German Car Forum

There is an interesting article on JESMB (JESMB (News)) about AMG future engines. Now my german isn't that good so that I could translate it all the way so I put the text through a web translator and maybe something won't match.

Here it is:
“Starting from 2010 AMG equips its vehicles with gasoline direct injection and with asynchronous operation function. By a steady increase of the efficiency AMG will reach a consumption reduction starting from 2012 by 30 per cent in relation to the today's conditions. “

This today's AMG message confirms the rumors in the circulation is already longer. Until 2012 become AMG the M156 E63, which first and only complete self-development, by a new V8 gasoline direct injection engine to replace. The beginning the new CLS (C218) will make for end of 2010 (supposed sales designation CLS 55 AMG BiTurbo). The new V8 gasoline direct injection is based again, like the old V8 compressor of AMG engines, on Mercedes development names M278. The M156 E of 63, 6.3 litres of V8 becomes then only in the new SLC (W197) as well as probably begun in the McLaren P11. The new Mercedes engines M276 (V6) and M278 (V8) are complex advancements of the past V6 (M272) and the past V8 (M273) engines. The beginning the M278-V8 could make for 2009 in S-class facelift. Surface covering the new M276 and M278 are used then 2010 for example in the new CLS (C218). The new engines essentially take over the engine mount from the current. Received beside it a completely new cylinder head with cgi direct injection technology and additionally with two turbochargers are loaded. The details to the M276 engines are not more near well-known yet. The new M278 V8 becomes inclusive the AMG derivative in four Vairanten offered:

Motorblock - basis: M273 E46
New engine: M278 DE46
Power: ?
Remark: V8 with 4,6 litres & CGI technology

Motorblock - basis: M273 E46
New engine: M278 DE46 LA
Power: ?
Remark: V8 bi-turbo with 4,6 litres & CGI technology

Motorblock - basis: M273 E46
New engine: M278 DE46 LA
Power: 476 PS
Remark: V8 with 4,6 litres & CGI technology replacing the 500

Motorblock - basis: M273 E46
New engine: M278 DE55 LA
Power: over 550 PS
Remark: V8 with 4,6 litres & CGI technology new 55 AMG bi-turbo replacing the 63 AMG.


Source: JESMB

SO no V12?????

No I think that there is another thread that says that AMG is going to phaze out V12's.

????

I guess something is missing here.

4.6L V8 with 476HP? No way. Unless it's turbocharged.

The original source, JESMB states it's a bi-turbo with 435 PS.


Best regards, south

I wonder what is going to be the hp numbers of the next 55 AMGs. 580?.

What about the top of the line V12s, what will they be replaced with. The new SL is just two yeas away with mules due to roll out on roads in very very soon.

All the rumours claim that we will see a 700 hp V8 Bi-Turbo powering the top range AMG engine. It will be a Flybrid (hybrid with KERS) with a new super-efficient AMG transmition with 8 speed.

That sounds too good to be true.

He he sry I wasn't paying attention. I don't know where did I came up with that number

V12s are on the way out for AMG, a 700hp turbo V8 has been rumored the replacement for quite some time. V12 will remain in 600 and Maybach cars so they say.

M

I wonder what are they going to do with the V12, Mercedes has always lead on this niche, and now BMW is going to have the best V12 engine in history, the most efficient. The 600 engine is a dinossaur.

I doubt Mercedes will be completely phasing out their V12 engine. It just doesn't seem right letting the competition have one. My best guess is that this was a PR move that seemed appropriate at the time it was released.

The sale of Mercedes cars with V12 engines is so minor that it really makes no difference what these engines do to the environment. In my opinion they can afford to keep a V12 in the lineup. All they need to do is focus on making it more efficient. That's the top priority. This can be done with modernizing the engine and of course trying to minimize the weight of the vehicle as well as some transmission gear ratio modification.

A 700hp bi-turbo V8 would make up for the loss of the extra four cylinders. Potency seems not to be lacking, and this type of engine has exceptional smoothness as judged on feedback to current BMW engines.
A 700hp TT V8 with DI and 8sp MCT and KERS would sound way to good. The next top-line SL would be a killer with a lower curb weight (close to today's US spec Black Series or 4.200 lbs)

This should be 5,5-liter BiTurbo V8.

Don't worry, Mercedes will not allow BMW to upstage them in the engine stakes. They will have a V12 engine as long as the Bavarians have theirs. We have not seen the last of the great Mercedes V12.

Well, it may well be true we will still see a V12 on the ranks of MB, but it may be an "update" of the current one. Kind of how the same 5-speed transmission made it this long, only in the top spec models. While the current V12 is fine, it would still remain wanting, if only from an enthusiast's perspective, for 4-valve and other tech goodies of the downline engines.

I think Mercedes will continue to make a V12 for their top of the line SL, S, and CL models only because of the luxury refinement and the prestige. I don't expect AMG to consider tinkering with it because they've somewhat altered their ways in takling performance cars these days by citing more performance oriented cars with higher efficiency. So it seems like a smaller displacement and lighter V8 is the way to go...For now.

Right. V12s will remain in the 600 cars and maybe the Maybachs, but AMG will go lighter with super-potent V8s.

M

The supercars insider of carspyshots, McLaren P10, says that 4.6 engine will have 476 hp, and is due to replace the AMG engines in C-Class and SLK range, the one that will replace the AMG engines in the E-Class and the rest of cars that use the 63 AMG is a 5.0 V8 Biturbo, with aparently 600 hp (or even more, because McLaren tells it will be between 570 and 700 hp).

Then it´s the top range AMGs with the 700 hp V8 engine having the KERS on them. Also, he says that the 500 engine wont have twin turbo, so it should be a CGI engine, it will be a smaller engine that todays one (so 4.6 sounds very possible) and will have a similar power than the one Toni says.

The V6 engines won´t stay with us so much time more, because on the next CLS will debute the new one (I expect them to compete with the 3.0 TT that BMW uses on the 740i).

Promising times for Mercedes engines.

Report: AMG to shrink engines in addition to direct-injeciton, stop-start tech



With AMG no longer focused on chasing big horsepower numbers, efficiency could quickly become the new performance benchmark for the Affalterbach tuner. To that end, Mercedes' performance arm may be cutting the displacement of its engines in addition to the debut of new direct-injection and stop-start technology.

A range of new diesel models, advanced lightweight materials and construction methods are currently in development, as well as hybrid systems, and by next year AMG will reportedly introduce engine stop-start and direct-injection technology into its lineup.

But pulling down engine displacement from the 6.2L found in the company's '63'-branded AMG models to 4.6-5.5L could help push efficiency even higher. In order to keep power levels up to current standards, however, forced induction would be used, reports the Dutch AutoWeek. Though the addition of twin turbos could conceivably produce more power more efficiently, it will definitely add to the cost of the already expensive cars.

The more readily-available and less-expensive alternatives are perhaps more likely to come to fruition, especially in the short term. According to AutoTelegraaf, the AMG stop-start set-up will work much like any other engine stop-start system, shutting down the engine when the vehicle sits in traffic and then kick-starting it into life once the brake pedal is released or the accelerator depressed. The direct-injection system will be based on the second-generation system already launched in the Mercedes Benz C350 CGI BlueEFFICIENCY model.

AMG has set itself an internal goal of reducing fuel consumption of its lineup 30% by 2012, but to achieve this engineers will require much more advanced technology than engine stop-start and direct-injection systems. While fuel-efficient diesels and hybrid models are still several years away, we have already seen the first implementation of AMG’s new green initiatives in vehicles like the SL65 Black Series. The car’s advanced composite materials and other weight-saving construction techniques are set to filter across to future models.


Source: Report: AMG to shrink engines in addition to direct-injeciton, stop-start tech - [Mercedes Benz AMG] - MotorAuthority - Car news, reviews, spy shots