German Car Forum

It’s been a long-standing tradition that true sports cars are equipped with manual transmissions, putting the driver in full control and enabling him to extract the utmost from his machine. Things have changed: Computers can simulate logic, and machines can manipulate things more accurately and quickly than humans. Clutch pedals and stick shifts are giving way to buttons and paddles. Increasingly, the automobile is becoming less and less in our control — anti-lock brakes with brake assist and force distribution, yaw and traction control, active suspension, electric steering with variable ratios, active cruise control — all for the better they say. But lost is the necessity for skills that once made racing drivers famous.
It is no surprise that Porsche’s Tiptronic electronically controlled automatic transmission is good, but it is a surprise to learn that it makes the 2007 911 Turbo quicker down the drag strip. Aside from special applications, the torque converter has always been considered a hindrance. In this case the Tiptronic even has one less gear, being a 5-speed. The 6-speed manual on the face of it should clearly out-drag the two-pedal car. Nay, it does not. Power-braking the Tiptronic loads the turbo and builds boost before the car leaves the line. To build boost in the manual-equipped car would require excessive slipping of the clutch. This delay in building boost gives the advantage to the torque-converter-equipped Tiptronic — the gain being a tenth of a second to 60 mph despite its taller first gear.
The ability of the Tiptronic system to quickly shift gears shaves time the whole length of the strip — pulling out two more tenths. This is because the turbo stays under load while the Tiptronic shifts — keeping the 480 bhp at work pushing the car. In contrast, the manual is given pause three times in the quarter- mile as the driver changes gears.
Aside from transmissions, the two cars we tested were identical. The red one is the Tiptronic. The Tiptronic’s shifts are not made with a conventional paddle system. Instead, Porsche opted for rocker-type switches on both left and right sides of the steering wheel, located directly under the thumbs. The rocker switches allow up- and downshifting with either hand.
We know the automatic car is faster, but we still don’t like it. We continue to prefer the traditional method of making a car go fast and hope the art of driving isn’t lost.

Source: http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=4052

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Needs more power-torque and a fancy gearbox.

I must admit i'm a bit surprised with their review... Usually, they say the best about Porsches, but here...:

I do appreciate they don't like too many electronics found in the new Turbo, but according to them, Porsche lost the best of itself - driving fun.

This is what every review said in one way or another.
Why is it a surprise to you ?!

Read my post and you'll have your answer!!!

Here, Car and Driver thinks the same...

http://www.caranddriver.com/shortroa...tiptronic.html

Again why is this a surprise ?!

Dude, you're getting on my nerves, honestly. I've told you, read my post!

It has been going this way for quite some time now. The GT3 is and has become what the turbo used to be.

I belive that the GT2 is what the Turbo used to be.

I've talked about this on several forums, and old Porsche fans/owners/racers/magazine editorialists have been complaing about every Porsche since the 993 was replaced (or 964 Turbo).

Hell some don't even consider the 993 Turbo since its AWD.

But the GT3 is more fun to drive then ever and no magazine has said anything negative about it.

Thanks for the post

It is true, the 911 isn't exactly the scary beast it once was. Especially when you look back on the older models, like the 993 GT2. I remember magazine being scared of this car: the lack of traction, the uneven weight distribution and the abrupt power shooting through 1300kg of body was enough to make anybody scared. Of course the 911 did evolve into something more usable with the 996 model, in fact the only model i recall being called scary was the GT2. In the United States this bear gained the repuation of being called the widow maker. Fantastic car

The 997 model has evolved the 911 into the most usable 911 yet. It's true the 997 Turbo isn't as exciting as the older models, but i think we'd all agree it's still a great car. Anyways i'd rather have the GT3

But that's the problem. Evolving twards usable.

For purist Porsche = involving life treathing sado-masochist horror and pleasure inducing Uber-Bettle.

So no AWD, no automatics, no water cooled engines, no electro-nannies.
Just pain-horror and pleasure-involvment, no usability needed.

Times have changed since the 70s and 80s when sitting in a lamborghini was like sitting inside a shopping cart and when cars were brutal and noisy as the concord. These days cars have to meet with thousands of regulations and saftey is more important then ever.
Despite that Porsche still tries to offer Porsche purists proper Porsche cars like the GT3, GT2 and GT3 RS.

Yes I know all that. But what atracted uber-fans/super-loyal-customers to such cars was their lack of safety.

When you drove a 356, you felt a cold chill that turn horror if there was wind blowing and there was curve coming. Anything else the 100%+ involvment could mean not just loosing the perfect trase, but your life too. A Porsche demanded comitment, a special learning curve, and a worthy-ness. You didn't just get the keys and drive a Porsche.

And it now looks that even the GT3 are now loosing the plot.

I agree that successive generations of the 911 have become more user friendly, and the "hardcore" factor becomes somewhat diminished in the regular 911's. However, it allows more amateur drivers such as myself to experience intense driving pleasure on curvy switchbacks.

In a way its good because more people will see it as a usable car, so more sales, but that hard core purist factor is gone. It used to be a 911 C2 was all you ever really needed. If you were to buy the Carrera, just not the Carrera4, its like you can barely afford a Porsche and you might as well buy a Cayman. If you want a hardcore model, the GT3 and GT2 is where its at.

I still think you can get immense driving pleasure out the 911's, but its not as easy as it used to be.

Maybe, a stripped out GT3-RS-ish type of car, but with the base 3.8 engine might appeal to the purists better. Why make the hardcore variant so exclusive and expensive? I doubt they'd sell that many, just a thought.

If modern Porsches are still like that - rough, brutal and maniacally insane - you wouldn't be seeing the most profitable sports car manufacturer here today making that kind of dough.

Porsche's strategy for making their cars more accessible and easier to drive has been running for 3 decades now. It just so happens that this trend is pervasive throughout the industry across all makers.

Let's face it. In the past there were two types of sports car owners: those that had had a big crash and those that were going to. It's all different now - cars are becoming safer and less unruly and this is simply a natural progression of continuous improvement. The 911 Turbo is no longer a raw, bare bones monster (I've driven a psycho 930 turbo with a four speed manual and a clutch that wouldn't be out of place in a Gym club - scary) that it once was. It's fast, useable on the road and safe (in relative terms) for people with moderate driving ability.

As Porsches go, yes, perhaps the 911 Turbo is less engaging and less "feelsome" than its forebears. But then, that could be said of any modern car out there today.

Oh, and if the GT3 is too soft for you then there's always the GT3 RS - and that's more hardcore than anything else in mainstream production.