1er / 2er future models: Scott26 reports; part 2

[EnI]

Old thread with a lot of info:

http://www.germancarforum.com/showthread.php?t=1380

Fresh info (04/12/2006):

The front lights in this (Huckfeldt's Z8) PS are similar to the upcoming 2er coupe and cabrio - an intense sportier look from the cute and cuddly 1er...

Look at recent BMW annoucements - specially the 02 series which is more commonly known as 2002 which was recently rebuilt in 2006 to celebrate it's anniversary. BMW are subliminally communicating the message of their forthcoming baby coupe. [image no longer available]

Everything is now starting to make sense: a mid range 3er Coupe leaves the segment open for an E87 based model . Which to be more USA savvy will adopt the 2er label - the 2002 was very popular in the USA especially with BMW 2002 enthusiasts. Now it's coming back The 1er is conceived to be a 2 stage model , the coupe/cabrio will follow the lead with the 3er coupe with different front end, the rear is exact to the CS1 concept car . And it is these cars that the US market will receive - no sedan is planned for any markets.

So, scott's confirmed my info:

Interesting:

• BMW are trying to create a new interest in a classic 02-series (2002 tii) by re-introducing it.
• They even started to use 02-series (02er Reihe) naming.

Get it? They are preparing the ground for a new 2-series coming next year in a 2-door sedan-ish coupe & cabrio form (E89 & E86) - as a reincarnation of classic 02-series.

 

[wltsm]

Re: BMW 1-series variants: Scott26 reports

If the 2 series will look anything like that PS, it's going to look hot!

So is there going to be an M2, because it is going to be sold in the American market?

 

[EnI]

Re: BMW 1-series variants: Scott26 reports

If the 2 series will look anything like that PS, it's going to look hot!

The man just said only front lights would be similar.

So is there going to be an M2, because it is going to be sold in the American market?

The plan is, but the calculations are not made yet - depends on demand, the pricing of based model, the potential pricing of M2, and the calculated profit margin, available M resources, competition moves etc. The engine for potential M2 is already in development. But, even if there were no M2, there would be a top "si" version of 2er.

 

[Centurion]

Wohoo a mini M3, sounds sweet. With atleast 280hp, a cute shape and a nice price it will be a hit.

 

[AdvEvo]

I am waiting for a M2 coupe. I really hope M makes us one.

I heard rumours it s going to be 4inline turbo.
I hope not. M should be high rev. no turbo engines.

2.5liter inline 4 with 8500 rpm and 300hp would fill my needs exactly or a 3.0 liter high rev 6 banger 340hp placed further back for nice balance. I just pray they keep the weight in check. No more than 1300kg. Wide arches. Option for csl style seats for the enthusiast. nice 18inch wheels, Alcantara steering wheel like in my CS now. M diff LSD. Maybe an CSL airbox or do ask to much now

if they do. They have my money.

 

[Top Secret]

I'm still skeptical of scott's information. I can't remember the last time he's had information that actually turned out to be true.

 

[Deutsch]

I'm still skeptical of scott's information. I can't remember the last time he's had information that actually turned out to be true.

I'm an agreement. Would be nice if Eni could shed some light on this thought?

 

[Matt]

Sry, accidentally posted on the old thread..... Heres what I said pertaining to Duetch's questioning of Scott's reliabilty about the 1 getting the turbo:

^I think you mean 3 litre.

Actually Scott26 is wrong (not necesarily his fault falt) but the 1 will get the 3.0 litre turbo when it comes to the U.S. That was made official at the Hawaii BMW DAG meeting. Imagine a 300 hp 1 series....R32, prepare to get smoked...

 

[Porsche Guy]

Actually Scott26 is wrong (not necesarily his fault falt) but the 1 will get the 3.0 litre turbo when it comes to the U.S. That was made official at the Hawaii BMW DAG meeting. Imagine a 300 hp 1 series....R32, prepare to get smoked...

If only it was a 300hp NA 3.0 liter engine.

 

[AdvEvo]

No turbo please.

Turbo s belong on 4wd jap tin rally boxes not on bmw.

I hope they reconsider.

The M2 should not get a turbo.

M2 ---> ca. 300 hp
M3 ---> ca. 400 hp
M5 ---> ca. 500 hp
M6 ---> ca. 500 hp

Would be plane stupid if we see a turbo in there.

 

[wltsm]

2.5liter inline 4 with 8500 rpm and 300hp would fill my needs exactly or a 3.0 liter high rev 6 banger 340hp placed further back for nice balance. I just pray they keep the weight in check. No more than 1300kg. Wide arches. Option for csl style seats for the enthusiast. nice 18inch wheels, Alcantara steering wheel like in my CS now. M diff LSD. Maybe an CSL airbox or do ask to much now

I think you may be asking for a bit much there, if that was the case, then this car would be too pricey!

I don't think they would develop a new 3.0 6 with 340bhp when they already have an excellent 3.2 6 used in the M3! It would be nice though if everything you have said was true!

 

[EnI]

Let me explain something:

1. E86 & E89 2-series cabrio & coupe are coming next year (Europe)
2. 2-series will be sold in US, 1-series (the hatch) won't
3. there will be no M1 (hatch), only "si" version - not decided yet what engine
4. there is no decision taken yet whether to build M2 or not - still on hold

BMW are aiming to re-introduce the legendary 02-series (2002i) with the new 2er. So, the car have to be nimble & agile. Chasis engineers are tweaking the E86/9 chasis - to make it more capable than the hatch's one. The I6 proved to be too heavy for sporty top-end 1er / 2er. Therefore I4T is in the work for the top model "si" - and can be tweaked to M, if necessary for M2.

235i - I doubt it. That would mean 2er coupe/cabrio and 3er coupe/cabrio top versions (except M version) would be the same - BMW marketing would never do that, believe me.

The future is: turbo. I4T, I6T, V8T, V12T.

Audi is going also this way: S3 with 2.0L 4-cylindre 250+hp TFSI

So, expect M2 or "si" with I4 turbo with 280-300PS.

Remember: smaller models, lower prices, lower profit margin. So, M2 will be there only if it pays off. M resources are needed for more important, more profitable products ... So, M2 engine - if there will be M2 - will be a derivate of a standard engine, not made from scratch.

 

[AdvEvo]

about driving agile etc youre right. I have an m3 e46 and 130i msport. I also had a 120d. i have driven the CSL a lot on tracks.

The 120d was much more nimble than the 130i and e46 m3. But the sound of the straight six that is just sex. The sound of the csl engine is just pure porn.
If bmw just could build us an ultimate 4 banger atmo.

2.0si engine could that not be the base for an M engine just make it 2.5 and get high revs out of it. Lets face it 175hp out of 4 banger is nothing special the new clio has more than that. New Clio race versions have 220 or 230hp already out of 4 banger. Bmw had 238hp in the e30 m3 many years ago. With the technoligy they have today they must be ready to build some nice high rev atmo s.

Wtcc engine is 2.0 liter and they get about 280hp out of it. So a 2.5 street version what would that bring us.


I rather have a 290hp 4 banger without turbo than 320hp 4cil with turbo.

My favorite engine would be this

first 4 cil atmo with 290hp or more
second 6 cil engine from the 130i with m throttle bodies and get about 320hp out of it.



Building the nicest atmo engine it the world has always been a reason why i buy M models in the first place. No easy turbo power. Bmw is one of the best engine builders in the world and they have proven that with the m3 engine.

 

[Imhotep Evil]

No turbo please.

Turbo s belong on 4wd jap tin rally boxes not on bmw.

Than, what is this ?!

[image no longer available]

The M2 should not get a turbo.

On that I agree.

 

[AdvEvo]

Ok let me point out otherwise.

230i ---> 265pk 3.0 6 cil like in the 130i.

220si ----> inline 4 turbo with 300 hp. Non M

M2 ---> 3.0 6cil with ca. 320 hp or more. A car more focussed for track and ring driving. M2 CSL would be awesome.

With the new 3 series going more upmarket The new 3 series coupe is more like GT car. The M2 wil be a worthy successor of the E30 M3. With M2 CSL with carbon airbox and racing style seats on top of the line with a hp increase and gives about 340 hp out the 3.0 six banger. If only my dreams would come thru.

lol

 

[klier]

I remember reading an Auto Motor und Sport many years ago (5 or 6), and the main story was the revival of the 2002tii. They even had drawings and stuff).

It has been in the pipeline for some time already, so it's good to hear from it again. Thanks Eni.

 

[AdvEvo]

So are they using the z4 coupe chassis to make the 2 series coupe.

e86 is z4coupe.

 

[EnI]

So are they using the z4 coupe chassis to make the 2 series coupe.

e86 is z4coupe.

According to the info I have Z4 Coupe is still coded E85.

E86 is 2er cabrio, E89 2er coupe. While E87 is 1er hatch.

 

[Matt]

No turbo please.

Turbo s belong on 4wd jap tin rally boxes not on bmw.

I hope they reconsider.

The M2 should not get a turbo.

M2 ---> ca. 300 hp
M3 ---> ca. 400 hp
M5 ---> ca. 500 hp
M6 ---> ca. 500 hp

Would be plane stupid if we see a turbo in there.

Turbo charging is the best way of forced induction and frankly I've been waiting for BMW to drop that N/A bull and start making some cars with torque for christ sakes....

 

[AdvEvo]

I have driven a 996 GT3 and 996 turbo and engine wise i can tell you without a doubt the GT3 engine is a piece of art. Not one hair on my head was thinking of buying a Turbo. new 6cil boxer gt3 atmo with 415 hp now that is piece of art. I wish i could afford one.

Turbo and compressor engines are there to win the power wars.

Bmw is looking to much into horse power wars. a pity if you ask me. They could rather go look into lighten the cars. And build CSL like cars that s how a m3 should be in the first place. A car don t need v8 or v10 engine if they keep the weight down. All cars above 1400kg brings nothing special in driving dynamics. Even 1400kg is on the heavy side.