Audi rumored to buy Alfa Romeo, officials deny it

[JHF]

For more than two years, Volkswagen has been making public statements about its willingness to buy Alfa Romeo and quadruple the Italian brand's sales, and for just as long, Fiat CEO Sergio Marchionne has replied with some version of "Mr. Piëch, drop it." According to a report in Ward's Auto, all that jousting might be over: it claims that sources close to both Marchionne and Audi CEO Rupert Stadler admit that the two are in talks for Audi to buy not just Alfa Romeo, but a production plant in Italy. In fact, a final deal could possibly include partsmaker Magnetti Marelli.

Against that backdrop, a report by German news weekly Stern quotes a Fiat spokesmen as saying it doesn't comment on rumors and an Audi rep has said flatly that "There is no substance in the news." If a sale is being arranged, the timing would seem to point to how eager Fiat is to raise cash to complete its major initiatives. Even though Alfa Romeo continues to delay its return to the US, it just showed off the production version of the 4C at the Geneva Motor Show (shown above) and said that preferred Fiat dealerships here would get them. Then there's Alfa's recently concluded deal with Mazda to develop a roadster based on the next generation MX-5 Miata – a deal that would seem to help both the Italian and Japanese brands.

The monetary issues are troublesome, though. Fiat is taking a beating in the European market and its weak-kneed balance sheet is delaying gotta-have-it products like the Jeep Cherokee. Fiat has been talking to banks about getting money to buy the rest of Chrysler and those financial institutions have also raised issues about debt and cash reserves, and the nasty game of chess Fiat is playing with the United Auto Workers (and now the court system about the portion of Chrysler it doesn't own) could end up blowing another hole in Marchionne's plans. It is possible that this could finally have convinced Fiat to at least see how serious Audi's parent company, Volkswagen, is about buying Alfa Romeo. Or it could be just another rumor.

Beyond Alfa Romeo, the report says the deal being discussed would include the rather modern Pomigliano d'Arco plant built just for the production of Alfa Romeos. Audi's interest in Magnetti Marelli is claimed to be because the German brand wants a components maker and it would also like to establish an R&D center in Italy, where its holdings already include Lamborghini, Ducati and the styling house Italdesign-Guigiaro.

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/03/28/audi-rumored-to-buy-alfa-romeo-officials-deny-it/

 

[Human]

CEO says 12 brands is enough... for now
http://www.worldcarfans.com/112083147772/volkswagen-ends-it-buying-spree---report

VW will stop buying brands to focus on integration, CEO says
Read more:http://www.autonews.com/article/20120831/COPY01/308319866#ixzz25COUhfiO

Or was The Borg just joking? One never knows!

 

[JHF]

^
Yeah, who knows!

 

[Levi68]

If this is true, Marchionne is the example of how not to be a manager/director. I have no idea how FIAT came to that situation. WTF have they been thinking and doing for this decade? I guess they thouhgt there is no competition, they will automatically get a share in the market. They were not sustainable, and did not look at what the competition was doing, they did not look where the market was going, thye did not look in which direction the regulations/laws were going, they really did nothing. Add to this Italian corruption.

If Audi really buys Alfa, it means again no Alfa to buy. It will not take them long to "rebadge" an A1 and an A3, but will it really be an Alfa. I don't see what position does Audi/VAG imagine for Alfa. Alfa should rival BMW (not 3er GT, 5er GT, etc.) and be slotted between Audi and Porsche. But will Audi want that? I doubt. So it will be between VW and Audi. But Alfa must be RWD, not FWD.

 

[Gianclaudio]

If this is true, Marchionne is the example of how not to be a manager/director. I have no idea how FIAT came to that situation. WTF have they been thinking and doing for this decade? I guess they thouhgt there is no competition, they will automatically get a share in the market. They were not sustainable, and did not look at what the competition was doing, they did not look where the market was going, thye did not look in which direction the regulations/laws were going, they really did nothing. Add to this Italian corruption.

If Audi really buys Alfa, it means again no Alfa to buy. It will not take them long to "rebadge" an A1 and an A3, but will it really be an Alfa. I don't see what position does Audi/VAG imagine for Alfa. Alfa should rival BMW (not 3er GT, 5er GT, etc.) and be slotted between Audi and Porsche. But will Audi want that? I doubt. So it will be between VW and Audi. But Alfa must be RWD, not FWD.

Alex, Fiat is, sadly, not thinking in Europe right now. Their focus is North America with the Chrysler group brands, and South America with Fiat Brazil, Fiat Argentina. And of course, Ferrari, all over the world.

You won't see a Punto, Bravo, 159 replacement in a couple of years. They prefer to invest where the cashflow is, and it seems to me that is Chrysler and Fiat Brazil

 

[JHF]

Were you to just consider the salacious headlines covering back and forth corporate jabs between Volkswagen Group executives and Fiat CEO Sergio Marchionne, the chances Alfa being sold to the Germans might very well be considered more the latter in a slim to none scenario. All that being said, a report this week filed by Ward’s Auto suggests this may very well be the case. Talks are said to be ongoing between the Volkswagen Group’s Audi AG unit and Fiat over a possible business transaction and the Wards piece theorizes that the main catalyst for such talks might directly be attributed to an Auto union. No irony there.
Well, let’s be clear. We’re not talking about Audi AG’s former official name nor its 1930s silver arrow racers campaigned under the name ‘Auto Union’ but rather the United Auto Worker’s Union (UAW) and their Voluntary Employee Benefit Association (VEBA) that owns auto a 4.15% stake in Chrysler following the government bailouts. In order to complete the purchase of Chrysler, Marchionne needs to purchase those shares and their value remains a point of contention between the Italian car manufacturer and the worker’s union. Further, the stronger Fiat makes Chrysler, Jeep, SRT and Ram, the more perceived value those shares have.
According to Ward’s, Marchionne signaled a willingness to sell off components manufacturer Magneti Marelli as a way to raise some cash. Audi is said to have been interested in this business and likely as a support system for Ingolstadt’s own growing Italian empire that now includes Lamborghini, Ducati and Giugiaro-ItalDesign. However, the Ward’s theory goes further than that suggesting the talks include Alfa Romeo and possibly Fiat’s Pomigliano production facility originally built in the 60s to build Alfas but one that builds Fiat Pandas today.
Not surprisingly, both Fiat and Audi deny any discussions at all but given Ward’s credible reputation and level of detail, we’re not ready to yet cast this story off as just another rumor story to feed the Piech v. Marchionne narrative. We’re summarizing the Ward’s report in this story but we highly suggest you read it in its entirety for a more intricate take on the current business situation (thanks Hans for the tip).
Does Alfa Romeo Make Sense as Part of Audi AG or the Volkswagen Group as a Whole?Just where Alfa might fit within the increasingly complex lexicon of the Volkswagen Group remains to be seen. Certainly the press has been more vocal as of late that the Volkswagen Group may be getting too big and thus too unmanageable. References to GM in the latter half of the 20th century are quick to come out in such cases, but to be fair to Volkswagen they’ve not really had any serious issues with the brands they manage. All except SEAT are in growth phases and with strong product lineups and even SEAT’s lineup is arguably stronger than it’s ever been though the Spanish home market is off some 40% and that’s hard to make up.
Rather than the rather unfair comparisons between grille-focused badge-engineering days at GM, Volkswagen may actually be the best yet at embracing Harley Earl’s vision. They build quality cars for literally every level of income and while there are similarities across marques they really have no equal in the art of differentiation between brands across common platforms. Further, a quick look at Audi’s A3 sedan just this last week in New York was all that was needed to truly open our eyes to the advantages of economies of scale in the vaunted MQB platform matrix and how that will allow Audi to take some of those savings and apply them to improving the material quality and allow that car to feel more like an A6 in touch, feel and haptics.
The Volkswagen Group and Audi have shown a keen ability to embrace storied brands and use their very impressive hardware portfolio as the basis of a product onslaught. Alfa is rich in heritage and a strong design brand – seemingly perfect for the Audi and its Volkswagen Group parent in that regard. Still, positioning within the brand could be tricky.
Imagine an Alfa Romeo rich in product based on the latest MQB, MLB and MSB matrices and it’s not hard to also envision an Alfa highly in competition with Audi itself – a design and technology focused premium brand with a rich racing heritage. Volkswagen has been fairly successful in carving niches for its own Volkswagen, Skoda and SEAT brands as they compete in the lower end of the market but Audi already finds itself in competition with Porsche and Bentley for some products and that’s at a time when both those exotic brands plan crossovers and smaller ‘sedan’-based models. Then again, what’s good for an Audi-owned Alfa may also be good for Audi itself. Perhaps that’s why this rumored deal comes from Audi specifically rather than Volkswagen.
A few months ago we proposed our own theory why Lancia may be the better deal. While completely unfounded, it was our own take on how a Fiat-sourced badge added to the group might be positioned. You can read that HERE.

http://fourtitude.com/news/audi-rum...fiat-discussions-says-report-from-wards-auto/

 

[Merc1]

NO! Audi does not need to buy Alfa. VW has enough brands, clearly.

M

 

[JHF]

NO! Audi does not need to buy Alfa. VW has enough brands, clearly.

M

Only rumored, just like this one was.

http://fourtitude.com/features/Colu...audi-get-a-third-italian-sister-named-lancia/

 

[Tumbo]

*sneezing*

Sorry, but I'm allergic to bullshit. (Will Smith line)

There is no way Audi would buy Alfa. Why in the whole world would they need that??

 

[martinbo]

VW on the other hand need to dispose of SEAT which has turned into a nothing brand. Skoda bears the mantle of the frugal appliance, VW's is that of all cars to all people and Audi as the sporting and aspirational brand. Where does that leave SEAT these days? Cheap and Cheerful? Hmmm, not so cheap and definitely cheerful no longer.

SEAT was intended to be the medium for some of the group's more radically styled and offbeat designs; cars with flair and fun in equal doses at a cheaper price point. They failed to pull it off and the more sober Eastern European budget brand snuck in and helped themselves to a slice of the character cake which nobody saw coming.

 

[Sayyaaf]

*sneezing*

Sorry, but I'm allergic to bullshit. (Will Smith line)

There is no way Audi would buy Alfa. Why in the whole world would they need that??

Alfa should be a RWD Audi for us. That would be a dream

 

[Tumbo]

VW on the other hand need to dispose of SEAT which has turned into a nothing brand. Skoda bears the mantle of the frugal appliance, VW's is that of all cars to all people and Audi as the sporting and aspirational brand. Where does that leave SEAT these days? Cheap and Cheerful? Hmmm, not so cheap and definitely cheerful no longer.

SEAT was intended to be the medium for some of the group's more radically styled and offbeat designs; cars with flair and fun in equal doses at a cheaper price point. They failed to pull it off and the more sober Eastern European budget brand snuck in and helped themselves to a slice of the character cake which nobody saw coming.

Agree totally here. Seat is in nomansland and is just so boring. You want a pricey VW product? You buy a Skoda. You want VW quality, you buy a VW. You want premium, you buy an Audi. Seat is like...nobody cares. I think VW should get rid of them.

 

[Levi68]

Agree totally here. Seat is in nomansland and is just so boring. You want a pricey VW product? You buy a Skoda. You want VW quality, you buy a VW. You want premium, you buy an Audi. Seat is like...nobody cares. I think VW should get rid of them.

I expect Just_Me to get angry about that.

 

[Deckhook]

WCF are stating that discussions for Audi to aquifers Alfa Romeo is in the advanced stages.

http://www.worldcarfans.com/113032955907/audi-very-close-to-buying-alfa-romeo---report


Me personally I think such a thing can only benefit Alfa who has always struggled to reach to height of success their designs truly deserve. One thing VAG do bring to every brand they've taken under their wing is quality and they will turn Alfa into a quality brand instead of just a desirable one with hit and miss reliability and materials.

 

[Levi68]

I just don't know. Will Audi build RWD Alfa's to rival BMW? If yes, I'm fine. But how long will it take? What about the only launched Alfa 4C? What about the Alfa-Mazda partnership for building the roadster? What about the "169" based on the Ghibli to rival the 5 Series/E Class/A6? How is it FIAT is selling its own brands to buy to Chrysler brands? That is no more FIAT, it is Chrysler own by an Italian. So will Italy end up with having only two brands, Ferrari and half-good Maserati?

And what about VAG? Won't the 13th brand (Alfa) be their down-fall? Not that I believe in superstitions, but who knows. Toyota was hurt, is getting better, GM was hurt, is VAG invincible?

Well it is hard for me to be against this Audi (VAG) owning Alfa. Because in fact it is Fiat who ruined Alfa. But the question is whether Audi (VAG) will do the same. It would be nice for Alfa to be totally independant, but that seems impossible nowadays, when even brands like Lotus and Aston Martin can't stay independent, and McLaren isn't having an easy task.

I don't get how such rumors came up after just after the "confirmation" of Alfa's come-back. On the other hand it seems very plausible. Alfa-Romeo Ducati, there were many special editions models and so, now Ducati is owned by Audi. Giugiaro designed the very beautiful (but that is it) 159 and Brera. Now Giugiaro is owned by Audi.

 

[Giannis]

VW on the other hand need to dispose of SEAT which has turned into a nothing brand. Skoda bears the mantle of the frugal appliance, VW's is that of all cars to all people and Audi as the sporting and aspirational brand. Where does that leave SEAT these days? Cheap and Cheerful? Hmmm, not so cheap and definitely cheerful no longer.

SEAT was intended to be the medium for some of the group's more radically styled and offbeat designs; cars with flair and fun in equal doses at a cheaper price point. They failed to pull it off and the more sober Eastern European budget brand snuck in and helped themselves to a slice of the character cake which nobody saw coming.

I believe that VAG offers far too many alternatives below Audi. Offering Audi, VW and Skoda makes a lot of sense. But Seat is priced similarly to Skoda, and only offers different design. Offering a design alternative is good, but in VAGs case, there are already many alternatives offered. They don't need another brand in that price segment, and Seat serves no purpose.

 

[Cashmere]

The other issue with VAG is how many of their products offer the same generic driving experience (as pointed out by Chris Harris a fortnight ago). While the marketing teams are working hard to distinguish one brand from the other, the same can not be said for the driving experience.

 

[SCOTT27]

According to what I have heard , Sergios diplomatic responses are about to raise the roof, it appears that VAG are leaking these stories to the media in order to pincer Alfa Romeo. As typical of Piech but it can and probably will backfire because when Piech was interfering in BMWs business in the late nineties ie Rover. Piech expected to get hold of Land Rover , MINI and Rolls-Royce. BMW strung VAG to the very last minute before deciding to keep MINI and Rolls-Royce and selling Land Rover to Ford Motor Company.
It was this reaction that made Piech remarket Audi as the BMW competitor , his revenge against Mercedes was the Phaeton because Mercedes entered in the Golf segment in the mid-nineties with the innovative A-Klasse that Piech decided to beat Mercedes at their own game with the Phaeton and off course we all know how that worked out.

Of course where does that leave SEAT? If you look at the new Leon SC if you squint and look at it side on its an Audi A3, plus there is Skodas rapid and continuous growth , growing much faster than VW apparently and with more products on the way including the VW Crossblue which for Europe will be badged as a Skoda apparently.

 

[Deckhook]

^Alfa would definitely benefit under Audi's control as long as they respect the design language that is unique to it and you can't deny that for the most part VAG have made each and every one of these brands far more successful then they ever would have been without their input and control.

Whilst this is undoubtedly true I still don't think they could have made the Mini brand as successful as it has been under BMW, maybe they should be looking at a possible tie-up with Alfa.

 

[bimmerjph]

I just don't see how they would position Alfa. As it is, it would already be too close to comfort with Audi. They can't move it down market, because then it would compete with too much with VW. They can't move it up market, because then it would still compete with Audi, and it would also bring Porsche into the mix.