LeMans - Is anyone else watching the race?

[Guibo]

^And many would feel that they have had the best possible start otherwise Guibo wouldn't have mentioned them in the first place and when I highlighted their success rate was light years away from what Audi have achieved he say 'oh but they have to compete against McLaren and Ferrari' as an excuse so as to show their success is harder to achieve. lol

Deckhook, did you see me saying Red Bull's is harder than that of Audi (or even that of Ferrari)? I said you're comparing oranges to apples. But since you want to continue this line of reasoning, do you think Ferrari/McLaren each posed less of a challenge to Red Bull than Toyota posed to Audi, nevermind their combined strength against Red Bull? Tell me where Toyota were at Le Mans in 2011 (and how many cars they fielded against Audi this year), and that should help get the ball rolling.

And neither Red Bull's nor McLaren's is "as good" as Brawn's. Vanwall has a ratio of 29:9. So...? If we're going to pick and choose the metrics by which to choose the "most successful" F1 team, why not look at the overall records?

Red Bull
Races: 133
Victories: 29 (21.8%)
Poles: 41 (30.8%)
Fastest laps: 24 (18.0%)
Years competed: 7
Constructors champions/yrs competed: 28.6%

McLaren
Races: 710
Victories: 177 (24.9%)
Poles: 149 (21.0%)
Fastest laps: 149 (21.0%)
Years competed: 46
Championships/yrs: 17.3%

Ferrari
Races: 839
Victories: 216 (25.7%)
Poles: 205 (24.4%)
Fastest laps: 227 (27.1%)
Years: 62
Championships/yrs: 25.8%

Ok, so McLaren's victories/races "hit rate" is 14.2% higher than Red Bull's. But Red Bull's number of constructors titles per years competed is 65.3% higher than McLaren's. Everything taken together, Ferrari is faster than McLaren, with higher numbers and rate of poles and fastest laps, plus not only more championships, but a higher rate of championships per years raced.

 

[Beemer B773ER]

Oh for F.... Sake! Guys take it somewhere else...

Back on topic. Here's another video of that fantastic battle between the Toyota and Audi... except this time with some VERY spirited commentating.. and then the disbelief of the #8 Toyota going head-on into the tires.

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[Wolfgang]

http://www.quattroworld.com/2012-24...ory-for-audi-at-the-80th-24-hours-of-le-mans/

 

[Sunny]

Live coverage here - http://www.24h-lemans.com/live/en/

 

[Deleted member 25]

It's amazing they can drive so fast with such liitle light on the track. And Rip Allan Simonsen.

 

[Deckhook]

^I forgot all about the LeMans and started watching what I'd taped, awful crash though structural the car looked intact, I wonder what happened to him because these cars are built to withstand just about anything.

I'll still watch it but my heart isn't in the race now.

 

[bimmerjph]

I don't think I have ever been such a big Toyota fan than I am right now. I can not put into words how badly I don't want Audi to win.

 

[klier]

^In the course of two pages and 24 hours your argument has gone from Audi is most successful in LeMan to Audi has the most consecutive wins to it has the best win ratio to somehow Audi's ratio is somehow more valid cause endurance racing is somehow more credible than F1.

Welcome to the world of Footie.

 

[bimmerjph]

I just want to put it out there that I hope BMW knows that slapping your badge on a half-ass team is not a replacement for a factory team. I hope DKR's piss poor performance thus far shows them that. I mean seriously, DKR has been one of the,if not the, worst team out there this year.

Edit: The more I think about it the more this pisses me off. Why doesn't BMW dump their German Stock Car...I mean DTM program, and build an actual GTE car that can race at Le Mans. In other words give us a V8 Z4M, use a 3.0TT in GT3/GTE, or just don't race. But using these spec series cars or craming diffetent engines in to the cars is just disrespectful to the people that care about racing. Lets be honest there are two reasons a company goes racing. One, to further development. In this case BMW is using an outgoing egine in its motorsports line-up. Instead of pushing their the N55,N20, and B38 to the limit on the track. You want development in the absolute most extreme conditons? Use those engines. They say the reason they left F1 was to pursue more road relevent racing.

Right now Audi is HAMMERING the airwaves with commericals of their R18's. What does BMW have to respond with? A boulevard cruiser with a welded roof an old V8 in it? Or howabout a BMW that isn't really a BMW? BMW does not need a supercar, BMW does not need a Formula One Team, hell BMW doesn't even really need a small roadster (says a lot coming from me), what BMW needs is a LMP1 car. A car that they build every component in house. A car that BMW will instill all of their knowledge, values, and hard work into. A car that will go head to head with Audi and Porsche in a battle for the pride of a Nation. A car that will send Dr Wolfgang Ullrich home crying to his mother. Please BMW, I am begging you for that car,

 

[Deckhook]

I don't think I have ever been such a big Toyota fan than I am right now. I can not put into words how badly I don't want Audi to win.

By the looks of it I doubt you are going to get your wish. Its another year with Audi controlling the race from first to finish though the constant weather changes might yet throw them a curve ball.

 

[bimmerjph]

By the looks of it I doubt you are going to get your wish. Its another year with Audi controlling the race from first to finish though the constant weather changes might yet throw them a curve ball.

Oh it threw a curve ball alright.

 

[JHF]

Le Mans 24 Hours: Kristensen, McNish, Duval clinch Audi victory


Tom Kristensen, Allan McNish and Loic Duval took a commanding victory in a Le Mans 24 Hours that was overshadowed by the death of Danish driver Allan Simonsen early in the race.
For Kristensen it was a ninth win in the race and extended the record he already held. McNish took his third Le Mans win while Duval, who put the car on pole last Wednesday, claimed success in the race for the first time.
Audi has now won the event for 12 of the last 14 years.
Duval assumed the lead in the #2 R18 e-tron quattro in the seventh hour when the Benoit Treluyer/Andre Lotterer/Marcel Fassler #1 car, which had held the advantage from the start, spent 12 laps in the pits while an alternator problem was fixed.
A puncture sustained in traffic while Oliver Jarvis was at the wheel put the #3 Audi on the back foot at around the same time. The machine later needed further bodywork repairs that dropped it a further lap off the pace an hour later.
While the #1 car dropped outside the top 20 and the #3 fell to sixth, the Toyotas moved up to second and third.
Sebastien Buemi even had the audacity to get his #8 TS030 HYBRID back on the lead lap in the final half-hour to claim a well-deserved runner-up spot with Anthony Davidson and Stephane Sarrazin, but the #7 was not so lucky.
After losing third to Jarvis with four hours to go, Nicolas Lapierre crashed heavily at the Porsche curves, but amazingly managed to get his car back to the pits and repaired without dropping any more spots.
The Strakka HPD of Jonny Kane/Danny Watts/Nick Leventis finished sixth after the Rebellion Lola challenge was blunted by a safety car-inducing shunt for Andrea Belicchi on Sunday morning and gearbox problems for the #12 car that boasted Neel Jani and Nick Heidfeld on its line-up.
OAK Racing claimed a one-two finish in LMP2; Bertrand Baguette recovering from a spin in the final hour when heavy rain doused the circuit to take victory with Ricardo Gonzalez and Martin Plowman.
Second was the sister Morgan-Nissan of Olivier Pla/Alex Brundle/David Heinemeier Hansson while Mike Conway/John Martin/Roman Rusinov were third in their G-Drive/Delta-ADR ORECA-Nissan.
The G-Drive machine lost two laps - the margin it finished behind the winner - to a slow puncture early on and an unscheduled pitstop to change regulation lighting panels on the side of the car during the night.
For a large portion of the race the GTE Pro division looked likely to be dominated by an Aston Martin Racing squad still in mourning after news of Simonsen's death broke on Saturday evening.
A heavy crash from leader Frederic Makowiecki at the second Mulsanne chicane with five and a half hours to go handed the advantage to the sister Vantage GTE of Stefan Mucke/Darren Turner/Rob Bell.
But as the race moved along the #92 Manthey-run factory Porsche of Richard Lietz/Marc Lieb/Romain Dumas came into contention.
The late rain shower led to a range of strategies being adopted. Lietz stayed out on dry tyres when the weather was at its worst and was then able to use the fact that Mucke had been held in the pits by a red light to open up what would be a winning a four-minute advantage at a stroke.
With the sister #91 Porsche of Patrick Pilet/Jorg Bergmeister/Timo Bernhard also making a smart tyre call at this point the Aston was relegated to third.
Neither the factory Corvettes, nor the AF Corse Ferraris were ever in contention; Toni Vilander throwing away fifth in one of the Italian machines when he planted his in the tyres at Mulsanne corner when the rain came.
Aston also led the GTE Am division early on until polesitter Simonsen crashed fatally at Tertre Rouge on lap four; the Vantage GTE causing extensive damage to the crash barriers on the exit of the corner.
Marco Cioci and Matt Griffin picked up the baton and led first six hours in the #61 AF Corse Ferrari, but dropped down the order after co-driver Jack Gerber spun several times.
As the race developed and the #88 Proton and #77 Dempsey Del Piero Porsches suffered various maladies, the #76 Imsa 911 GT3 RSR of Jean-Karl Vernay/Raymond Narac/Christophe Bourret came to the fore.
A one-lap advantage was established with four hours to go, which proved enough to give the French trio victory ahead of the #55 AF Corse machine of Piergiuseppe Perazzini/Darryl O'Young/Lorenzo Case. The #61 car finished third.

POSITIONS AFTER 24 HOURS Pos Cl Car Drivers Laps Gap
1. P1 #2 Audi Kristensen/McNish/Duval 348
2. P1 #8 Toyota Davidson/Sarrazin/Buemi 347 + 1 Lap
3. P1 #3 Audi Gene/Jarvis/di Grassi 347 + 1m55.252s
4. P1 #7 Toyota Wurz/Lapierre/Nakajima 341 + 7 Laps
5. P1 #1 Audi Lotterer/Treluyer/Fassler 338 + 10 Laps
6. P1 #21 HPD Leventis/Kane/Watts 332 + 16 Laps
7. P2 #35 Morgan Baguette/Plowman/Gonzalez 329 + 19 Laps
8. P2 #24 Morgan Pla/Brundle/H Hansson 328 + 20 Laps
9. P2 #26 Oreca Rusinov/Martin/Conway 327 + 21 Laps
10. P2 #42 Zytek Krumm/Mardenborough/Ordonez 327 + 1m07.075s
11. P2 #49 Oreca P-Companc/Kaffer/Minassian 325 + 23 Laps
12. P2 #43 Morgan Gachnang/Mailleux/Lombard 320 + 28 Laps
13. P2 #48 Oreca Hartley/Chandhok/Patterson 319 + 29 Laps
14. P2 #38 Zytek Dolan/Turvey/Luhr 319 + 4m01.549s
15. P2 #36 Alpine Ragues/Panciatici/Gommendy 317 + 31 Laps
16. GTP #92 Porsche Lieb/Lietz/Dumas 315 + 33 Laps
17. GTP #91 Porsche Bergmeister/Pilet/Bernhard 315 + 2m10.631s
18. GTP #97 Aston Mucke/Turner/Dumbreck 314 + 34 Laps
19. P2 #34 Oreca Frey/Niederhauser/Bleekemolen 314 + 1m27.131s
20. GTP #73 Corvette Garcia/Magnussen/Taylor 312 + 36 Laps
21. GTP #71 Ferrari Beretta/Kobayashi/Vilander 311 + 37 Laps
22. GTP #51 Ferrari Bruni/Fisichella/Malucelli 311 + 1m57.110s
23. GTP #74 Corvette Gavin/Milner/Westbrook 309 + 39 Laps
24. P2 #41 Zytek Rossi/K-Smith/Lux 307 + 41 Laps
25. GTP #53 SRT Farnbacher/Goossens/Dalziel 306 + 42 Laps
26. GTA #76 Porsche Narac/Vernay/Bourret 306 + 1m51.302s
27. GTA #55 Ferrari Perazzini/O'Young/Case 305 + 43 Laps
28. GTA #61 Ferrari Gerber/Griffin/Cioci 305 + 1m26.507s
29. GTA #77 Porsche Dempsey/Foster/Long 305 + 2m51.114s
30. GTA #50 Corvette Bornhauser/Canal/Taylor 302 + 46 Laps
31. GTA #96 Aston Goethe/Campbell-Walter/Hall 301 + 47 Laps
32. GTP #93 SRT Wittmer/Kendall/Bomarito 301 + 1m58.599s
33. P2 #40 Oreca Dagoneau/Downs/Younessi 300 + 48 Laps
34. GTA #67 Porsche Gibon/Milesi/Henzler 300 + 32.348s
35. GTP #66 Ferrari Bertolini/Faisal/Qubaisi 300 + 51.765s
36. GTA #88 Porsche Ried/Roda/Ruberti 300 + 1m28.639s
37. GTA #75 Porsche Collard/Perrodo/Crubile 298 + 50 Laps
38. GTA #81 Ferrari Potolicchio/Aguas/Bright 294 + 54 Laps
39. P2 #39 Lola Porta/Brandela/Raffin 280 + 68 Laps
40. P1 #12 Lola Prost/Jani/Heidfeld 275 + 73 Laps
41. P1 #13 Lola Beche/Belicchi/Cheng 275 + 1m27.020s
42. GTA #70 Corvette MacNeil/Rodrigues/Dumas 268 + 80 Laps
43. P2 #33 HPD Tucker/Franchitti/Briscoe 242 + 106 Laps
44. P2 #46 Oreca Thiriet/Badey/Martin 310 Retired
45. GTP #99 Aston Makowiecki/Senna/Bell 248 Retired
46. P2 #45 Morgan Nicolet/Merlin/Mondolot 246 Retired
47. P2 #47 Morgan Imperatori/Howson/Tung 241 Retired
48. GTP #98 Aston Dalla Lana/Lamy/Auberlen 221 Retired
49. P2 #32 Lotus Holzer/Kraihamer/Charouz 219 Retired
50. P2 #30 Lola Mowlem/Burgess/Hirschi 153 Retired
51. GTA #54 Ferrari Mallegol/Bachelier/Blank 147 Retired
52. GTA #57 Ferrari Krohn/Jonsson/Mediani 111 Retired
53. P2 #25 Oreca Graves/Hamilton/Nakano 101 Retired
54. P2 #28 Lola Giroix/Haezebrouck/Ihara 22 Retired
55. P2 #31 Lotus Weeda/Rossiter/Bouchut 17 Retired
56. GTA #95 Aston Simonsen/Nygaard/Poulsen 2 Retired


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/108252

 

[Deckhook]

Considering the problem #1 and #3 had to finish where they did was some going, well done Toyota for making it a race from start to finish. Though what happened at the start made all that came after seem unimportant and rightly so, my thoughts go out to his family.

 

[Tumbo]

Amazing Audi. I watched this all night. Just amazing.

And, sadly... R.I.P. Simonsen

 

[JHF]

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[LaArtist]

Diesel power FTW!

Good going audi, they own Lemans!

 

[Beemer B773ER]

Another impressive showing by Audi... pure clock-work..but they were fortunate to have 3 entries.

Very impressed with Toyota's showing this year. Even thought they knew even before they got to LeMans that they'd be lacking for pace, both cars ran a great race. Effectively the #8 Toyota would have finished on the lead lap, so they have to be hugely satisfied with that! I was cheering them on to hopefully beat Audi...but at least now they've got a full race under their belt as they plan for redemption again next year. That's 3 times that they've finished second at LeMans. With Porsche being Porsche, next year's LMP1 should be even more exciting.

Simonsen's passing was very very sad. In this day and age of motorsports, and considering how the crash transpired, driver's shouldn't be losing their lives. I can understand if a tire blows out at the end of the Mulsanne straight, but in this case a head-on hit into the barriers shouldn't lead to death. The race organize need to invest in more innovative barrier systems..if not for the entire track, then at least along that entire straight. I understand the argument of maintaining the tradition and risk involved with LeMans, but this crash definitely shouldn't have been a deadly one.

It was great following the majority of the race...and I can't wait for next year!

 

[JHF]

Nice document!

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[Sunny]

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