7 Series (G11/G12) [Spy shots] BMW 7er (G11) Spy Pics & Info

[Tapsa70]

According to Kacher weight reduction is not so radical after all.

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Secret...MW-7-series-2015-the-lowdown-on-new-G11-limo/

 

[klier]

According to Kacher weight reduction is not so radical after all.

In the case of the new 7-series, this means that the entry-level versions will for instance use lighter chassis elements, smaller brakes and a less complex cooling circuit than the high-end cars. This saves in excess of 100 kilos over the outgoing model, sources say.

100 kg is pretty radical already, either way. And in excess of that is even better.
It's a pretty generic article, stating only things that are already known. No real 'insider info' as he claims. Sounds like everything in there can be found on the net, he simply put it together.

 

[Mr Robert]

That is a good reduction. I think it would have given the best 7-series model today (730d) a quite noticeable gain in performance.

 

[klier]

That is a good reduction. I think it would have given the best 7-series model today (730d) a quite noticeable gain in performance.

'The best' if you consider a small engine and little fuel consumption important. Because from my POV it's the worst.
Or did you mean best selling? With that I could agree. With most important model as well.

The best? 760i SWB M pack Individual.

 

[Mr Robert]

'The best' if you consider a small engine and little fuel consumption important. Because from my POV it's the worst.
Or did you mean best selling? With that I could agree. With most important model as well.

The best? 760i SWB M pack Individual.

Yea, best selling and, from my personal point-of-view, the best model. I has well enough power for its size today (and making it 100 kgs lighter would render quite a few of the other models redundant). This is car is for getting from A to B in a calm and comfortable manner. It is not for trashing and therefore, I feel that the 730d is the best pick in the basket.

But, on the other hand, you can't go wrong with a 760 now can you? You want yours in gold with white leather?

 

[klier]

True, agreed. But a 760i is supreme comfort and incredible acceleration in one package. It's not meant for trashing, it's meant to be fast and comfy.

For trashing I would go with the F10 M5. It's similar to 760i in power but a completely different kind of car, I just drove the F10 M5 2 days around Munich and in the German Alps. Will review that shortly!

 

[Mr Robert]

True, agreed. But a 760i is supreme comfort and incredible acceleration in one package. It's not meant for trashing, it's meant to be fast and comfy.

For trashing I would go with the F10 M5. It's similar to 760i in power but a completely different kind of car, I just drove the F10 M5 2 days around Munich and in the German Alps. Will review that shortly!

There you go! Good on you to go for the M5, because the ivory for the inlays on that golden 760 has been confiscated by local authorities...

 

[le_rosey]

I was having dinner with one of the main managers of the M division on Wednesday in Istanbul (I don't remember his name, I am sure Scott can tell us which of the BMW executives were in Istanbul this week) and he told some very interesting things...
Firstly BMW has a fully finished super sports car in the basement so to speak. They went to the chairman but unfortunately their main focus is the i brand. So we should not expect BMW supercar in the foreseeable future. Secondly, there is no M7 planned at the moment. The reason being, BMW does not have clients for it, as extensive research reveals. Additionally, the next 750 will be fast and light, therefore it is very difficult to create substantial differential in terms of dynamics. They had a great fiasco with M5 Touring when projected sales were 2500 and the actual sales merely crossed 500 units mark. Thirdly, they plan to phase out diesel engines and focus on hybrid technologies and fully electric vehicles.
I also had a nice chat while having cocktails with a lady named Katia who is the head of BMW Individual for M models and let me tell you, some very nice plans in terms of interior finishings for the next M5... When time permits I shall upload pictures from Istanbul, where I spent a day with the M3, M4 and a whole bunch of BMW executives.

 

[Betty Swollocks]

According to Kacher weight reduction is not so radical after all.

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Secret...MW-7-series-2015-the-lowdown-on-new-G11-limo/

Not sure how you draw that conclusion.

 

[klier]

Actual sales of E61 M5 is over 1000. I wonder what this executive got wrong more....
Seriously though, nice info, but all to be taken with a grain of salt I suppose.

And @le_rosey of course you remember the M woman's name

 

[le_rosey]

It could be the sales in Europe or something, the point is that the projected sales for whichever region he was talking about were 5 times bigger than the actual ones.

 

[klier]

Yes, that could have been it. 500 in Europe, and 500 in the U.S?

Either way, it's a shame. I would have loved to have seen an M version of the best looking estate from Germany (F11)

 

[Mr Robert]

The thing to phase out is petrol. Who was this guy/gal?

 

[SKY]

Mind he is also saying no 9er at all. And he is Georg Kacher. He is THE man when it comes to german auto industry.

 

[SCOTT27]

I was having dinner with one of the main managers of the M division on Wednesday in Istanbul (I don't remember his name, I am sure Scott can tell us which of the BMW executives were in Istanbul this week) and he told some very interesting things...
Firstly BMW has a fully finished super sports car in the basement so to speak. They went to the chairman but unfortunately their main focus is the i brand. So we should not expect BMW supercar in the foreseeable future. Secondly, there is no M7 planned at the moment. The reason being, BMW does not have clients for it, as extensive research reveals. Additionally, the next 750 will be fast and light, therefore it is very difficult to create substantial differential in terms of dynamics. They had a great fiasco with M5 Touring when projected sales were 2500 and the actual sales merely crossed 500 units mark. Thirdly, they plan to phase out diesel engines and focus on hybrid technologies and fully electric vehicles.
I also had a nice chat while having cocktails with a lady named Katia who is the head of BMW Individual for M models and let me tell you, some very nice plans in terms of interior finishings for the next M5... When time permits I shall upload pictures from Istanbul, where I spent a day with the M3, M4 and a whole bunch of BMW executives.

Unfortunately not everyone is allowed to give the game away as they say in regards to future products.
But the key thing to remember about the BMW Sports car which many seasoned journalists have forgotten over the past few days is that its not an i8M. When in California on the press launch I kept get asked i8M? I8M? There won't be an i8M because BMWi and BMW M won't cross-contaminate in product but BMW M will learn and utilise BMWi DNA. But at the current time the i8 is that car and what a car. Once we get to a future sports car because the learning of using extensive Carbon fibre at cost effective levels. The aim is to deliver something exceptional and cutting edge as the i8 with high performance and a complete lightweight concept to embarrass current competitors for around the same price.
It will be the car that allows BMW M to offer a complete individual concept that is not based on an existing model like the BMWi sub brand. The key thing to remember is that the i8 will be around 3 years old so there will be a re-writing of the sports car narrative for BMW. For now the i8 is that car.

There is no M7 officially planned but it is being discussed. At the recent Beijing autoshow a Q&A with Chinese customers and representatives questioned the need to have one. Its still a work in progress but the new 7er is shaping up to be more dynamic for the luxury customer who wants more physical aspects in their sedan as well as rejuvenation.

With the E61 M5 Touring we sold every one built so the volume was really low for this model. I would love to see an F11 M Touring. Because that would be my ideal next car. In retrospect the current M550d Touring is that car and it is something I cannot fault because it is competent in very level plus it does not drink as much petrol as the E61.
If one is available I always take it to pretend that its an M5 Touring. I would love to see more Touring examples but surprisingly there is not enough demand for such a model with customers either settling for Sedan or Coupe.

In the development of the BMWi strategy we visited the under development sustainable city Masdar city in the UAE and it was influential in the conception of the BMWi cars and brand , if you see the architecture you see how this all fits in. Of course they have a huge order of i3 in place because of how it fits within that environment.
At BMW there is a lot development ongoing to reduce cylinders and combine with hybrid-electric drivetrains if we take the Vision Future Luxury as a direction it has a six cylinder engine with hybrid electric drivetrain so there are developments to come from that using the lowest amount of cylinders but retain that power expected with a sustainable drive train. I do not foresee diesel being written out unless of serious legislation being implemented.

The Plug-in Hybrid version of the next Rolls-Royce Phantom will be the ultimate expression of this development. iIts a product to ensure survival of the luxury car.

 

[SCOTT27]

Mind he is also saying no 9er at all. And he is Georg Kacher. He is THE man when it comes to german auto industry.

Vision Future Luxury is a concept car designed to show possibilities as well potential for the present and future upper segment for BMW.

Vision Future Luxury is embarking on a tour to gauge reaction as it already has done in China and last weekend in Italy.
Customer reaction will determine its future with a decision due at a later date. So far its appearances in Chinese cities and in Italy last week have been exceptional. It will visit other countries in the course of gaining feedback.

Production reality is depending on feedback , potentially the car would be easy to do and due to its advanced platform with the next Rolls-Royce Phantom and its status as a low volume model. The car could even be finished at Goodwood in England alongside the Phantom as like the Phantom , a few hundred would be sold because of its niche. So they are investigating all feasible options.

But the most interesting aspect to marketing is the potential against competitors. Knowing all too well that Mercedes will have a super-sized variant of the S-Klasse. A 9er goes a step higher to offer the customer further individuality. So right away you have the potential narrative of an entirely new concept versus an additional variant, and many at BMW like that.

 

[SCOTT27]

Yes, that could have been it. 500 in Europe, and 500 in the U.S?

Either way, it's a shame. I would have loved to have seen an M version of the best looking estate from Germany (F11)

You and me both. The M550d Touring kind of makes up for it though.

 

[klier]

^ I'd rather have a 550i Touring, then

Also, pretending an M550d to be an F11 M5 is something I cannot do. The differences are so massive I can not overcome them.

Audi has stolen this niche because BMW didn't (and doesn't) have anything. If BMW would have had an M5 Touring from the E34 on, there would be a fanbase.

 

[Ralfd]

...
Production reality is depending on feedback , potentially the car would be easy to do and due to its advanced platform with the next Rolls-Royce Phantom and its status as a low volume model. The car could even be finished at Goodwood in England alongside the Phantom as like the Phantom , a few hundred would be sold because of its niche. So they are investigating all feasible options.

But the most interesting aspect to marketing is the potential against competitors. Knowing all too well that Mercedes will have a super-sized variant of the S-Klasse. A 9er goes a step higher to offer the customer further individuality. So right away you have the potential narrative of an entirely new concept versus an additional variant, and many at BMW like that.

Here is a repost from my comments in the Gran Lusso Concept Thread one year ago. Worth reposting here, I think...
Maybe someone at BMW has read it ... I claim the copyright ;-) ... if there is a job opening in BMW Marketing, send me a message... that would have been my dreamjob , since I studied in Munich 25 years ago

I guess, those proposals are logical in the sense that they extend the current strategy of BMW .
For along time I was thinking that BMW needs to fill the gap between the 7er and RR.
Imho BMW should look for a possibility to allow the RR core strengths and image to trickle down into the BMW line of cars, but doing so carefully without diluting image or core values of either marque.

To do that , maybe they should create a 'bridge car' that is not 'in between' the 7er and RR , but a BMW 'sister' model of the RR Ghost, which should not be too difficult, because it shares a great part of the underpinnings with the 7er anyways.

- While the Ghost represents the classic RR approach, a parallel BMW model would emphasize the BMW core values. To be a real bridge model, I would suggest to have the interior and final assembly done by RR. The (only) engine could be an exclusive M-Version of the 12 cyl from the Ghost . This way BMW could market the car as a real hybrid between BMW (driving experience, engine...) and RR (craftsmanship and materials used) . My guess is that high end customers are more willing to spend some serious $ for such a car than for a direct 7er derivative.

So my suggestion would be to think about a bridge car based on a hybrid between RR and BMW . It could be called M9 and the 8er coupe, cabrio and GC should be derivatives of this model.

This bridge group should then bring the next 'revolution' in BMW design (after the various recent evolutions) and trickle down into the next generations of the 'lower' BMW lines and by doing so subtly benefiting from RR image.

 

[Busty]

Weight reduction, reloaded: I heard about *realistic* 17xx kg (for the 6 cylinder/gas version) today. The 'how' of it is achieved is to be even more impressive. So far, I cannot judge to what extent these 'infos' are marketing ado but it sounds good.