Vs EVO: - M3 vs C63 AMG vs VX8R

Since I found it on another site, this is all info I have for the moment.

Have got back from trip away to find latest mag on doorstep. Am tired so can't write too much but a couple of quotes:

"Straight away the BMW is different to the Merc, with refreshing clarity in its steering"

"By a unanimous verdict, the M3 wins. The others are instantly more appealing; the VXR8 for its sound and oversteer availability, the C63 for its polish, ambience and monstrous pace. Yet while it takes longer to get to know the M3, when you do, it reveals a depth of ability that is more inspiring and rewarding. After a determined drive, it leaves you more satisfied, showing that really big power can only take you so far"

Overall Rating:
M3 5 stars
C63AMG 4.5 stars
VXR8 4 Stars

The second quote above sums it up for me. Having just had the cars first service I am now into a different world and a journey and EVO have hit the nail on the head - this car is just getting better and better as the journey continues.

Bonus video:
Vauxhall VXR8 v BMW M3 v Mercedes C63 AMG | Planet evo | Videos | evo

Well, it appears now that the more things change, the more they stay the same. M3 gone softer?......C-AMG car gone more hardcore?.....ultimately, the M3 still remains the king from a subjective driving point of view.

The only question left really is whether the C-AMG car is objectively faster on a track like Nurburgring (Sport Auto) and Bedford Autodrome (Evo).......can't wait for those magazine issues to be out.

PC Valkyrie said:

The only question left really is whether the C-AMG car is objectively faster on a track like Nurburgring (Sport Auto) and Bedford Autodrome (Evo).......can't wait for those magazine issues to be out.

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Which one do you want to be fastest around those two tracks? is your heart still beating for the Benz?

The M3 seems to shine once again. I guess the M3 is still the most fun to drive in the segment?

Just_me said:

Which one do you want to be fastest around those two tracks? is your heart still beating for the Benz?

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Why do you think my heart is "still beating for the Benz"? In the other thread, I voted that the C63 will be a touch slower than the M3's time of 8:05 around Nurburgring when Sport Auto publishes the issue. It was Sunny who made a post thinking the C63 may be faster than the M3.

But I am curious how the legions of BMW fans will react IF the C63 AMG is a faster car around a track in the hands of a pro (even though I have a feeling that won't happen). The responses from the many internet forums would be very entertaining to read.

But no matter what happens, privileged owners of cars like the E92 M3 and W204 C63 AMG will enjoy their cars. And to be honest, the C63 will likely win most street encounters because of it's significant acceleration advantage. And on the track with average non-pro drivers, I bet the C63 will also be faster than the M3 for a lot of people, simply because there is so much more power in the low rpm range that is easily accessible. You really have to know how to shift properly and push the M3 to keep up (which is why it can be so enjoyable if you do it right). Again, this is from personal experience comparing my W203 C55 with E46 M3/Z4 M Coupe/Z4 M Roadster on a track (remember I went with a local BMW internet club to the track these past 2 years). No matter how "good" the BMW M cars feel for the driver, having a perceived "inferior" track car (like the C55) pass them doesn't make them feel very good at all. Some stop talking to you with a smile and generally avoid eye contact afterwards. I've seen M3 drivers push too hard when they try to keep up/pass me and spin themselves off the track.....classic example of pride getting in the way of driving correctly and within the limits of their car.

Think about it this way, JustMe: you take your 120i M Sport to the track and a driver in a Mercedes B200 can keep up or is faster than you. Not a pretty situation......either the driver in the B200 is a much better driver than you, OR the B200 with sport suspension isn't as bad as you thought it was compared to your car.......both possibilities tend to dampen the BMW driver's enthusiasm about their car or driving ability. Don't worry, JustMe, I doubt you'll ever see a B200 faster than you on a track, but I'm just trying to make a point.

Whatever laptimes the Sport Auto and Evo gets for the C63/M3 is great for bragging rights, and it will be an objective measure of overall perforamance capability of the cars, but it may not mean much for the average track driver because I doubt the M3 handles SO much better than the C63 in the hands of most people. C63 owners will enjoy mind-bending acceleration, while the M3 drivers will enjoy slamming that perfect shift just before hitting the redline along with a perfect feel for the road.

PC Valkyrie said:

But I am curious how the legions of BMW fans will react IF the C63 AMG is a faster car around a track in the hands of a pro (even though I have a feeling that won't happen). The responses from the many internet forums would be very entertaining to read.

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Remember my words: I'll be the 1st one to bow down and admit that C managed to beat M3 at it's own field.

Tycoon said:

Remember my words: I'll be the 1st one to bow down and admit that C managed to beat M3 at it's own field.

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Hey Tyc, I don't think it will be that straightforward. Most reviews so far suggest the M3 is still the more enjoyable drive. But I do see many BMW fans downplaying the significance of laptimes, IF the C63 turns out to be faster.......

But the fact that Evo (one of the world's most respected sports car magazines) rates the M3 higher than the C63 is a victory for the M3 already, in my opinion, regardless of what the laptimes are.

PC Valkyrie said:

But the fact that Evo (one of the world's most respected sports car magazines) rates the M3 higher than the C63 is a victory for the M3 already, in my opinion, regardless of what the laptimes are.

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Agreed.

Haha, I ask you a question and you give me an essay

LoL PC-V , I want to see the reactions too if it happens

You really like to mention those "real life races" dont you

I'm sure there are many drivers out there that will beat me on a track.
I've seen Hondas taking out Rs4 and Volvo's beating bimmers. I've also seen M3's beating Porsches around a track. Nothing unusual.
I bet 335i drivers can beat a M3 as well around a track.
Sure you will be mad but thats life, sometimes you win sometimes you lose, its more important you are having fun while doing it.

I remember when EVO first drove the new M3, they hated the steering feel, here they praise it.
What happen? did they get used to it or have BMW changed the steering feedback?

Just_me said:

I remember when EVO first drove the new M3, they hated the steering feel, here they praise it.
What happen? did they get used to it or have BMW changed the steering feedback?

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IMO that is because they had to point their finger at something to say that car isn´t without flaws.Thats all to it.I think they˙ve could selected some other thing other than steering feel on M3(IMO M3 is probably best car you can get in its segment) to dislike.
M3 is not easiest car to live with,that I admit..but,these cars(C63 and RS4 especially)are not meant to be driven by morons and ppl who do not appreciate its drive capabilities

I have to say that i'm impressed with the VXR8..good job!

And EVO giving the C63 4.5 out 5 is IMO a victory for it as much as it's a victory for the M3.

atuv said:

I have to say that i'm impressed with the VXR8..good job!

And EVO giving the C63 4.5 out 5 is IMO a victory for it as much as it's a victory for the M3.

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Giving the VXR8 4 stars out of 5 makes both M3 and C63 look like bad cars 5 stars is max, what if the max star were 7 stars, would the VXR8 still get 4 and M3 get 5 stars?

PC Valkyrie said:

Most reviews so far suggest the M3 is still the more enjoyable drive.

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...and that is the heart of BMW's game and the reason why the M3 is so much loved (and hated by some) - its not that it is the fastest, because there have often been others that were faster but seldom any that were more enjoyable and fun to drive.

Laptimes are something else, that has to do with efficiency and efficiency and entertainment are not always the same thing.

Just_me said:

Haha, I ask you a question and you give me an essay

LoL PC-V , I want to see the reactions too if it happens

You really like to mention those "real life races" dont you

I'm sure there are many drivers out there that will beat me on a track.
I've seen Hondas taking out Rs4 and Volvo's beating bimmers. I've also seen M3's beating Porsches around a track. Nothing unusual.
I bet 335i drivers can beat a M3 as well around a track.
Sure you will be mad but thats life, sometimes you win sometimes you lose, its more important you are having fun while doing it.

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Well, you obviously read my essay.....LOL

But your point about a "Honda" (I presume a Civic or Accord) taking out a RS4 is a poor example of what I'm referring to. Those cars clearly are lower performing cars in stock form compared to a RS4. If a Civic is able to beat a RS4, it must be either very modified, or there is a HUGE difference in driving ability. Nothing like comparing a C-AMG car to a M3 for people of comparable driving ability.

And yes, I like mentioning my "real life" track experiences because I've learned so much from them. I'm still a relative newbie at it, but now I'm able to see through the BS some fanboys have about their favourite brand or car and it's "performance" relative to other cars.

Just_me said:

Since I found it on another site, this is all info I have for the moment.

Have got back from trip away to find latest mag on doorstep. Am tired so can't write too much but a couple of quotes:

"Straight away the BMW is different to the Merc, with refreshing clarity in its steering"

"By a unanimous verdict, the M3 wins. The others are instantly more appealing; the VXR8 for its sound and oversteer availability, the C63 for its polish, ambience and monstrous pace. Yet while it takes longer to get to know the M3, when you do, it reveals a depth of ability that is more inspiring and rewarding. After a determined drive, it leaves you more satisfied, showing that really big power can only take you so far"

Overall Rating:
M3 5 stars
C63AMG 4.5 stars
VXR8 4 Stars

The second quote above sums it up for me. Having just had the cars first service I am now into a different world and a journey and EVO have hit the nail on the head - this car is just getting better and better as the journey continues.

Bonus video:
Vauxhall VXR8 v BMW M3 v Mercedes C63 AMG | Planet evo | Videos | evo

Click to expand...

Nice! May be this is when I play the told you so card...

It is been the same deal every time a new M3 is out, initially they bitch and whine about how the car has gone soft and then a 180 degree turn around. I bet it will be the same the when next M3 is out. Anyway good to know EVO likes the M3 and puts it above the C63.

or they learned to love it..
like you learn to love a new album by your fav artist..when it really isnt flawless..
hihi

dr Dunkel said:

...and that is the heart of BMW's game and the reason why the M3 is so much loved (and hated by some) - its not that it is the fastest, because there have often been others that were faster but seldom any that were more enjoyable and fun to drive.

Laptimes are something else, that has to do with efficiency and efficiency and entertainment are not always the same thing.

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I completely agree with you about efficiency and entertainment potentially being different things, especially when you are driving alone on a twisty road.

But here is another thing I've noticed from my track days: as much as people like to deny it, there is a desire among all particpants to go as fast as they safely can, whether you're a novice, or veteran. And although track days are not "races" per say, it is VERY satisfying (as a driver) to keep up with a car (or be faster than that car) that is supposed to be faster than you on the track. It may be because of differences in driving ability/courage, or it may be the perceived differences between the cars is not quite as large when you're not a pro. It can be a blow to the ego if you drive a supposed "superior" car and get passed by a supposed "inferior" car......the entertainment value goes down, no matter how well your car "feels". Efficiency and being happy/satisfied seem to go hand in hand from my experience. Same with Autocross, etc. The goal really is to go as fast as you can safely at these track days or Autocross.

OK, now back to the regularly scheduled topic of this thread: M3 beats the C63 in a Evo magzaine comparison! And for the record, I'm not at all surprised by the verdict from Evo.

Sunny said:

N
It is been the same deal every time a new M3 is out, initially they bitch and whine about how the car has gone soft and then a 180 degree turn around. I bet it will be the same the when next M3 is out. Anyway good to know EVO likes the M3 and puts it above the C63.

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Yup, that seems to be the case.

All this truly tells me is that AMG has stepped up it's game and ///M has delieverd what they said they would.