German Car Forum

Hot on the heels of reports, brought to you by British car site PistonHeads upon their visit to the Nissan's Ring-side test facility, of updates planned for the current R35-generation Nissan GT-R comes another report detailing the Japanese automaker's plans for the next-generation R36 model.

With competitors lining up to challenge the current GT-R's performance benchmark, Nissan's senior veep for global product planning, Andy Palmer, confirmed that plans are underway to succeed Godzilla with a next-generation model. The R36 will, according to the report, carry over the current model's twin-turbo V6, but with enough modifications to keep it ahead of the pack. The new GT-R is expected to hit the road by 2013 at the latest. Beyond that, Palmer didn't disclose many details, except to say that Nissan is committed to the GT-R program and won't be letting the Porsche 911 GT2 alone without a fight.

- REPORT: Next-gen Nissan GT-R in the works for 2013 — Autoblog

Nissan, alike all of us, are expecting serious offerings from Porsche in the 998.

Porsche got caught with their pants down last time... and I'm sure it will not happen again.

Competition, what a wonderful catalyst for improvement and progress.

I am sure Porsche will fire back!

Yes and hopefully through their cars and not stupid media statements.

I reckon they can build a killer car just by taking 150kg to 200kg out of it, and keep everything the same.

True, I think the current engine and drivetrain just need to be tweaked to deliver better performance and what not. Again, economy and emissions are the main issue. Squeezing more power from the engine is not difficult.

To take 150-200kg out of the car will require a new platform.

The last GT-R engine was used for 13 years...

Don't underestimate Nissan. They have already shown that they are serious, and they have the Tech to back it up.

I'm not doubting Porsche, but don't write off the R-35 as a coincidence. Engineering is not based on coincidences but hard numbers.

The current Porsche 911 GT2 has more than upheld Porsche's honour in this enthralling GT-R-takes-on-the-world story. It's even stevens now - but I suspect that 997.2 GT2 is going to edge ahead slightly.

Severly underrated and regularly overlooked is the GT2.

I don't think Nissan ever intended for it to take on the GT2. It so dominated the turbo, magazines had to look to GT2 (which is more than twice as expensive as a GTR here in US) to offer some credible competition to the GTR which of course it did.

What I really want to know is how the 997 Turbo mk2 with PDK will compare. I am sure it will be faster in a straight line, but how about around a track?

Yes, it would be very interesting to see how much the 997.2 Turbo have improved... I guess we will have to wait for the spring to find out.

Sure, I agree Sunny - but we all know that as soon as price is factored in to any debate then the GT-R is practically unbeatable. All I'm saying is that it's not like Porsche haven't got an answer to the GT-R. They do. Yes, it costs double - and so it should because it is a GT2 after all. Bang for buck everyone knows the GT-R is the giant slayer - no question.

But it's not like Porsche are running around with their tail between their legs.

The GT2 is overlooked... hell, a 200.000€ sportscar that revs lower than my wristwatch (lol) and costs double a GTR that is as fast with way less (official) power...

I think the GT2 is overlooked with a reason.

As much as I love Porsche, the GT2 just can't stand the comparison with similarly priced vehicles. Disappointing engine to say the least, as far as noise or revvs, and it is without mentionning the looks.

You seem to be going slowly mad in Romania?

If we go by the benchmark times of Sport Auto - the GT2 is much faster than a GT-R. Oh, and it sounds fanstastic too (the GT2 that is).

That is exactly Porsche's problem. Porsche is now a sportscar company and not a supercar company such as Ferrari or Lamborghini.

The ubiquitous flat-six engine found in all 911's just doesn't cut it in the supercar league. Porsche's absence from the supercar market (355, 360 Modena) since the 1990's meant Ferrari had the whole market to itself until Lamborghini's re-emergence in the 2000's. By Porsche's absnece, I mean, the 911's in the 1980's were a match for the Ferrari's such as the 308, 328, and the Mondial, but Ferrari made a big step up after Luca di Montezemolo took the helm in the early 1990's.

Porsche will have to come up with something really special in order to compete against the 450 Italia and the LP560-4.

On the other hand, the cheapest Ferraris and Lamborghinis cost as much as the most expensive Porsches.

True, but the GT2 costs as much as a F430, at least in Hong Kong.

At that price, would you want to be seen in a Ferrari or Porsche?

I know Porsches are much more reliable. But the GT2 is no less easy to drive than a F430.

I love Romania!!!

I don't love the GT2. It is my least favourite 911. Just too expensive for what it is, I find.
And I can't get over that 2.500rpm redline and vacuum cleaner noise. Not against a Lambo or Ferrari.

Gimme a GT3, now that is one devilish machine, possibly the best sportcar today. Fantastic.

The GT2 is, for me, not more than a slightly tuned Turbo. And I consider it is not enough for the price asked.
While the GT3, besides being quite a bargain for what it offers, is way more than a glorified Carrera S.

Interesting discussion on the viability and justifiability of the GT2 in an increasingly mid-engined dominated supercar world. May I draw your attention to the following test data (thanks DeDe):

997 GT2:



ZR1:



I don't have the scans for the GT-R but if you look in the comparison tables you'll get the idea. The GT2 more than holds its own in the performance stakes and, frankly, puts some astounding numbers down in this, most detailed and objective of evaluations.

I hope the Porsche are able to sort a DCT transmission that'll handle the 700 Nm demands of the 997.2 GT2. That will make for some interesting numbers because, in its guise here the GT2 is a manual. With a clutch. That needs quads the size of an Olympic speed skater to operate! [Have any of you ever felt it? I laughed!]

When viewed against the more exotic mid-engined genre, the GT2 does seem a little plain, a little retro. But this is the 911 recipe and it's a recipe that, despite all the "polar moment of inertia experts'" naysaying, works.

A 911 doesn't need to be anything other than a 911. It is what it is because there's nothing else like it. And so, it remains the best selling sports/supercar type on the market.

It's like Rolex. Sure, there are there Breitling's and Panerai's and whatever other ridiculously expensive one-off Swiss makes of this world but when it comes to going to the top of the Himalayas or the bottom of the ocean, the South Pole or the Sahara - there's only one Rolex Oyster.

As Sunny pointed out, that is the sad part Martin. To discredit the GT-R people are looking at cars that Nissan was never aiming at. They have said time and time again that the GT-R is Turbo's competitor but it's just so damn fast that people who can't accept it turn to a hard-core stripped out racer aka GT2 and say "see, it can't beat a porsche." Let's compare apples and apples, so GT-R to Turbo, no need to bring in GT-2 or even a GT-3.

Interesting, but I doubt a totally new car will debut in just over 3 years. This will be more like the 350Z to 370Z transformation, which could be called a facelift on one hand, but it goes beyond that. Can't wait to see what they have in store.

M

The development and launch of the current R35 Nissan GT-R was an epic achievement for the Japanese automaker. After all, Nissan was able design and engineer a sports car capable of outperforming exotic supercars with pricetags twice as high, as well as make it seat four adults in relative comfort and be easy to drive everyday.

A series of planned updates of the car should allow the GT-R to remain supreme for some time to come, and this will reportedly include the introduction of a brand new model around 2013. At a special event at Nissan’s Nurburgring Technical Centre last week, Nissan’s vice president of global product planning, Andy Palmer, reaffirmed Nissan’s commitment to the GT-R project.

Palmer also confirmed that a model replacement program for the GT-R was still in place despite the economic downturn. He explained that Nissan is planning to mimic the timescale used by Porsche for its 911 GT-2, which means a model life cycle of around five to six years.

Palmer said the R36 GT-R would be more of an evolution of the current model’s platform rather than a completely new car like the R35. This means that a twin-turbocharged V-6 powertrain will remain, as will the current rear transaxle configuration. This fits with Nissan’s plan to continuously improve on the GT-R to ensure the car remains competitive.

- Report: Nissan Exec Confirms R36 Replacement For GT-R - MotorAuthority

Unlike few others here, I do think GT2 is a fantastic car. And 'the' choice between cars it competes with - Scuderia, LP560, ZR1 etc if lapping the ring is your primary concern.

But I also think Porsche doesn't get a free ride just cause GT2 is faster than the GTR. The GTR defnitely caught them with the pants down and the fact that there is a 997 Turbo mk2 is testimony to that when they never bothered to update 996 nor 993 (just power packages and Turbo S versions for way more mullah).