German Car Forum

Damn! I knew tuned 135s were fast, but running with a bull is insane.

This gives me an idea...


Then again... I'm going to lease mine, sa an ECU upgrade is probably not a good idea.

Great to see the 135 being faster than a Gallardo!!! Incredible. Of course it will have more torque thanks to the turbo's. Any indea about the specs on this 135?
Great movie

390-400HP (Stage 0)
400-410HP (Stage 1)
410-430HP (Stage 2) <--- in development

there is a god !!! 430 HP in a 1 series coupé ....
That must be to !!!!!

Siiiick!

hahaha YES! anyone still doubt that the engine from the 135i is one of the most potent engines in the world.

mark my words, when they start putting bigger turbos and what not... these are gonna hot commodities.

power to weight figures Siko?

The lambo has 500 bulls and 490 torque under the hood.
but weight is a total of 1430.

The 125i is a fabolus car no doubt but stock vs stock ... = Bull wins!

unless the 135i is making 400 REARWHEEL hp, then the video is complete BS.

keep in mind this is a 2004 Gallardo. Gallardo's before 2006 had different gearing. most importantly, first gear went to 105 km/h and second went to 150km/h.

starting a 50 km/h race in 2nd gear? this is a normally aspirated high revving V10 we have here. revs are essencial for power in this car. 35 mph in 2nd gear would have put the Gallardo at around 3000-3500 rpm to start. that 135i could beat an Enzo and win if the enzo started in like 3rd!

truth is, they guy is promoting a product he's selling. nothing more.

I have seen tuned 335i being close to a M6 up to 170km/h and a M6 is faster than 500 hp Gallardo ,then this video isnt impossible.

again, unless the bimmer is making 400 rwhp, its not gonna even be close. I know this engine is very mod friendly, but to say "tuned" isnt enough. tuned by HOW MUCH?

but irrelevant of how much power the 135i is making (which I suspect is 400ish CRANK hp), the Gallardo should have done A LOT better than it did in the video. starting at 50 km/h in a gear that will go to 150 km/h with the revs likely being at about 3000 (in an engine that goes over 8000), is absurd.

then its making 400 rwhp becusase this 135i is fast as the Gallardo. End of story!
Like I said , I seen tuned 335i following a M6 up to high speeds. So if a 335i can keep up with a M6 then a 135i can keep up with a 500 hp Gallardo.

+200km/h both M6 and Gallardo will be faster than a tuned 135i but below 200km/h a tuned 135i can keep up with a Gallardo and a M6.

and if this was a LP560 then of course the Gallardo would beat a 135i but "old" Gallardo will have trouble with a tuned 135i if the speed is staying below 200km/h.

PS The owner of the Gallardo is the guy behind the tuning company Vishnu.

WHAT? so you are basically telling me that starting in SECOND gear at 50 km/h even though FIRST goes to 105, was a basis for a PROPER race?

PS the owner of the Gallardo gains nothing by having the G win. but gets business by having the 135i win.

like I said, I seen tuned 335i keep up with M6 and if they can do that, a 135i can keep up with a Gallardo. Nothing strange about it and I gladly pick a Gallardo over a 135i even if a tuned one can keep up with me.

Wowww, this evil-heart compact hugs the road like Porsche ...!

tuned WITH WHAT?

Vishnu/procede

so it had ECU and exhaust and it was keeping up with an M6?

nonsense as well.

there is NO WAY, a 400 hp 135i is keeping up with a 500 hp Gallardo. again, have that same race take place and the Gallardo driver in the RIGHT gear, and it will be night and day to what you observe.

Read on Vishnu webpage instead of guessing to know whats been done.

Its not nonsense, I seen it with my own eyes. I said the same as you, that its impossible. But after seeing it with my own eyes I'm a believer.
Those tuned 335i are having +400hp and lots of torque.

400 hp is NOT ENOUGH. I bet the M6 probably started in the wrong gear as well

the Gallardo driver keeps saying the results were the same no matter the gear are you KIDDING ME? so starting a 50km/h race in 1st which goes to 105 yielded an equivalent result to starting in 2nd which goes to 150?

again, this guy is SELLING a product.

im not guessing on whats been done. Ive read it. ECU and exhaust mods. unless that gets the hp to 500+, the results of this race can be followed right to the driver's lack of knowledge... or whatever it is that leads people to race in the wrong gear


WHATEVER you see in that video right there (whether the 135 has 300, 400 or 500 hp) can be improved upon DRAMATICALLY by the Gallardo.

Nope ,no wrong gears. It was from one of those M5board.com events.

those videos are also limited by their drivers. they just recently posted a race between a G spyder and an M6 with the Gallardo in the wrong gear too. they have had races where the drivers have missed gears, and races where either something was wrong with the car, or the driver was HORRIBLE.

again, even if we take the 135i out of that video and imagine it was a timed run, the Gallardo would have done LEAGUES better had it been in 1st gear.

Wow you guys are really going for it aren't you
Ok let's look at it in a different way:

The 135i Vishnu tuned:

410 PS
500 NM
1560 kg

The gallardo:

500 PS
510 NM
1430 kg

When you are talking about acceleration from a certain speed (as they do in the above movie) the three things that matter most are torque, weight and gear ratios. Horsepower is only important when talking about high speeds.
If lambornimo says that the gallardo goes up to 105 km/u in first gear and up to 150 in second gear, this would mean it has gear ratios that are rather long.
Torque figure on both cars is about the same, (the torque on the 135 is a guess as I couldn't find it but the standard one has 400 Nm and 306 PS, this one has 410 PS so the torque raise will have about the same ratio, but the max HP might be at higher RPM (you know that torque x RPM = power) so this will not be to far off).

Conclusion: The Gallardo is lighter so that will give it an advantage, but the gear ratio is longer (specially when starting in second gear) which will be a disadvantage. The torque curve of the 135 is rather flat (thanks to the turbo's) so that gives the 135i an advantage, as the Gallardo will have less torque at lower RPM than the 135.

Add all these thing together and the result will be that a gallardo in first gear might be somewhat quicker than the 135 (but we are not talking about seconds here). If the gallardo starts in 2nd gear it will be slower than the 135 as you can see in the movie, and again this is just thents of seconds. Remember if you drive at 100 km/u 0.1 s is a car length (3.3 m).

My conclusion the driver in the video is not cheating at all. I can however imagine that it is painfull for a Lambo fan to see a tuned 135i keep up and even being faster then the gallardo (in a straight line that is, we're not talking about track times here).

I hope this was helpful.

the earlier Gallardo gearing is long, but only really slows the car down when taking off at a street start without a powerlaunch. other than that, the gearing isnt too long for the power the car has.

keep in mind that a Gallardo puts about 400 hp to the ground. thats more than that 135i is making at the crank.

moreover, shorter gears = more shifting, and unless the 135i has the GTR or F430S' gear box, then that will also hurt it.

as you said its all about the torque (and dont forget that you need the power to overcome wind resistance, especilly when going over 90 mph), and when you have a NORMALY aspirated engine that goes to 8000+ rpm, starting a race at about 3000 rpm would leave much to be desired in terms of both power and torque, especially when put up against a turboed engine with a much flatter torque curve. agreed?


that said, I stand by what I said earlier that had the Gallardo started in the correct gear, it would have made a world of difference.

moreover, just to overkill this whole thing here is a video of a 2004 (earlier) Gallardo with the long gearing vs an F430:

YouTube - 04 Lamborghini Gallardo vs. 07 Ferrari F430

dont look at the result (very equal competitors), what I want to point out is the SOUND. the Gallardo is at the right revs and its LOUD. in the 135i video you dont even hear the Gallardo until its about to go into 3rd (by which time the 135i has already shifted twice).