Kia KIA K9 flagship comes into focus

[K-A]

Your logic is faltered. You assume that if a car brand have success in terms of accessbility to the massive public it is automatically considered "inferior" or less quality than the luxorious brands.. Have you seen the new Fords lately? American brands do very well in large vehicles. There is no mistake that KIA is currently the fastest growing car brand in the U.S.

Ferraris are out of the radar now, as are Mitsubishis.

No, my logic is intact. Mercedes/BMW are LUXURY/PREMIUM CARS. I.e if they're as accessible as a Kia, then they're no longer a Luxury/Premium car manufacturer. I wouldn't pay $60+K for a car that comes from a non-Premium manufacturer, because like it or not, with those prices, you want at least an air of exclusivity.

*Success* is measured differently between these brands. Kia is very successful (or getting there at least), but to be successful, they go a different route than M-B. They have cars at the cheapest segments, they depend on super high volume to generate profits, and their profit margins are very small. Compare that to M-B, who also are a mass brand, but within a spectrum of "Luxury" still, therefore, they depend on volume as well, but nowhere near the amount that Kia wants/needs, and M-B's profit margins being a *Luxury Brand* are vastly higher than Kia's.

Apple's to oranges.

"Ferrari are out of the radar"? Are you serious. Ferrari are an ultra-exclusive brand that everybody fawns over. The reason they are successful is DUE to their exclusivity and "sex-appeal". If a $20K Ferrari were all over the roads like a $20K Hyundai, Ferrari's focused approach and brand appeal in the exact way it is now would be out the window.

 

[DreamWeaaver]

No, my logic is intact. Mercedes/BMW are LUXURY/PREMIUM CARS. I.e if they're as accessible as a Kia, then they're no longer a Luxury/Premium car manufacturer. I wouldn't pay $60+K for a car that comes from a non-Premium manufacturer, because like it or not, with those prices, you want at least an air of exclusivity.

*Success* is measured differently between these brands. Kia is very successful (or getting there at least), but to be successful, they go a different route than M-B. They have cars at the cheapest segments, they depend on super high volume to generate profits, and their profit margins are very small. Compare that to M-B, who also are a mass brand, but within a spectrum of "Luxury" still, therefore, they depend on volume as well, but nowhere near the amount that Kia wants/needs, and M-B's profit margins being a *Luxury Brand* are vastly higher than Kia's.

Apple's to oranges.

"Ferrari are out of the radar"? Are you serious. Ferrari are an ultra-exclusive brand that everybody fawns over. The reason they are successful is DUE to their exclusivity and "sex-appeal". If a $20K Ferrari were all over the roads like a $20K Hyundai, Ferrari's focused approach and brand appeal in the exact way it is now would be out the window.

They are very expensive to "maintain"...which is what a lot of people have problems with.

Ferraris were HUGE several years ago...i don't see people fawning over it these days..Hardly at all. Neither with Porsches.

Certain American brands like Fords are getting up there...as with Kia.

So are you saying Hyundai and Kia need to take the same route that BMW/Merc/Ferrari is taking? Which is the luxiry route other than M-B?

 

[Gianclaudio]

Sure, that's why Ferrari and Porsche break their own sales record every year. Nobody wants them........

 

[DreamWeaaver]

Sure, that's why Ferrari and Porsche break their own sales record every year. Nobody wants them........

I didn't say that...but I don't think there is any craze over them. Many Americans are into buying American..which includes American brands...the new Fords are VERY good...Chevy too...although other ones like Dodge, Chrysler needs to improve.

 

[K-A]

Ferraris were HUGE several years ago...i don't see people fawning over it these days..Hardly at all. Neither with Porsches.

WHAT?! lol

Porsche and Ferrari are stronger than ever. People who consider a Porsche or Ferrari don't get near considering-cross shopping a Kia, Ford or Hyundai.

Kia is an ECONOMY brand, is what I'm saying. M-B is a PREMIUM brand. Porsche and more-so Ferrari are EXCLUSIVE-LUXURY brands. All have different approaches and definitions to "success".

Porsche and Ferrari are ALL craze. That's why if you pull up in a 911 or 599 GTB, you get enthusiastic attention thrown at you. Pull up in a Kia, Ford, Chevy? Most often, you're invisible, and that's one of the things that people want from them, in fact.

 

[HighestOfHigh]

Porsche and Ferrari are stronger than ever. People who consider a Porsche or Ferrari don't get near considering-cross shopping a Kia, Ford or Hyundai.

But they will shop for a Toyota! I've seen it myself.

 

[DreamWeaaver]

WHAT?! lol

Porsche and Ferrari are stronger than ever. People who consider a Porsche or Ferrari don't get near considering-cross shopping a Kia, Ford or Hyundai.

Kia is an ECONOMY brand, is what I'm saying. M-B is a PREMIUM brand. Porsche and more-so Ferrari are EXCLUSIVE-LUXURY brands. All have different approaches and definitions to "success".

Porsche and Ferrari are ALL craze. That's why if you pull up in a 911 or 599 GTB, you get enthusiastic attention thrown at you. Pull up in a Kia, Ford, Chevy? Most often, you're invisible, and that's one of the things that people want from them, in fact.

If you put things that way, it seems much more clearer now. Yes KIA is still in it's early days and is rising very rapidly...and yes it's still an ECONOMY brand as you say. Give it some credit though, because it has many enthusiasts and supporters.

Yes Porsche and Ferraris are good as any other...

But but...the craze today is FORD and CHEVY....! esp. Fords.... American brands are on the rise too....! When people buy LARGE vehicles, do they look for Euro cars or Asian cars? NO....they prefer American CARS!

 

[Gianclaudio]

Went to my city's auto fair yesterday. To my surprise, there was the Kia K9.

The car feels ok if you compare to the quality of an A4, C class, 3er but is it NO way close to a 5er/E, let alone a 7er/Sclass/A8

Sorry for the blurry images, there were too much people in the fair and was difficult to take pics.

 

[Levi68]

The car is not "premium", but is way too good for a car that in not. The real premium should worry. Where the premium lead (especially BMW) is in the engines and in safety (Mercedes), for the rest there is no more such big difference. The main difference is in terms of image/marketing. I mean looks, this is a Kia, not even a Fiat, but it just has everything, HUD, "i-Drive/MMI", LED, screens, etc...

The car actually looks quite good, but that is not a surpise, it has copied all nice details of many different cars. I guess next generation will have alot more personality. Once Kia will have found their own corporate desing, they'll be on a role.

 

[Gianclaudio]

The car is not "premium", but is way too good for a car that in not. The real premium should worry. Where the premium lead (especially BMW) is in the engines and in safety (Mercedes), for the rest there is no more such big difference. The main difference is in terms of image/marketing. I mean looks, this is a Kia, not even a Fiat, but it just has everything, HUD, "i-Drive/MMI", LED, screens, etc...

The car actually looks quite good, but that is not a surpise, it has copied all nice details of many different cars. I guess next generation will have alot more personality. Once Kia will have found their own corporate desing, they'll be on a role.

Alex, my impressions after yesterday motorshow were about that. (were lucky to touch, seat and inspect just about every car in display) I'm not buying a "premium" car unless is something like an S class, a Porsche or up class (Bentley, etc). There's no rational way to justify the prices of the "premium" city, compacts and medium cars. No when so many cheap brands are improving their tactile quality or when still cars like Toyota or Honda are more reliable.

For me the only thing in favour of premium cars is their design, which is much better resolved, but even so, for me paying twice for fancier interior plastic is nonsense. I prefer to spend that money on trips around the world or good food/wines

 

[ateekt]

I saw that car in person last month. I was amazed how a Kia can look a cross of BMW & Lexus at the same time.

 

[Levi68]

I prefer to spend that money on trips around the world or good food/wines

Or watches.

 

[Gianclaudio]

Or watches.

LOL, I knew it was coming

 

[Cashmere]

Thanks for the pics Gianclaudio.

Any idea how how the pricing of that car compares to the A4/3er/C class in your country? Is it priced above or more competitively?

 

[Human]

The car is not "premium", but is way too good for a car that in not. The real premium should worry. Where the premium lead (especially BMW) is in the engines and in safety (Mercedes), for the rest there is no more such big difference. The main difference is in terms of image/marketing. I mean looks, this is a Kia, not even a Fiat, but it just has everything, HUD, "i-Drive/MMI", LED, screens, etc...

The car actually looks quite good, but that is not a surpise, it has copied all nice details of many different cars. I guess next generation will have alot more personality. Once Kia will have found their own corporate desing, they'll be on a role.

Thanks man! Well said also Clearly the trim (tactile & perceived) is KIA, not premium but nearly on VAG standards. Even though I did start this thread, I am a real anti-Hyundai/KIA guy, period.

Edit: OFF TOPIC. New Santa Fe launched locally, one thing Hyundai did Toyota a HUGE favour. It's priced so high making the best-local-selling Toyota Fortuner look now even more like a HUGE bargain

 

[Gianclaudio]

Thanks for the pics Gianclaudio.

Any idea how how the pricing of that car compares to the A4/3er/C class in your country? Is it priced above or more competitively?

You're welcome. I didn't ask the price, but will ask a friend who works at Kia, tomorrow. I know the smaller Kia Cadenza cost 62k us dollars, which is Audi A6 territory... and IMO is no match for it. I think Kia/Hyundai is a bit overrated in interior quality, altough this K9 felt pretty fine. The Cadenza didn't.

Thanks man! Well said also Clearly the trim (tactile & perceived) is KIA, not premium but nearly on VAG standards. Even though I did start this thread, I am a real anti-Hyundai/KIA guy, period.

Edit: OFF TOPIC. New Santa Fe launched locally, one thing Hyundai did Toyota a HUGE favour. It's priced so high making the best-local-selling Toyota Fortuner look now even more like a HUGE bargain

Same happened here, Kia has skyrocket their prices (So did BMW, sadly ) where the point is on par or surpassing many japanese brands. I did the Naas Human thing on friday, the guys at each stand just hated me for touching and inspecting everything on their cars. Really surprised with the american brands: GM, Ford, Chrysler and with Renault, too. And MUCH liked BMW's interiors compared to Audi.

 

[Levi68]

Regarding interior quality, I think the premium do worse and the non-premium do better, that is why they come close. I don't know how many suppliers there are and how many different quality grades are available, but I'd say there is no much difference, in the material itself. I see a new trend (which already long ago existed at Alfa Romeo) of covering interiors with leather.

I would have nothing against low tactical/visual quality plastic covered with, even fake, leather, like the new A Class.

 

[DjordjeC63]

Well, MB Artico (''basic'' leather in Mercedes cars) is fake. If you want real leather, then you have to pay more and get Nappa leather.

 

[Levi68]

Well, MB Artico (''basic'' leather in Mercedes cars) is fake. If you want real leather, then you have to pay more and get Nappa leather.

Yes I know. But I'm fine with fake leather on a A Class or even C Class. For me it is always better than the best plastic (except if track car).

 

[Gianclaudio]

Thanks for the pics Gianclaudio.

Any idea how how the pricing of that car compares to the A4/3er/C class in your country? Is it priced above or more competitively?

I got the price... is 110 000 us dollars
That's the price for an CLS550 and well over a X6, Q7, GL550... they won't sell a single unit, you can be sure.