German Car Forum

What do you mean closing the gap? Perhaps in many countries like US , S class will be the best seller but still in other countries like Germany the battle is fierce and A8 and 7 series are definitely closing the gap the past few years. With this rate it won't be long before 7 series pass worldwide S class in sales.

S class is somehow the victim of it's own success. People are tired of having the same car with a lot of others and want something less common. Since S class has become a common sight in most countries many will opt for Audi or BMW just to be different.

The GAP = Things like the fact that the old S-class sold more worldwide than A8 7er and Jaguar combined.. thats the gap im talking about.. i dont care about markets..i want the whole world.. thats what counts..

Sorry Yannis but that it totally BS. Just like the BMW 3er the S class is a best seller and many people don't care about the fact that the car is kind of common. As long as the car is better than the competitors people will still buy it. Yes the S-class is more expensive than the A8 but it offers much more comfort and technical features.

Clearly he won't be saying that if Audi managed to outsell the E and S with their A6 and A8 models!

A car like the S-Class being that popular only makes people continue to want one, especially when a new design appears. There is a rush to be the first to own one.

M

such as?

Distance-tronic, night vision and presafe jus to name a few.

night vision is not standard?

i guess, but audi has stuff that mb doesn't have:
-fingerprint recognition (in certain countries)
- LED daytime running lights with 5-pointed star-type lighting elements
- Front and rear Audi Parking System with graphic display
-Solar sunroof
-Light/Rain sensors (rain sensors are nothing new, but i don't think mb has light sensors yet)
-Distronic is nothing new. Audi's is called ACC (adaptive cruise control)

..i might be wrong with mb not having some of the above because i'm not all that familier with the s yet so feel free to correct me. and as for night vision and presafe, audi can't be that far behind, bmw and lexus have already incorporated that into their line ups.

and one more thing mb can't and won't have. the engine of a Lambo

You're right! Merc will have a newer, lighter, more powerful, less temperamental V8.

yes, and the RS8 will have something even better i'm sure. there's always going to be something better in generations to come. thanks for pointing out the obvious.

Are you sure? Because you would look really stupid if the RS8 doesn't even see the light of day.

whatever then. even if the RS8 doesn't see light of day, there will always be soemthing better in the future. thats the point i was trying to get across to you. and as for looking stupid on a car forum, i could care less.

Mercedes has had most of those features for years. Why would you say that they don't and then say that you might be wrong.

I know Audi is definitely the first with the LED running lights, not sure of the benefits of fingerprint recognition other than some crazy's might cut your finger off. parktronic has been out for years and it has a visual display. They now have introduced cameras as well on the S. They pioneered distronic well before anyone else. They have the solar sunroof on the E-class. Light and rain sensors have been on mercedes for more than 7 years.

So how big is this list of things that Audi has that Mercedes doesn't? In many cases Mercedes implemented them well before Audi. Despite quality problems etc. etc. they are still a technological force.

About the test, I think objective analysis is featured far too heavily in these German comparisons. At this level the value proposition extends well beyond a price/feature trade off. Incremental technical innovations, brand etc. all add to the price, but conversely they also add to the overall experience of purchasing and owning the car! An S-class is an S-class, despite the lower price of the Audi, I'm sure theres no doubt in millions of peoples minds which is the better car overall.

So the Audi is the better handler aye? Well I have no doubt the Mercedes will WALLOP it for ride quality. The Audi is fine for super smooth European roads, but in countries like OZ, the ride qaulity of Audis, the A8 included, has been deemed completely unacceptable for the luxury cars they are.

meh, typical mb fan. if mb doens't have it, its no good. whatever though. my original intention (if you scroll up a bit) was to ask luwalira to provide some evidence because i don't know the new s all the well yet (like i previousy mentioned). i was curious if in fact the new s was all that much more superior than the A8. and whats with the who had what first argument? i dont' think thats what the conversation was about. it was about the s having more tech goods than the A8.

your question "how big is this list of things that Audi has that Mercedes doesn't?" is the same as mine. thats why i asked for evidence.

I simply replied to the list of technologies. Also about the fingerprint thing, I've read several stories about peoples fingers getting chopped off for a car. I dread what some phsychos will do to steal a car when they introduce retna scans like in the movies.

Also In canada do you have to drive with lights on during the day? Can somone please explain these LED lights to me, Im not familiar with their application. Is it because of weather conditions? Yes I am genuinely curios about them. Not being a typical MB fan and knocking them.

are you talking about the string of lights as the visual they've had for years? because i'm talking about an on screen thing where it shows the distance to the object.

yes, in canada day time running lights are required. and as for the LED lights, i saw a video in german about them, but since i don't speak german i too have no idea what they do.

Yeah I am. So does the audi have a front mounted camera as well as one at the rear?

more info on the benefits of the fingerprint recognition:
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articl...82/ai_94335254

i'll try and find the mmi screen shot during parking for you. it should explain how it works.

Sorry to divert the discussion here... but those three points are quite interesting.
We've got an "ALL NEW Generation" S-class here....and a cosmetically enhanced (with a few mechanical enhancements) BMW 7 series....and yet they receive the same score for "Comfort ride" ...as well as for "Brakes" and "Interior quality".

I know this is just one test..and comfort and interior quality can be fairly subjective topics...but how does an all-new S-class not outclass a car which is 5 years older than it (ie: 7er) ??

I think this is going to be the general trend now for the S-class. Unlike the W220 which raised the bar for uber-luxury sedans, the new S hasn't done that to the same extent. I don't think it's more of a MB failure...but rather that this segment can't be enhanced too much otherwise the cars will end up in the Bentley Flying Spur price range. So it's more like MB have reached a temporary ceiling in this segment where they can't improve at the same rate as the W220 S-class did.

That's just my take on things... what do you guys reckon ?

I'd totally agree with you Beemer boi. In this class range, there is a limit. These are the top of the range German cars and they are things of legends. They display a brands muscle in terms of technology and performance. There's only so much that a car company can improve when the bar is already so high.

On the other category, (a4, C and 3er) the bar can still be raised.

I agree as well. Good point

You said it by yourself! I dont think MB and BMW has the same interior quality, Ive eyes, I can see!

Please dont speak like its some kind of fact. Its all subjective. Period