Official: C63 AMG Coupe Black Series

[wookieecrisp]

One more thing, why on earth would anybody want to buy this car instead of the all new porsche carrera S, which will cost even less including PDK and is much, much lighter and fun tot drive ?

Why do you say that? I don't think anyone on this forum has driven the C63 Black yet so nobody knows how it will drive.

However, from the specs we can conclude that the Black has more than 100 horsepower from 2 more cylinders.
We all respect the brilliance of the Porsche I6 but many people will prefer a big, powerful, incredible sounding V8 (‪Sound Capture: 2012 Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG Coupe Black Series‬‏ - YouTube) over a small six-cylinder, even if it does mean the car is heavier and will be a few seconds slower around a track.

The Black is like a German muscle car, the 911 a light sports car. They are very different.

 

[Sunny]

We all respect the brilliance of the Porsche I6

Porsche doesn't use I6. 911 uses F6 - flat 6 or boxer 6 engines.

 

[mclarenftw]

Yes it has 100 more horses but the weight penalty over a 911 is, what, 600 pounds ? If you do the math, even with "just" 400 bhp the carrera S still has better power to weight ratio. And when we take a GT3 model (which costs about the same as a Black series) into equation...

What I'm trying to say is this is just a pimped up C-class, and it's not and will never be a real sports car like a 911 (even in base form) is. Why ? Because a C-class is not a sports car to begin with.

 

[Centurion]

Yes it has 100 more horses but the weight penalty over a 911 is, what, 600 pounds ? If you do the math, even with "just" 400 bhp the carrera S still has better power to weight ratio. And when we take a GT3 model (which costs about the same as a Black series) into equation...

What I'm trying to say is this is just a pimped up C-class, and it's not and will never be a real sports car like a 911 (even in base form) is. Why ? Because a C-class is not a sports car to begin with.

You are absolutely right. Mercedes have made AMG steroid versions since the 70s and this car is no exception. Despite the mouth watering looks it will just like the clk BS and sl BS not go down in the history books as a memorable performer. It is stupid fast and capable for a Mercedes but that's it. There is no point in trying to spin it into a GT3 rival because it isn't and neither is Mercedes trying to market it as such. In some regions of the world AMG cars are a common sight, the C63 BS is an Easter egg from Mercedes to their affluent customers craving something special that their neighbours or colleagues won't have on their drive way.

 

[Merc1]

OMG do we have read this bullshyte in here too? The car hasn't even been driven yet and already its being wrote off. A C-Class isn't a sports car to start with and neither is a 3-Series, neither is a 5-Series, E-Class or anything else Mercedes, BMW or Audi builds (except the R8 or SLS) so yeah we get the point. The stupid part is this nonsense about how the car will be remembered and what not? How the hell does anyone where know that? The CLK63 BS is a memorable performer, its the best Black Series car so far, and this new one seeks to top that.

If you don't see the point of the Black Series, then fine don't buy one. Get a 911 like any other 911.


M

 

[wookieecrisp]

A C-Class isn't a sports car to start with and neither is a 3-Series, neither is a 5-Series, E-Class or anything else Mercedes, BMW or Audi builds (except the R8 or SLS) so yeah we get the point.

If you change enough components you can take something not designed to be sporty to a whole new level.
The M3 and M5 which are great sports cars are also based on cars that aren't sports cars. Also don't forget that under many, many layers of new components and changes, the 911 is a VW Beetle.

Sometimes cars that aren't logical on paper are amazing for other reasons.
Logically, you would buy a 911 Turbo over a Lamborghini Aventador, because the 911 weighs less and can do 0-60 in the same time for half the price.
Logically, you would buy a Nissan GT-R over an Aston Martin DBS because you get more for your money.

The Black is a different type of car than a 911. Some people don't care if 0-60 isn't as quick but they will still buy it because it has more horsepower. Some people will think that it more stylish, or they want to be different from the other $90k sports car owners.

I'm saying this based on the information available right now.
Nobody has driven it yet so we know almost nothing about what kind of car it is going to be once it is on the road.

 

[mclarenftw]

If you change enough components you can take something not designed to be sporty to a whole new level.
The M3 and M5 which are great sports cars are also based on cars that aren't sports cars.

M5 is not a sports car. It's just a (very) fast luxury sedan. People nowadays confuse speed with sportiness but that's just wrong. For example a Bentley GT is as fast as an M3, but you can't call it a sports car. No car which weights over 2 tons can be called that.

Also don't forget that under many, many layers of new components and changes, the 911 is a VW Beetle.

Was. Only the first generation 911 was based on a beetle chassis.

Logically, you would buy a 911 Turbo over a Lamborghini Aventador, because the 911 weighs less and can do 0-60 in the same time for half the price.

Really it weights less ?
911 turbo dry weight 1,595 kg (with PDK)
Aventador dry weight 1,575 kg

And 0-60 who cares about that ? How about 0-160 ?

Logically, you would buy a Nissan GT-R over an Aston Martin DBS because you get more for your money.

Except a good design, a plush interior, and a V12

Nobody has driven it yet so we know almost nothing about what kind of car it is going to be once it is on the road.

Yeah but it's not that hard to imagine. It will feel like a c63 amg but with more power and more grip, and a much, much harder ride. That's all.

 

[Nicks]

How about 0-160 ?

Even less people cares about that

 

[Guibo]

Was. Only the first generation 911 was based on a beetle chassis.
Really it weights less ?
911 turbo dry weight 1,595 kg (with PDK)
Aventador dry weight 1,575 kg
Except a good design, a plush interior, and a V12
Yeah but it's not that hard to imagine. It will feel like a c63 amg but with more power and more grip, and a much, much harder ride. That's all.

Layout is still shared with the old Beetle. And to some eyes, too much of the styling.
1595kg for the Porsche is DIN, not dry. I think that's all fluids + 90% full tank.
So a good design, plush interior and a V12 override considerations of performance/$. Then we can see how someone would want the C63 BS; not everyone likes a Porsche.
We don't know about the ride yet. It appears to be an adjustable coilover of some type, so might offer a range of setting to the customer for a softer ride.

 

[wookieecrisp]

Except a good design, a plush interior, and a V12

Thank you for agreeing with my point! In the same way that you might buy a Black for a good design, exclusivity, and a V8.

 

[Sunny]

Here is my train of thought on this whole thing.
1. Car looks freaking hardcore.
2. MB is going sell each and every one of what it makes. Sales is not the issue here.
3. BS of the past have not been exactly stellar track cars when compared to its peers (CLK63BS came closest), especially given the huge power advantage it often enjoys over them. This might not matter to MB fans, but for it to appeal to the non-MB crowd, it has to be competitive.
4. Having said, all the previous BS cars came when AMG was mostly still about brute power. Definitely changed with new E63/CLS63. You can't read much bad about how they handle, so I fully expect this car to be fully competitive.
5. To say, no, it is an MB, it is born with a handicap, is just a cope out, V8 or not.
6. It hasn't been tested yet by anyone anywhere, so to proclaim how it won't be competitive cause it doesn't have DCT or some other TLA is just bs.

 

[mclarenftw]

1595kg for the Porsche is DIN, not dry. I think that's all fluids + 90% full tank.

you're right, but what is the DIN weight of the aventador then ?

 

[mclarenftw]

There was a talk about 20 kg less than standard C63. Any confirmation yet?

I think that's the weight of the rear bench..

I was expecting 490hp..this is 510..and about 100K..

I was expecting more like 550, since the previous BS had 507 bhp That said, this car doesn't have anything to recommend it over the previous one, or to suggest it will perform better. Same power, same weight, same transmission, blah what a waste of imagination. People praising this car just because of its looks (altough to me it doesn't even look that great; the SL inspired facelift is a failure, it just doesn't look right; because mercedes, guess what, a C is no SL, and should never try to be one! lol) clearly don't know much about cars.

 

[Centurion]

I think that's the weight of the rear bench..



I was expecting more like 550, since the previous BS had 507 bhp That said, this car doesn't have anything to recommend it over the previous one, or to suggest it will perform better. Same power, same weight, same transmission, blah what a waste of imagination. People praising this car just because of its looks (altough to me it doesn't even look that great; the SL inspired facelift is a failure, it just doesn't look right; because mercedes, guess what, a C is no SL, and should never try to be one! lol) clearly don't know much about cars.

Although the spec sheets tell the hardly any upgrades are in place. I expect this coupe to handle better then the clk bs which was based of a technically inferior platform. In the end, this car is a sledge hammer sort of like a 911 Turbo S. Power hungry autobahn enthusiasts will water their mouths over it. But I am hopefully that reviews will cover some untold track credentials.

 

[purplehenk]

I prefer a more practical version of the C63 Black Series

 

[wookieecrisp]

Wow
AMG wagons always look super hot. I kind of doubt they will make a black series wagon though.

 

[purplehenk]

Thanks wookieecrisp

 

[martinbo]

Holy crap Henk! Damn near gave me a heart attack.

 

[Jabba]

1635 Kilos, thats my info. It must be the DIN. That means about 95 KG less than the regular AMG.

 

[martinbo]

That's bloody good for whopping 6.2 litre, 500 horse V8 touting coupe if true.