density for better brake regeneration and acceleration performance.

Engine, Transmission & Drivetrain
LS600h L: V8, 5.0L, 438hp, 8-spd CVT, AWD
LS 460 L: V8, 4.6L, 380hp, 8-spd auto, RWD
MB S550: V8, 5.5L, 382hp, 7-spd auto, RWD
Key points: The S550 is the least efficient in terms of hp/L. The LS600h L is the most efficient in terms of hp/L. The LS600h L features AWD which (as discussed in reference to Audi) means increased weight and increased fuel consumption.

oh, come on... Now you have me wondering what is the hp/L for my electrical scooter

 

[Monster]

Drive Review of Lexus LS600L

Overall Verdict
Three Star

http://imageshack.us

Self-parking system takes longer than parking manually and doesn't work on hills. It's 25 per cent ($53,800) dearer than the LS460.

Impeccably built.
Serenely quiet.
Crammed with technology.
Awesome 19-speaker sound system.
Better looking than earlier Lexus limousines.
Massage functions in reclining rear seat work well but they're only in one seat.
Full-sized spare wheel

Not as fuel-efficient as you'd expect.
Hesitates when accelerating from rest.
Small boot because of large hybrid battery.

Hybrid's new bright spark
Lexus is well aware of the importance of being seen to be green. It launched the LS600, the bigger petrol-electric hybrid version of the LS460 sedan, in 30 The Bond, the specially designed and built nine-storey "sustainable" office block in Millers Point. It uses 30 per cent less power and produces 30 per cent less carbon dioxide emissions than a similarly sized building.
A nine-storey building with the environmental footprint of a six-storey building is admirable. As long as you need all nine floors. Herein lies the dilemma for hybrid luxury cars. If their owners really cared about the environment, why not simply downsize to a smaller car?

Lexus knows most millionaires want to live in mansions and that's why cars such as the LS600 have been created. Expect to see more cars like it. BMW and Mercedes-Benz are due to release hybrid limousines during the next two years. For once in the super-luxury market, the Japanese have beaten the Germans to the punch.

Such vehicles are likely to find ready buyers. Fifteen years ago, luxury cars accounted for just 1.5 per cent of new-car sales.

Today, their share is 5 per cent - of a bigger total market. The number of super-luxury cars sold annually has doubled during the past decade. It's little wonder. The minimum wealth to join the BRW Rich 200 list has risen from $130 million to $180 million during the past year.

Despite being the first Lexus in Australia to cost more than $200,000, the LS600 is sold out until June. The company is already holding 63 orders but five cars a month are coming to Australia only (because of demand in other countries).

The LS600's body is a stretched version of the LS460, with an extra 12cm between the front and rear wheels. It doesn't seem like much but it looks like hectares from the back seat. The downside: it increases the turning circle to 11.8 metres. Just don't attempt a U-turn in an alley.

Since Toyota's luxury division was established 18 years ago, Lexus has been regarded as a more affordable alternative to the German marques. But the price of the Lexus flagship has gradually increased with each new model - along with the prestige of the badge.

Lexus has discovered the best way to establish credibility is to do what the Germans do: lead with technology. And so the LS600 is the world's largest and most powerful hybrid car - and has many other world firsts to its credit.

Under the bonnet is a conventional 5.0-litre V8, which is backed up by an electric motor. In stop-start traffic it is designed to coast silently on battery power alone. The official Greenhouse Guide consumption figure for the model is 9.3 litres/100km (compared with 9.9L/100km for Toyota's Camry). The only trade-off is that premium unleaded petrol must be used, although most limousine rivals have the same expensive taste.

With all-wheel-drive, the power is delivered to all four tyres at once, which helps provide optimum grip in slippery conditions.

Power delivery varies from an even 50-50 front-to-rear split to 30-70 (favouring the rear), depending on road conditions.

The LS600 can read the road in other ways, too. It is equipped with a "pre-crash" system. Radar monitors the road ahead and, if it senses a crash is imminent during an emergency stop, it will apply maximum brake pressure (in case the driver has not pushed the brake pedal hard enough), stiffen the front suspension and tension the seatbelts in preparation for the worst.

With luck, it won't come to that. As with most of its peers, the Lexus flagship comes with a stability control system that cuts engine power and applies the brakes if the system senses the car is travelling too fast in a corner. The Lexus system will also adjust the air-suspension to help the vehicle regain its composure.

It has radar cruise control (which maintains a safe gap between the car ahead) as standard equipment.

Other technical firsts include LED headlights (Australian regulations had to be updated before Lexus could introduce this technology here), which also follow the direction of the steering.

Using infra-red technology, the air-conditioning system measures the body temperature of the occupants and adjusts the car's temperature accordingly. Lexus claims its infra-red system is a world first. There are four air-conditioning zones, thus hopefully eliminating any heated arguments. Pun intended.

In the top-line, four-seater LS600, both rear seats can recline like business class aircraft seats. They even come with a footrest. But only the rear seat behind the front passenger seat has a massage function. Why should only one person get all the fun?

The reverse, or parallel parking system, works by using a camera and a series of radar sensors in the bumpers. When the car pulls up alongside an empty parking space, the system can determine whether the vehicle will fit in the gap between the two other parked cars, then steer itself into position at the press of a button.

The system operates hands-free and top speed is 4kmh, but the speed can be controlled by applying the brakes as the car is manoeuvring into position. Lexus strongly recommends this.

The company initially had public liability concerns, which is why the Australian introduction of the system was delayed for two years. "The driver, naturally, must continue to exercise all due care and diligence when using the parking system," the instructions say. "[The parking system] is designed as a driver-assist device only and should not be used as a substitute for skilled driving and safe parking practices."

Sadly, it's a flawed technology for the time being. It takes longer to set-up and operate than it does to park manually. And it doesn't work on hills.

The V8-hybrid system does well to disguise the LS600's considerable weight, thanks to the low-rev pulling power that electric motors provide and the continuously variable automatic transmission, which has a knack of finding the optimum gearing at the lowest possible revs.

The model we tested weighed a bit less than 2.5 tonnes. Lexus claims a 0 to 100kmh time of 6.3 seconds but our test showed it was closer to seven seconds, which is respectable for a car of this size. But there is one caveat. The hybrid Lexus isn't as frugal as buyers might expect.

The company says it delivers V12 performance and the economy of a medium-sized four-cylinder car. In reality, it delivers the power of a V8 and the economy of a V6. During our test, the hybrid Lexus used between 9.7L and 14.0L/100km - similar to what you can achieve in an LS460.

This contradicts the fuel rating labels, which are 9.3L/100km for the hybrid and 11L/100km for the LS460 but, after all, these figures were established in a lab.

The results aren't that surprising. The LS600's bigger body, all-wheel-drive layout and hybrid system add weight and blunt overall efficiency. It's actually a credit to the technology that the LS600 is 25 per cent heavier (about 500kg) than the LS460 and yet uses about the same amount of fuel.

But it's a case of one-and-a-half steps forward and one step back.

Lexus LS600 Hybrid - drive.com.au

 

[ZicZachZo]

My comment may be washed away to sea with all the heavy discussion at the moment... but I have to interject. I read in a magazine article not too long ago that stated the Prius is actually one of the least environmentally friendly cars on the market. What were they smoking? Well nothing, they were looking at it from a production standpoint and what they found was that a Jeep of some sort was actually less harmful to the environment due to the fact that it is very cheap to produce and that even throughout the vehicles life, it would still be more economical. I thought it was an interesting argument to the whole Prius hooopla that is going on right now.

 

[coolraoul]

I get your point Beemer. But I did not compare an S-Class and two Lexus, because they are two differnt cars.
When comparing the hybrid Lexus and the conventional one, we see:

-the advantage of the Lexus in in city. Where these big cars are not that often.
-in ALL OTHER CONDITIONS the hybrid is a burden. The weight means it needs MORE petrol on highways, which is exactly where a big Lexus is the most.
-the AWD? why is it there? I'm sorry it's not an argument, if it's bad for the mpg, why is it AWD when it's supposed to be a greener car?

I'm sorry. This car has no boot at all, can't carry more than four average persons without luggages because its too heavy and the weight capacity is ridiculous, it features super-not-green batteries that won't last more than 8 years and have a decreasing performance over the time, and it has worse mpg than the 460 where it will primilary be used.

So, it has worst mpg, polluting batteries, no boot, no weight capacity, worst handling and brakes, and it's more expensive.
I'm sorry, but selling it as a green car is taking the customer for an idiot. And that is what nerves me.

I've read the article about the Prius and the Jeep too. I think it's not really serious, but it raise an important point: producing a battery is extremely polluting. So if the CO2 benefit is not that enormous, then your green hybrid will pollute more than a conventional car.


Toyota says hybrid is super-green and perfect, the customers believe it does not pollute at all, and the governments all agree...Whereas technically it's not that simple.

I reckon the achievment that the Prius is, I am really admiring the involvment of Toyota had in green cars, but here it is not marketing it is lie. No hybrid is near to achieve the said mpg, thus the said CO2 emissions. And people should be conscious of the limits of the system. Who knows that an hybrid is ONLY better in town, and actually worst on highways?

 

[bmer]

-the advantage of the Lexus in in city. Where these big cars are not that often.

That is very much market-dependent. Especially in Asia big cars are mostly driven in the cities.