Hot! Mercedes-Benz, What's Next?

[Merc1]

Now that the S-Class has broken cover accidently, the CLA45 AMG is next. Exciting times.

Frankfurt: CL/S Coupe, GLA and something else? Wolfe??

M

 

[Wolfgang]

Agreed, the CLA 45 AMG debut at the New York Auto Show comes next, followed by the GLA Concept in Shanghai as a prelude to the production version in Frankfurt. The S-Class reveal event is still expected on 15 May 2013 in Hamburg, and the dealership introduction in Europe on 20 July 2013. The new W205 C-class is already in the pipeline and might show up as early as January 2014 at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit Michigan.

 

[Wunderkind]

Wolf,

Do you know if mercedes is doing anything to rectify the situation with their transmissions (the new double-clutcher and the 7G-tronic Plus) I use the term 'rectify' advisedly because this problem needs to dealt with yesterday. I doubt the new 9-speed gearbox is going to be any better.

I just read the CARMAGAZINE.CO.UK review of the CLA and like everyone else, they have serious issues with the double clutch gearbox and went as far as saying the VW unit is just superior.

Why can't Mercedes just give up making their own transmissions and buy them from ZF? To me, Mercedes should only make something if they can do it better.

 

[Wolfgang]

MB appears to be working on it. Takes some time to adapt a new drivetrain engine transmission combination to a new vehicle and may require subtle software updates to accomodate the interplay correctly. The tested CLAs were probably pre-production vehicles, and thus some rough edges are expected, but which are supposed to be fixed in the production-for-customer cars. Mercedes also buys transmissions and a lot of gears from ZF, so they may consider the available alternatives.

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/03/06/2014-mercedes-benz-cla-250-sport-first-drive-review/

 

[Wunderkind]

I hate to say it, but It just seems Mercedes doesn't have the necessary talent and skills in the transmissions/drivetrains engineering department.

 

[Merc1]

I think the more accurate way to say is that the competition has passed them in this regard. Mercedes made some of the best automatics going for years, but it seems like they never perfected the 7G outside of the AMG cars and the MCT version. The ZF 8-Speed I can attest to is about as perfect as a transmission can be. That said though the MB 7G only lags when trying to push the car, in normal driving it is as good as anything else on the road.

M

 

[Wolfgang]

MB Passion may post updated details for engines and transmissions next week.
May include the Mercedes-Benz MY2014 S-Class (W222 & V222) starting engine lineup.
The 9G-Tronic will probably not be offered from the start.

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[Merc1]

Mercedes-Benz Debuts Five Models at NY International Auto Show


Two World Debuts and Three U.S. Debuts Continue to Highlight Significant Product Momentum

Mercedes-Benz continues its product launch momentum by highlighting two world debuts and three U.S. debuts at the 2013 New York International Auto Show, five of thirty models that will launch in the U.S. within the next seven years, or an average of once a quarter.
The World Debuts of the 2014 CLA45 AMG and 2014 B-Class Electric Drive, both under embargo until March 27, 2013, continue to demonstrate a cultivating premium small car segment for Mercedes-Benz. The CLA45 AMG features the world’s most powerful fourcylinder engine built in series production with 355 hp and 332 lb.-ft. of torque mated to performance-oriented AMG 4MATIC all-wheel-drive. The 2014 B-Class Electric Drive is powered by a 134 hp electric motor and has a range of 115 miles.
U.S. Debuts of the 2014 E63 AMG S-Model 4MATIC Wagon and 2014 CLS63 AMG S-Model 4MATIC represent a new direction of controlled performance in luxury cars that were previously equipped with rear-wheel drive. Finally, the 2014 C63 AMG sedan and coupe range receive an optional upgraded performance package called Edition 507, for which the coupe version will be present at NYIAS. By the end of calendar year 2013, there will be 21 AMG models available in the United States.
On the smart side, New York International Auto Show will see the U.S. debut of the smart fortwo BoConcept signature style car, which was designed in collaboration with leading Danish furniture design company BoConcept.


2013 Calendar Year Launch List
The year 2013 marks significant launches for Mercedes-Benz, specifically in the areas of AMG performance cars, BlueTEC clean diesel, all-new or refreshed 4-door luxury cars, and our smart brand.
Please note the following 2013 Mercedes-Benz and smart launches in sequential order that have already been announced:

• GL63 AMG (March)
• E350 sedan/wagon RWD and 4MATIC, E400 Hybrid, E550 4MATIC sedan (April)
• GLK250 BlueTEC (April)
• smart electric drive (May)
• SLS AMG Black Series (limited volume – July)
• E250 BlueTEC RWD and 4MATIC sedan, E350 and E550 coupe and cabriolet (July)
• E63 AMG 4MATIC sedan and E63 AMG S-Model 4MATIC sedan/wagon (August)
• CLA250 (September)
• All-new S-Class (September)
• CLA45 AMG (November)

M

 

[tennmb]

Well, I hate to be a Debbie Downer, but we receieved our first E400 hybrid today. I was excited to check it out, but that excitement was quickly drenched when I say the economy ratings on the sticker. The highway mileage is listed as 30, same as the regular gas, and the city is 24, a paltry improvement over the 20 the regular version acheives. And keep in mind the US E350 doesn't yet offer eco stop-start. And then you pay a hefty price tag to get the hybrid tech. It simply makes no sense. Especially with a 4 cyl. diesel on the E coming, which is likely to scratch 40 mpg.
In addition, it's kind of a bummer to get inventory when a major facelift is only about 45 days from hitting showrooms.

Recently had a client trade a Ford Fusion hybrid that was averaging 36 mpg on the trip computer. I thought that was strong for an average. I just don't see the point

 

[Merc1]

Yeah the E400 is just a waste as was the ML400 hybrid. Mercedes doesn't care about them really its just say they have one I think.

"In addition, it's kind of a bummer to get inventory when a major facelift is only about 45 days from hitting showrooms."

Who is at fault for that? Dealer management or MBUSA?

M

 

[Wolfgang]

Agreed, the fuel economy is less than expected. But the E400 HYBRID might be able to drive with the electric motor alone as Car and Driver wrote, and the E300 BlueTEC Hybrid? Suspect MB Hybrids are less about economy than about additional functions like for example "sailing", and electric driving, maybe right into an interior courtyard?


The S400 can’t move without the gas engine firing, but the E400 can go up to 22 mph and cover up to half a mile on the electric motor alone.

Thanks to a clutch between the engine and the electric motor, the E 300 BlueTEC HYBRID can cover short distances at speeds of up to 35 km/h using electric drive alone. Consequently, the internal combustion engine does not even need to be started in most cases when driving in stop-and-go urban traffic or manoeuvring in parking garages.

http://www.germancarforum.com/commu...ome-from-mercedes-benz-plant-in-berlin.32796/

 

[tennmb]

Yeah the E400 is just a waste as was the ML400 hybrid. Mercedes doesn't care about them really its just say they have one I think.

"In addition, it's kind of a bummer to get inventory when a major facelift is only about 45 days from hitting showrooms."

Who is at fault for that? Dealer management or MBUSA?

M

The only thing that would be our fault is if we ordered it in Quartz blue. Yikes! All of those allocation decisions are made up stream from the dealer, except in special circumstances.

Agreed, the fuel economy is less than expected. But the E400 HYBRID might be able to drive with the electric motor alone as Car and Driver wrote, and the E300 BlueTEC Hybrid? Suspect MB Hybrids are less about economy than about additional functions like for example "sailing", and electric driving, maybe right into an interior courtyard?

Wolf,
Shouldn't those things be different sides of the same coin? If you are 'sailing' then you aren't burning fuel. As someone on the frontlines of sales, I've never heard that mentioned as a selling point. No one has more experience in Hybrid success than Toyota, and their sales are driven by fuel economy and being green. Customers will want to know why they should spend a large premium on a hybrid model versus the regular one. I don't see 'sailing' as a $4k-$5k benefit. Do you?
I'll be curious to see what kind of actual results we get from these hybrids in real world application.

 

[Wolfgang]

Just trying to help you out to find some arguments for the E400 Hybrid, which doesn't imply I understand MB's hybrid strategy. MBUSA lists few additional features on their website, nor is there an owner manual online or recent press release covering the E400 Hybrid that I could find in a cursory search. So maybe the old press release from December 2011 still lists some stuff correctly. The few MB buyers interested in fuel economy probably prefer the new diesels anyways, the E250 BlueTEC, GLK250 BlueTEC or the ML350 BlueTEC.

Highlights of the E 400 HYBRID at a glance:

• Compact, intelligent and modular hybrid concept: no changes to the body of the base vehicle are necessary
• No compromises in terms of space, safety and comfort
• Significant increase in comfort with start/stop operation; noiseless start, complete climatic comfort
• Consumption combined (CAFE): 27 mpg
• Part of the intelligent downsizing strategy of Mercedes-Benz: increase in the engine output of the E 400 HYBRID by some 20 kW and 250 Nm thanks to the electric motor
• Impressive hybrid driving experience (start/stop function, regenerative braking, boost effect, purely electric motoring and "sailing" function)

http://media.daimler.com/dcmedia/0-921-1159704-1-1450435-1-0-0-0-0-1-12635-614226-0-1-0-0-0-0-0.html

 

[Merc1]

The only thing that would be our fault is if we ordered it in Quartz blue. Yikes! All of those allocation decisions are made up stream from the dealer, except in special circumstances.

Yeah that is the loud blue, it may be on the floor a while then lol.

M

 

[LaArtist]

Mercedes Benz whats next?

Bankruptcy?

( there were actual fools a couple of years back that though this was the future..HAH!)

Sometimes i hate forums

 

[Merc1]

This is what is next. Now lets hope they get as close to this as possible for production. This is just right look for a younger market crossover. The now trademark lines even work well here.

M

 

[HighestOfHigh]

^I really wish the production would come out just like that. Doubt it though.

 

[Merc1]

Wolfe, any sales projections for the CLA and GLA in the U.S. or worldwide?


M

 

[Wolfgang]

Marcus, MBUSA is pretty tight lipped.

Cannon won't say how many CLAs Mercedes-Benz plans to sell annually in the United States but said it will be more than a niche vehicle. http://www.mbca.org/news/2013-03-05/how-mercedes-slid-cla-below-30000

 

[Merc1]

Thanks Wolfe, interesting reading.

M